Need to help with PSU and CPU cooler

[vilo999]

Hello, i am new to theese forums. While reading my post, you should know that i am not an english person, therefore the post is sometimes almost-unreadable. But please take some piece of your time and read it. If you dont understand something in my posts, ask me and i will try to explain it. On many other forums i have seen people not replying or in better case replying to half-of post.

So i have buyed an new PC. It consists of:
ASUS P5P800
intel p4 prescott lga775 3.2ghz CPU
1gb of memory(2x 512MB apacer cl 2.5 400 mhz - running in dual channel mode)
MSI geforce fx 5900xt 128mb
2 hdds-ultra ata
2 cdroms-ultra ata
wireless lan card
sound blaster live 5.1
Mercury 400watt psu
zalman 7000B-Cu with reduction to socket LGA775

Now problem:
First time i started the pc and installed windows, i turned on the Q-fan technology. The cpu was hot, so the fan increased to 4500RPM. That was a VERY loud noise.

So i have decided to buy an zalman 7000B-Cu as mentoined before. I installed the reduction, applied the thermal compound, and installed the fan. I turned the fan-mate2 to let the fan spin on maximal RPM(it now have 2400RPM).

BUT - the fan is cooling WORSE than the boxed one. The temperature easily jumps to 68°C with prime 95. Then the CPU throttling starts to appear. There are two possible reasons that i see:

1)the reduction package ZALMAN ZM-CS1 came with 11 screws as stated on the page of reduction:
2. Nine Clip Support installation bolts
3. Two Cooler installation bolts

I may have wrongly installed the clip support and therefore the fan too, but i cant just figure WHERE is the nineth bolt to be. Even if you watch "how to install" zalman video, they use ONLY 10 screws as i. Four from below the motherboard side, four from upside the motherboard. ONE STILL LEFTS. Is it an reserve bolt or am i forgetting something? Btw i have 54°C right now typing this post. Thats at MAXIMUM RPM. Strange, not? The cooler is supposed to cool better than this i think.


2)The cooler cools so bad because of crappy mercury psu. It is very hot when it operates.

So your advece please:
Should i RETURN the zalman7000b-cu to shop, buy an new one(another CPU cooler) AND buy an new(better, colder) PSU?
-OR-
Should i RETURN the zalman7000b-cu, keep an boxed one, AND buy an new more quality(colder) PSU?
-OR-
Should i KEEP the cooler AND buy an new(colder) PSU and try my luck that it will(zalman7000b-cu) cool better?

I must buy an new psu for sure, because of this:
The PSU is ugly in power. My PC keeps freezing randomly. My hard disks restarts WHILE the pc is running. More: I am running windows and doing something. Suddenly i will hear an "click" and the disk will start spinning again. Then when i try to read something from just-restarted disk, the machine will freeze.

Other PSU problem: VCORE. Normally, when no load, the vcore is 1.408V. When i play 7 videoclips simulateously and prime 95 tortue test, the vcore will drop to 1.328V. Isnt that much drop?

Finally in this post, some PSU-related questions.

My motherboard comes with an 24-pin connector EATXPWR and an ATX12V connector(no problem with this one).
My PSU has an 20-pin connector. So the questions:
Whats the difference between 20-pin and 24-pin connector?

Do i NEED an 24-pin connector for better stable system?

Reduction from 20 to 24. I heard that i can BURN some non-quality psus(like my mercury) with it. Then it must have an side effect. So WHAT is that side effect? Why must i have an quality PSU to use the reduction?

Some psus like the one i would like to buy have something like 20+4P connector(link). Is this EXACTLY the same as the pure 24-pin connector?

One last power-related question:
The zalman has an 3-pin plug. The motherboard has an 4-pin plug. I plugged it in. Is this ok and cant this be also the cause of poor cooling results?

Please be so kind and reply. This is time-expensive. I need to know what to do with the zalman cooler. I have 2 days left before the "give cooler back and we will give you money back" offer expires.

Forwardly THANK YOU!!

 

[vilo999]

Co me on somebody please!! Only one day left i really need it!! PLEASE!

 

[The J]

For the Zalman 7000, try removing the cooler. Find some rubbing alcohol and use it to clean the surface of the CPU and the bottom of the Zalman heatsink. After that, try reapplying a THIN layer of thermal grease to the top of the processor. You want the layer to be just thick enough to cover the top of the CPU. Reinstall the cooler and see if things get better.

As for your power supply, be sure to not just exchange that power supply for a similar model. Also note that the wattage number printed on the power supply really does not mean much. A quality 350W power supply will do better than the 400W one you have now. Hopefully, someone else here can recommend a good power supply for you as I am no expert there. That 20+4P connector you linked to is the same as a normal 24-pin one. The 20+4P one can come apart so that it will work in mothboards that do not have 24-pin plugs.

I don't know if I answered all of your questions so feel free to ask more if I missed something. Someone should be able to help you.

