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Need DVD Burning Hardware/Software Crash Course ASAP

O

Ornery

Lifer
My dad just phoned and said he bought a Dazzle Digital Video Creator 80 at Sears for about $50.00. He wants to splice pictures, movies and music together, and copy the creation to DVD. He thought his Dimension 4300 had a DVD burner in it, but was disappointed to learn that it's only a CDRW drive. I know he could make some kind of CD videos with that, but I have no idea how compatible that would be with friends and family's CD or DVD players.

The unit he bought comes with "Pinnacle Studio QuickStart". My first question is, who makes the best video editing software? Who is the PhotoShop of video editing? I'd suggest that he buy a video capture device, that includes a light version of this top end editing software, whatever it is.

Second question is, how compatible are burned DVDs, with cheap DVD players? He's going to want to give these DVDs to family, friends, and play it on his own AIWA DVD player. Does that mean DVD+RW is out of the question?

My son will be opening his new HP Pavilion on the 26th. It includes an 8X DVD+R/+RW drive. I was thinking I could order media for that, when I order this hardware and media for my dad. It would save on shipping to buy it all from one place. I'm thinking of buying the video capture device (no AGP in the 4300), DVD burner and media. My main concerns are getting top tier video editing software, even if it's only a limited version. Having compatibility with ancient, low quality DVD players, and the DVD media to go with it.

I'm meeting him for lunch at 2:00PM. I have to work from 6:00AM till 11:00AM. Doesn't leave much time for research, but if you could give me a head start, it might be doable.

Thanks!
 
I've used Ulead with success. Adobe (for me) was typical Adobe, more powerful then anything else but with a steeper learning curve and I didnt need anything that advanced. Ulead did everything I needed, and did it quite well.
Your DVD burning software should include the stuff to make them DVD discs for us in DVD players, although may not come with editing software.

My experience
 
The CD format you are thinking of is called VCD, short for Video CD. It is almost uniformly compatible with DVD players made in the past 7~8 years. In fact most DVD players sold advertise VCD support. VCD is also something you can make for free, using a few programs like TMPGEnc and VCDEasy 1.1.1. (I can send you both later if you'd like) Additionally, the VCD resolution is valid for putting on DVDs. (though you have to convert the audio from 44100Hz to 48000Hz. Fortunately TMPGEnc can do that easily.) If you'd like to find out more about VCDs check out VideoHelp.com, formerly VCDhelp.com and DVDRhelp.com. I'd also like to point out that VCDs can be played in any computer, since the MPEG-1 codec is pretty standard and there are several free VCD software players out there.

As far as DVD player compatiblity goes DVD-R has the best compatibility, followed by DVD+R and then DVD+/-RW. (They're basically deadlocked) There are several video resolutions you can use to encode video, but most of them are MPEG-2 which must be licensed. (i.e. pay out the ass) Fortunately the VCD format (with a slightly different audio format) can be put on a DVD, though it is basic TV resolution. No fancy HD crap for you my friend. 😛

So yeah, your best bet is VCDs. If you want to know more you can read up at videohelp.com or ask more questions here.
 
Really. Pinnacle studio? He'll have a light version of that with the cheapy Dazzle device he bought? Good, that takes care of that. Now, just have to get him a DVD burner and media...

Edit: Hell, if VCD is that compatible, then there's nothing more to do! He's got the device, software and CD burner already! Thanks for the link, I'll start reading right away.
 
Originally posted by: Ornery
Really. Pinnacle studio? He'll have a light version of that with the cheapy Dazzle device he bought? Good, that takes care of that. Now, just have to get him a DVD burner and media...
Click to expand...
Like I said, try VCDs first. You can only fit 80 minutes of video on an 80 minute CD, but you wind up spending less and the compatibility is a lot better.

That, and making VCDs can be done for free. 😛
 
Originally posted by: Ornery
Really. Pinnacle studio? He'll have a light version of that with the cheapy Dazzle device he bought? Good, that takes care of that. Now, just have to get him a DVD burner and media...

