AkumaX, if that question was directed at me, no it does not throttle according to Throttle Watch. But regardless, anything over 60C seems too high to me.
Keysplayr
Elite Member
- Jan 16, 2003
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Oh heat from other peripherals? I forgot to mention that there are a total of 5 hard drives in these machines. A single 120 for the OS, and four 400GB drives for data.These drives combined throw out much more heat than any vid card could. My question is, what am I doing that is so "right" that I get these decent temps on all 4 of these PC's? I gotta tell ya, I'm not doing much of anything out of the ordinary to cool them. A better quesion might be, what are the others doing that is so "wrong" that they can't even control the temps despite efforts?
I guess for the current time (Since Prescott/Smithfield) AMD is the overclockers answer of course. They run nice and cool due to their low clocks/High IPC. If you don't overclock, than either will do.
SolMiester
Diamond Member
- Dec 19, 2004
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LOL, these Intel users are very sensitive of heat criticisms with there P D's..dont mention the performance!
They were for a client who is doing heavy video encoding and of course they wanted to go Prescott, so I talked them into a dual-Core setup as it sort of made sense and was a minor change to the specs my coworker had made up.
I will take a look at that Swiftech Cooler and the XP120. The case, as mentioned above, is a Coolermaster Centurion with a 120mm exhaust and an 80mm front intake.
I will take a look at that Swiftech Cooler and the XP120. The case, as mentioned above, is a Coolermaster Centurion with a 120mm exhaust and an 80mm front intake.
That's not really something to be proud of. I can't LOAD most of my chips above 46*C without overvolting. And that's in a room that's typically 30*C+ Even on stock cooler, as I recall my ol northwoods Idled about 3-4*C above room temp. That's the one thing intel has done right in the p4 gen, very low power usage @ idle. The fact that they are running 46*C at idle speaks to just how hot these things are, if you're at all familiar with the typical idle temps of p4's.
Why in gods name are you putting 5 drives into workstation machines?
There is much misinfo concerning intel on this obviously pro AmD forum. The OP posted temps that are way out of the ballpark for the PD which indicates something is wrong with the way mwave built these machines. They should idle mid 40s on stock and reaching 65c or so on load which to us AMD lovers appears insane but those machines shouldn't be locking up. I would look at cleaning up the wiring and using some higher rpm fans and cpu coolers with actual thermal grease.
Markfw
Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
- May 16, 2002
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If the HSF is OEM, and uses a thermal pad, Intel says that should be enough, but this is part of the problem ITS NOT. Thats Intels fault. And it is also a fact they DO run very hot and DO quite often throttle due to that. Now that locking up ?? I don't know they should throttle, but all of the points made are valid. You should have to have 3 or 4 6000 rpm fans to cool the case. It is also possible that the 5 hard drives are too much for the PSU's in addition to the large amount of current the PD's take.
I am seeing this at all the forums and even in the pro intel forums....Stock 820-840 P-Ds are barely within the envelope to cool..Keys is fine since he doesn't OC, but hit the hardcore Ocing forum and go into their separated Intel forum and you will see....
Keysplayr
Elite Member
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You actually just said that out loud didn't you... That the 5 hard drives suck up so much juice that the PD isn't getting enough juice to heat it up? 3 or 4 6000 rpm fans to cool the case? What are you smoking? I stated all the cooling I have in these machines and it's meager compared to what you say is required. So what now? Do I have 4 rare machines that no one else has? Am I cooling with water? TEC's? Phase Change? No. Stock Intel HSF with thermal pad, a single 120mm fan @900rpm and an 80mm fan running default in the rear. You can even count the 2 PSU fans on the Enermax. Although they spin too slowly to even hear them. Prescotts/Smithfields run relatively hot compared to A64's/X2's.
So?
Lithan: Huge amounts of data are processed on these rigs. A few thousand 256MB files at a time. 500GB drives just came out so we will be using those in the next workstations.