 

[vilo999]

Thanks for reply, i have removed, cleaned and again installed the cooler. I have made a couple of photos during install:

The cooler plug.
Cant this be the problem(4-pin connector on the board and 3-pin on the fan)?

Cleaned the cpu and heatsink...

Thermal grease at CPU(photo 1, photo 2). Before putting on the heatsink.
Did i again put too much in there?

Thermal grease at CPU(after putting the cooler on and applying a little force on top of it to make the grease wider, and again removing the cooler for photo)

Thermal grease that sticked to heatsink after applying some force.

Putted the cooler back on cpu, and tighten the bolts while applying force on top of cooler to make the grease even wider...

Done

So, is the heatsink now installed properly? I think yes.

But it is NOT cooling any better...i don't under stand this. I've seen a lot of tests with zalman 7000B-Cu and it performed excellent, that's why i bought it. Maybe theere is a problem with the 3-pin zalman plug, maybe the motherboard is showing bad RPM due of this and the fan is spinning slow due to lack of power from the 4th pin... i dont know. Anyway the temp with prime95 is 68°C... Should i refund the cooler?

That 20+4P connector you linked to is the same as a normal 24-pin one. The 20+4P one can come apart so that it will work in mothboards that do not have 24-pin plugs.

Thats great news, i would like to buy the following PSU:
Coolergiant VHB Series ATX12V Ver2.0 - Regular(P Series), the 430W version. What are the dual 12V rails? What is the output ampers? 12V/???A? There are multiple values at the chart on that page. Thanks.

 

[Zucarita9000]

I have a socket 478 3GHz Prescott along with a Zalman 7000B Al-Cu and Artic Silver 5. Idle temps are in the low 40s (around 43-45). Under load it doesn't go higher than 56º, depending on room temperature (it's kinda hot right now).

I'm running at 47ºC with fan speed of 2200rpm right now. I'm not using the Fan Mate controller, I just installed the fan to the motherboard and let Asus's Q-Fan to adjust fan speed according to CPU load. It's completely silent, even at 2500rpm!

Oh!, and mi PSU fan is usually below 1000rpm. It's not even warm either.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

What is the temperature in the room the computer is in? Do you have good case cooling? The cooler can only do so much if the supply air is hot. Hot supply air also effects the power supply negatively so ensuring supply air is as cool as possible is important.

As to a new Power Supply, the FMA looks a winner since it seems Enermax is the weapon of choice where you are.

 

[Algere]

Originally posted by: vilo999
Thats great news, i would like to buy the following PSU:
Coolergiant VHB Series ATX12V Ver2.0 - Regular(P Series), the 430W version. What are the dual 12V rails? What is the output ampers? 12V/???A? There are multiple values at the chart on that page. Thanks.

Dual rails (instead of a more powerful single rail) are there for stability. Should one rail get overloaded e.g., the other isn't affected.

According to the Noisetaker manual...

+12V 1 powers
PCIe
Floppy
4 pin peripheral (hard drive & related)

+12V 2 powers
12V 4 pin processor
20+4 pin main power
SATA


Copy/Paste from another thread

I just got a second email back from Enermax Taiwan...I am sort of pissed.. my Coolergiant is going up for sale and I am going to get a 480 watt or 600 watt Noisetaker.

Below are my emails...basically what she is saying is that the newer Noisetaker series (and several other newer models that are not available yet) have something call a "combined power" rating.

For example the 480 watt Noisetaker has an 18A 12V1 and an 18A 12V2 but a combined rating of 32A,
the 600 watt Noisetaker has the same 12V rails but a combined rating of 36A*.
So on the 480 watt model if you were using 18A on 12V1 youd have 14A left for 12V2 and on the 600 watt model you have an actual 18A available on each rail.

On my Coolergiant I have 16A on 12V1 period....it cannot share borrow a few amps off of 12V2 regardless of what happens.

While 16A is probably more than enough id sleep easier at night if my PSU could share a few amps between the 12V rails.

Really this is the model id like because its probably going to be cheap and its almost as powerful as the 600 watt Noisetaker...
http://www.enermax.com.tw/prod...amp;Gid=18&Gid2=25








>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hello, I have this PSU and it has a 16A 12V1 and a 15A 12V2 , there is no spec listed for the combined 12V1 and 12V2 on my PSU ..do you know what that spec is?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Referring to your question, the power supply you have on hand do not have combine power limit of +12V, which means you could use 16A on 12V1 and 15A on 12V2.

Combine power means you can use 32A when +12V1&+12V2 together, not 36A when +12V1&+12V2 together. However, combine power is more flexibly for some users because some users like to use 18A on +12V1, and they only need 12A on +12V2. Users can use combine power which is unable to exceed 32A.

Finally, shall you have other questions, please feel free to contact us again. Thank you!

Best regards,
Rebecca Ma

>>>>>>>>>

Thank you, I am not sure if I understand what my PSU power ability is...