Edit: Hell, if VCD is that compatible, then there's nothing more to do! He's got the device, software and CD burner already! Thanks for the link, I'll start reading right away.
Click to expand...
Once you're feeling comfortable with VCDs I can point you to some more advanced stuff which can seriously improve the quality-for-size ratio of what you make. Unfortunately any variety in the absolutely rigid specifications of VCD 2.0 leads to non-uniform coverage with DVD players, but once you spot some of the distortions that can come from VCD's limited bitrate you may want to take the chance so you can improve the quality.
 
VCDs are horrible quality and can't fit as much. You can get a fairly decent mpeg2 encoder for not that much money and the quality will be much better on a DVD. Also, I'm skeptical of the compatibility for VCDs being spoken of in this thread. DVD-+Rs are going to be a lot more compatible in DVD players than VCDs are, IMO.
 
Originally posted by: Iron Woode
http://www.dvdrhelp.com

Start there and learn.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that would work. Two hours before I have to hit the sack, and no time at all to research on Saturday. :roll:

Just got back from his house. The stinkin' Dazzle Digital Video Creator 80 would not be recognized properly. It was seen by WinXP as a USB control device. The Image and Sound drivers were "installed" when it was plugged in, but only the USB part shows up in the device list. The Pinnacle software can't see it as a capture device. I reinstalled it a couple times, including trying other USB ports, with no luck. It's going back to Sears.

Now I've got to find another capture device. I like the idea of using USB, so we don't have to install a mega buck video card. Not sure how many more choices I have, but this was a bust.

I already told him we'll be giving the VCDs a shot. Discs are dirt cheap, and he only has the CD burner for now, so we have to at least try it. Hell, gotta get a capture device first! :disgust:

Now I'll head to dvdrhelp.com among others...
 
Originally posted by: Ornery
Really. Pinnacle studio? He'll have a light version of that with the cheapy Dazzle device he bought? Good, that takes care of that. Now, just have to get him a DVD burner and media...

Edit: Hell, if VCD is that compatible, then there's nothing more to do! He's got the device, software and CD burner already! Thanks for the link, I'll start reading right away.
Click to expand...

I'm probably a little late to chime in here - but for media/burner :

1. The Burner : Without making things too complicated, you want a sony, a pioneer, a plextor, or nothing. Stay far, FAR away from HP. All the newest burners are dual format -- but if you have to pick one pick -R since settop compatibility seems to be a big issue for you.

2. For media, there is no excuse to use anything cheaper then Ritek's (G04 for 4x, G05 for 8x) -- and you can't get better media without paying twice as much or more.


-Chu
 
Best video editing software are Apple Final Cut Pro & DVD Studio Pro.
For DVD Burners, I recommend Plextor, Sony, Pioneer, Samsung, and NEC.
For Media, Ritek is the best but Memorex isn't that bad either.
 
Originally posted by: Xiety
Best video editing software are Apple Final Cut Pro & DVD Studio Pro.
For DVD Burners, I recommend Plextor, Sony, Pioneer, Samsung, and NEC.
For Media, Ritek is the best but Memorex isn't that bad either.
Click to expand...

I will give my take on this. I do some really specialized video editing, mainly I clean up clips for anime groups which means lots of custom imporeted filters and the like. My main tools of choice were Premiere and Avid Express (our styler loved this program), so, I had a good idea how to work my way around the software itself.

Now one day, I had to make an actuial video for clips. I pretty much stumbled through the both pieces of software -- I knew what I wanted to do and knew it was possible to do, but trying to actuially figure out how was pretty infuriating at times. Then I tried iMovie. While it would have been completly inadequate for my main use, it was SO MUCH EASIER for actuially doing what video editors were ment to do - splice video. It's highly reccomended if you are a newbie.

-Chu
 
You did note this was being installed in a Dell Dimension 4300, right? 😕

I'll skip the DVD burner for now, if the Video CDs can actually get the job done. I'm looking at this ADS Technologies DVD Express 2.0 for $100.00 at CircuitCity. I'll tell my dad not to uninstall the Pinnicle software he has on there...

Edit: On second thought, after reading PriceGrabber user reviews. I'll pass on the ADS unit. Hmmm, all the CircuitCity reviews were great. Much better reviews on Plextor ConvertX PX-M402U.
 