Markfw
Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
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keysplayr2003, fine, you live with your power hogs. Our company has a data center in Corona CA, and the city doesn't have enough power for it (no sh!t !), so we have 8 semi rigs with generators powering the data center idenfinitely, until the city can fix its power problems. Right now we only use Wintel servers, and they calculated that we could save enough power, just by eliminating the Xeon servers, and going with the new Opteron servers to get rid of 2, maybe 3 of those semi's. At todays gas prices, we could pay for the hardware. I don;t have the details, but we are talking hundreds of servers, not counting the mainframes.
Edit, and you idle at 46c ? I can do that with both core @full load when the amient gets down to 70f. Load at 65 ? I can't get that high as far as I have tried to crank the voltage ! Yea, you won't need a heater this winter....You can be nice an cosy with your P-D's fanboy.
Edit, and you idle at 46c ? I can do that with both core @full load when the amient gets down to 70f. Load at 65 ? I can't get that high as far as I have tried to crank the voltage ! Yea, you won't need a heater this winter....You can be nice an cosy with your P-D's fanboy.
Keys...I hear they throttle around 70c...Are you not afraid youare too close to the edege??? Get a few weeks of dust build up on fans and 5c isn't that far of.,....
Have you thought about getting some Zalmanns with their quiet fans??? I would try to get those sub 60c so you have some safe headroom...
Have you thought about getting some Zalmanns with their quiet fans??? I would try to get those sub 60c so you have some safe headroom...
mechBgon
Super Moderator<br>Elite Member
- Oct 31, 1999
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I haven't read the official Intel specsheets super-recently, but I believe the air that the heatsink's fan is "inhaling" is supposed to be 35°C or less. You could get a budget Radio Shack indoor-outdoor thermometer, put its probe-on-a-wire one inch from the heatsink's fan motor, and see if the case is keeping the air moving well enough to acheive that.
You didn't say precisely which model of Coolermaster Centurion you have. The ones with the side snorkels, like the one in this pic, would be the best bet since the CPU fan would be able to pull room-temperature air directly into the heatsink.
If that's the type you have already, and the air temps going into the heatsink are within Intel's spec, then I would start thinking that it's somehow been incorrectly assembled. Have you removed a heatsink on one of them to see if a newbie assembler goofed something up? What brand/model of mobo do they have?
You didn't say precisely which model of Coolermaster Centurion you have. The ones with the side snorkels, like the one in this pic, would be the best bet since the CPU fan would be able to pull room-temperature air directly into the heatsink.
If that's the type you have already, and the air temps going into the heatsink are within Intel's spec, then I would start thinking that it's somehow been incorrectly assembled. Have you removed a heatsink on one of them to see if a newbie assembler goofed something up? What brand/model of mobo do they have?
Yes that's the case MechBgon. We went ahead and ordered some arctic silver and XP90Cs for all of them just to be safe. I also don't trust Mwave's installation, so at the very least I want to remount the heatsinks with AS5. We may as well just install better heatsinks to be safe and save us another trip(Our client doesn't have a problem spending extra money on hardware and our company charges $200/hr for on-site labor
).
).Why not use independant drive servers? I've never heard of someone using workstations as their own storage on anywhere near that scale.
Originally posted by: aka1nas
Yes that's the case MechBgon. We went ahead and ordered some arctic silver and XP90Cs for all of them just to be safe. I also don't trust Mwave's installation, so at the very least I want to remount the heatsinks with AS5. We may as well just install better heatsinks to be safe and save us another trip(Our client doesn't have a problem spending extra money on hardware and our company charges $200/hr for on-site labor
Hah, you're charging $200/hr for your own screw up? Gotta love tech support.
Markfw
Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
- May 16, 2002
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Originally posted by: Furen
Originally posted by: aka1nas
Yes that's the case MechBgon. We went ahead and ordered some arctic silver and XP90Cs for all of them just to be safe. I also don't trust Mwave's installation, so at the very least I want to remount the heatsinks with AS5. We may as well just install better heatsinks to be safe and save us another trip(Our client doesn't have a problem spending extra money on hardware and our company charges $200/hr for on-site labor
Hah, you're charging $200/hr for your own screw up? Gotta love tech support.