Can I run 18A on 12V1 and 12A on 12V2 for a combined of 30A . Max of 32A combined?

OR does my PSU require 16A max on 12V1 and 15A on 12V2 at all times?

>>>>>>>>>

Your power supply is 16A max on 12V1 and 15A max on 12V2.

Finally, shall you have other questions, please feel free to contact us again. Thank you!

*Correction on quote : The 600W Noisetaker has 35A on the +12V rails, not 36.

 

[vilo999]

Oh!, and mi PSU fan is usually below 1000rpm. It's not even warm either.

I dont know the rpm of my PSU fan, its not written anywhere and it doesnt have an connector to monitor rpm. But for sure its very hot.

What is the temperature in the room the computer is in? Do you have good case cooling? The cooler can only do so much if the supply air is hot. Hot supply air also effects the power supply negatively so ensuring supply air is as cool as possible is important.

The room temp is 26°C(with pc running for 8 hours) Its a very small room(3x2,5 meters). Anyway the temp is good for me but maybe not good for pc. Is 26°C much?

Case cooling: Down in the front there's a fan that is pulling air from the outside of case to the inside. Up in the rear of case there is a fan that pulls (hot) air from the CPU area to the outside. Simple drawing.

As to a new Power Supply, the FMA looks a winner since it seems Enermax is the weapon of choice where you are.

Unfortunately i am unable to buy that power supply. I cannot shop online, because a) i live in Slovakia, b) i dont have any method to pay to for example newegg, and, c) they do not ship to Slovakia for sure. So, i have to go to shop and pay by cash. In my country there's no shop that i know that sells that power supply.

Sipmly, i can buy only "gold, red, and dark blue" enermax power supplies. That is coolergiant(gold,red) and noisetaker(dark blue). No other models availible. The gold models are PASSIVE PFC and the red are ACTIVE PFC. I would really prefer to buy passive pfc coolergiant(gold) OR noisetaker(dark blue), because i can get them immediately, they have them in stock. For the active coolergiant(red), i have to ship it from Czech Republic(thats already some extra $$$) and i have to wait until they will have some in stock. What do you think? Is active PFC really worth it?

Algere - from your post i understand that coolergiant models(gold) have STABLE 12V rails. Other(noisetaker and some newer) can "borrow" some volts from other rail. Is this big disadvantage of coolergiant? On other forum i heard that minimal 12V is 20A.

According to the Noisetaker manual...
+12V 1 powers
PCIe
Floppy
4 pin peripheral (hard drive & related)

+12V 2 powers
12V 4 pin processor
20+4 pin main power
SATA

The 420W model of noisetaker has 18A on both rails. Isn't this low?

Passive PFC 430W coolergiant has only 15A on 12V1 and only 14A on 12V2.(my possible new psu)
It cannot borrow volts. So only one rail powers the motherboard. Thats 15A. Isnt that poor? My current mercury supply have 17A on 12V(but its also not dual-rail so i dont know)

Active PFC 430W coolergiant has 18A on both rails. So what's true about that 20A minimum?

Thanks.

 

[Algere]

Originally posted by: vilo999
The 420W model of noisetaker has 18A on both rails. Isn't this low?

Passive PFC 430W coolergiant has only 15A on 12V1 and only 14A on 12V2.(my possible new psu)
It cannot borrow volts. So only one rail powers the motherboard. Thats 15A. Isnt that poor? My current mercury supply have 17A on 12V(but its also not dual-rail so i dont know)

Active PFC 430W coolergiant has 18A on both rails. So what's true about that 20A minimum?

Thanks.

If 18A is listed per rail & it's dual railed then it's not low for a 425W PSU IMO under most if not all cases. It's different from single rail 18A. I'd look @ "combined +12V power" (as mentioned above) concerning the total amount of amps. The total +12V is what you're really getting as shown here for example.

Usually when ppl (@ this time) recommend to get so & so amps on the +12V rail. They're more than likely basing the recommendation on single rail amp #'s. Dual rail is pretty much (but not exactly) single rail split in half.

EDIT: Meant 420W PSU

 

[gamerj]

both rails, so its a dual 12 v rails, with 18 amps EACH....well no, thats not low at all...

 

[vilo999]

And what if there's no item combined +12V rails? I cant just sum it... I mean this PSU(i'm so interested in this model because i can get it immediately, it's in stock). That means that the rails cannot be combined in power. Now isn't the 15A on 12V1 that CAN'T be combined not enough? If minimum is 20A...

 

[Algere]

20A minimum if such a min. exist would most likely mean the required/wanted amps for the entire system, not just the MB & CPU which 1 rail of a dual rail configuration is for (under Noisetaker +12V configuration e.g.). So yes you can combine the dual +12V rails in that regard to an extent. OTOH if 20A recommended was for the amps required for just the CPU & MB alone which I highly doubt @ this point in time then you'd be in trouble but AFAIK there aren't any desktop computers needing 20A for just the CPU & MB alone.