This is how I do it:

1. Capture DV video via firewire into RAW AVI format (make sure you're hard drive is formatted in NTFS - FAT32 has a 2GB filesize limit, and an hour of RAW AVI is good for 20GB!).
2. Rip the audio out of the AVI into WAV format using VirtualDubMPEG
3. Convert the WAV into DVD compliant AC3 format using Ffmpeggui.
4. Calculate the proper DVD bitrate with CCEGuesser.
5. Encode the RAW AVI video into DVD compliant MPEG2 video with CinemaCraftEncoder (frameserving with AVISynth - you wouldn't believe what you can do with this baby). This will be the longest step - could take a couple of hours depending on your machine.
6. Take my MPEG2 video, AC3 audio and combine them into DVD VOB format using TMPGEnc DVD Author.
7. Burn to DVD with TMPGEnc DVD Author or any other DVD burning prog.

It's not the quickest method, but it blows away any "do-it-all" suite for results - just ask anybody over at Doom9 or DVDRHelp.

Some would argue for TMPEnc instead of CinemaCraftEncoder, but CCE gives better DVD results. TMPEnc gives better VCD or SVCD results.
 
Originally posted by: CFster
This is how I do it:

1. Capture DV video via firewire into RAW AVI format (make sure you're hard drive is formatted in NTFS - FAT32 has a 2GB filesize limit, and an hour of RAW AVI is good for 20GB!).
2. Rip the audio out of the AVI into WAV format using VirtualDubMPEG
3. Convert the WAV into DVD compliant AC3 format using Ffmpeggui.
4. Calculate the proper DVD bitrate with CCEGuesser.
5. Encode the RAW AVI video into DVD compliant MPEG2 video with CinemaCraftEncoder (frameserving with AVISynth - you wouldn't believe what you can do with this baby). This will be the longest step - could take a couple of hours depending on your machine.
6. Take my MPEG2 video, AC3 audio and combine them into DVD VOB format using TMPGEnc DVD Author.
7. Burn to DVD with TMPGEnc DVD Author or any other DVD burning prog.

It's not the quickest method, but it blows away any "do-it-all" suite for results - just ask anybody over at Doom9 or DVDRHelp.

Some would argue for TMPEnc instead of CinemaCraftEncoder, but CCE gives better DVD results. TMPEnc gives better VCD or SVCD results.
Click to expand...


Umm . . . you forgot the 'editing' part - and even for a streight DV -> DVD transfer I have issues with that - you think your average newbie could follow all that? Especially CCE . . . first, unless your spending $2500 the 'light' version is no better then TMPGenc. Secondly, the user interface is wore then counterintuive - sometimes it is downright wrong (don't get me started on the field order bug . . .)

-Chu
 
Originally posted by: User1001
WWW.doom9.org has good guides and links to free software for creating vcds.
Click to expand...

yea, I was just about to post that 🙂

Oh and not all DVD players will play a VCD movie, I remember my Xbox doesn't and my friend's (I could get model if you really wanted) doesn't either
 
doom9 is the bible - but it cannot be stressed enough - that if your not technically adept, and even if you are, the learning curve is a cliff because of the sheer amonth of stuff you need to take in to do what seem simple tasks. The upside is the complicated tasks are not that much harder then the simple ones.

That being said - once your done with the actuial editing I cannot reccomend TMPGenc enough for the actuial encoding and transfer. It is good quality (just as good as the personal edition of CCE), has a very intuitive interface, and is pretty cheap -- free for VCD's even.

-Chu
 
Originally posted by: Chu
Originally posted by: CFster
This is how I do it:

1. Capture DV video via firewire into RAW AVI format (make sure you're hard drive is formatted in NTFS - FAT32 has a 2GB filesize limit, and an hour of RAW AVI is good for 20GB!).
2. Rip the audio out of the AVI into WAV format using VirtualDubMPEG
3. Convert the WAV into DVD compliant AC3 format using Ffmpeggui.
4. Calculate the proper DVD bitrate with CCEGuesser.
5. Encode the RAW AVI video into DVD compliant MPEG2 video with CinemaCraftEncoder (frameserving with AVISynth - you wouldn't believe what you can do with this baby). This will be the longest step - could take a couple of hours depending on your machine.
6. Take my MPEG2 video, AC3 audio and combine them into DVD VOB format using TMPGEnc DVD Author.
7. Burn to DVD with TMPGEnc DVD Author or any other DVD burning prog.