Jeesh, by the time you get the XP90c, and the fan and the install labor, you could have had X2 3800's, and they still would have been faster and cooler. See my point keys ???
Keysplayr
Elite Member
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Hmmm. Sounds to me like I must have hit a nerve Mark. Apologies. I'm just trying to call out all of the over the top BS coming out of some peoples yaps around here. I'm no fanboy despite your mudslinging slander, as I mentioned I even tried convincing them to go AMD for the lower power consumption and cooler setups. Oh, you must have missed that part intentionally or wiped it from your mind on the fly as you were reading it. These programmers insisted on Intel rigs. And I stand here before you to say what I have found in using them, and get called a fanboy by you Mark. I stand here and tell you that your multiple 6000 rpm fan reference and multiple hard drives not letting enought juice to the CPU to "heat it up properly" was BS. And you still have the retort to call me a fanboy.
I'm gonna have to ask why your so offended, and why you chose to call me a fanboy.
Waiting for a credible reply in light of the information I have given you.
Duvie: 65C is the absolute max I have seen the temp after hours and hours of full bore crunching. Both cores at 100% for overnighter jobs and still cannot get over 65C.
It varies but only in lower temps. I see 64C, 63C and 62C at full blown crunching, but never exceeds 65C. Room temps are usually 72F. Electronically Climate controlled.
And if dust gets built up on the rigs fans, would you not occaisonally maintain them just as equally if it were an AMD rig? or would you leave the dust cake up on your fans ordinarily? If your the enthusiast you say you are, you would be in your case almost every day checking it for such things.
Keysplayr
Elite Member
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Ahh, well different companies would each have there own way of doing things correct?
They have their reasons, and each workstation needs to be standalone for specific reasons and is the way the software is being developed by the programmers.
These systems will ultimately end up in different locations running medical devices that crunch "big" data. Hence the requirement of huge "MOBILE" storage because for the most part will not always have access to LAN's. Don't try to suggest a better way of doing things (although it is appreciated) because this has been discussed numerous times at a hundred meetings. The way it is, is the best way it can be done for the current application.
My client is in a similar situation as they are doing video encoding from large sources. Each machine has a RAID 1 for the OS and apps and a 400GB RAID 0 for the current working material. The finished encodes go on to a centralized mutli-terrabyte SAN, of course.
Markfw
Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
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Keys, since you were not the poster I didn;t see if buried in the thread. I re-read the entire thread and found this:
I also found a comment you made that said "we all know AMD runs cooler" or something like that, so again, I will try to be more productive in this thread. You might want to point out to the the fanboys who rallied against you NOW the errors of their ways.
So, I APOLOGISE AND TAKE BACK THE FANBOY REFERENCE !
I also found a comment you made that said "we all know AMD runs cooler" or something like that, so again, I will try to be more productive in this thread. You might want to point out to the the fanboys who rallied against you NOW the errors of their ways.
Actaully when I had my northwood with more case fans meant more dust and I had to religiously clean it about every 3-4 weeks as temps would climb...I run about 2 less case fans now which produces less dust and I clean t about every 6-8 weeks but it doesn't get even anywhere close to as dirty and the temp usually dont raise but 1-2c......
I am asking you case I have seen offices and the computers by no means get a thorough cleanninglike I give them even within a 3-4 month schedule...
All I am saying is putting it that close to the potential limit and require potentially "enthusiast" level cleaning frequently, seems a bit much to ask for the lowest grade dual core running stock out of the box...Imagine your same setup with a 200-400mhz increase of the 830 or 840....could you keep it cool???
On a sidenote here, how exactly are 4 drives processing upwards of half a terabyte worth of IO at a time? 4 ATA drives to be more precise. Granted, it could save the data out to the disks and crunch portions in and out of memory, but I really doubt that 4 drives are moving anywhere close to a quarter to half a terabyte at once.
Now if the backend was a SAN backend. I could see a multi-bussed, high spindle count array doing a great deal of legwork to that sort of IO demand. I just can't see any ATA devices coming anywhere, in the realm of reason, near those numbers. The amount of memory for those arrays to process realtime would be outrageous.
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