It's not the quickest method, but it blows away any "do-it-all" suite for results - just ask anybody over at Doom9 or DVDRHelp.

Some would argue for TMPEnc instead of CinemaCraftEncoder, but CCE gives better DVD results. TMPEnc gives better VCD or SVCD results.
Click to expand...


Umm . . . you forgot the 'editing' part - and even for a streight DV -> DVD transfer I have issues with that - you think your average newbie could follow all that? Especially CCE . . . first, unless your spending $2500 the 'light' version is no better then TMPGenc. Secondly, the user interface is wore then counterintuive - sometimes it is downright wrong (don't get me started on the field order bug . . .)

-Chu
Click to expand...

Fine, you can use TMPGenc. I use CCE SP. The difference is debatable even with the Basic edition - I see one. CCE is certainly faster. Does he want to pay $2500? Probably not. But I can tell you this - I'll bet those bazillion photoshopped images all over the web weren't created by people who spent $600 either.

Combined with AVISynth you can do just about anything. Uncheck "Upper Field First " - that takes care of the field order thing. And it's not a bug, it's a feature. Edit your video in VirtualDub, or any of a dozen other progs beforehand. Of if you want to be sloppy, edit the MPEG2 in TMPGenc on the other end.

The reason I posted was because I tried almost every program listed in the posts above and was unhappy with the results. I wasted a lot of time. If he want's a quick solution than this isn't it - I would say get an all in one package and have at it. But if he gets into it, then he's going to end up doing a lot of my steps for the best results.
 
...Capture DV video via firewire into RAW AVI format...

I think I need to start the topic over. We will be using an analog source to start with. My first hurdle is to get that onto the HDD. The POS capture device he bought, is being returned, because it isn't being installed in WinXP correctly. It came with a "light version" of Pinnacle, so I'll just leave that installed. So far, I'm considering buying the Plextor ConvertX PX-M402U for about $140.00. It includes InterVideo WinDVD Creator. We can use that, or the light version of Pinnacle he's already installed. If the CD Video recordings aren't up to snuff, we'll start looking at DVD burners. If neither of those software packages are any good, we'll try a better one.

Again, first issue is capturing the analog video. Is the slower USB port in his Dimension 2300 going to be a serious bottleneck? Would a PCI card based capture device be the better choice? I've read a few things that mentioned doing the conversion in hardware, rather than software. Gotta research that more I guess... 😕

Edit: Ooh, this looks like a deal:

$50 Mail-in Rebate when you purchase a PX-708A Drive with a PX-M401UThey would be $284.99 shipped from NewEgg, but their disclaimer says "**NON-REFUNDABLE ITEM. Exchange for same Exact Item Only!". Not too cool if the capture device doesn't work. Buy.Com wants $288.62 with no such disclaimer, but I've heard Buy.Com service has gone down the tubes.
 
Originally posted by: wkabel23
Originally posted by: User1001
WWW.doom9.org has good guides and links to free software for creating vcds.
Click to expand...

yea, I was just about to post that 🙂

Oh and not all DVD players will play a VCD movie, I remember my Xbox doesn't and my friend's (I could get model if you really wanted) doesn't either
Click to expand...
I have two set top DVD players that have trouble with my home burnt VCD's. One is a 4-year-old Toshiba and the other is a one-year-old Panasonic. Neither has trouble with home burnt DVD's. I did not do extensive testing, so I can't say if it's the CD media itself or the encoding.
 
If it isn't USB 2.0 then forget it. There isn't enough bandwidth there. Not sure if a Dimension 2300 has 1.0 or 2.0.

If you have a digital camcorder you can port the video through that (let it do the conversion from analog to digital) - then send it into your PC via Firewire. You can get a Firewire card for $15.
I have a camcorder for this very purpose. I use it to capture from my DirecTivo. No signal loss whatsoever.

This Plextor digital converter must be a new thing. As far as I know, there isn't a hardware MPEG2 converter available for less than several grand. I think this is just a capture device - the MPEG2 encoding is done via software on your PC (somebody correct me). This would be great if it's true.

Other than that, get a video capture card (hint - don't forget about the audio).
 
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