NBA: Outrage

[chowmein]

Van Gundy Fine 100k

Is it just me or Jeff Van Gundy of the Houston Rockets is right? Anyone who watched the Mavs/Rockets series can obviously see the bad calls and cheap fouls being called. I don't disagree with the fine assessed to JVG, but speculation about lifetime ban, ludicrous!

It is also apparent, that the Refs called more moving screen violations after Mark Cuban had complained to the league.

Everyone knows the NBA is a well oil business machine domestically and internationally. Through a business standpoint, the league would have an open ear to Mark Cuban and turn a blind eye to JVG simply b/c Cuban is a owner.

Game 5: funny how the refs got together when Jon Barry dove for a loose ball and reverse a call in favor of the mavs. i didn't see a ref meeting when finley smacked the ball loose while out of bounds in the final few mins. a foul on J. Howard was given, when it should have been Dirk's 6th (he eventually scored shortly after)

If Rockets lose this series it won't be because the Mavs are a better team.

(i'm actually a Knicks fan, this is an unbiased opinion)

 

[vi edit]

I just find it sad that players are only fined $25,000-$50,000 (plus lost wages from suspension) for climbing into the stands and wailing on fans while this guy says something about the staffing and is slapped with a $100,000 fine.

The players make fistfulls more per year for the coach and actually beat on the people coming to their games and this coach gets hammered for making a comment.

Somebody has some serious insecurity issues.

 

[Fausto]

Meh. The NBA sucks.

/thread

 

[ironcrotch]

Originally posted by: vi_edit
I just find it sad that players are only fined $25,000-$50,000 (plus lost wages from suspension) for climbing into the stands and wailing on fans while this guy says something about the staffing and is slapped with a $100,000 fine.

The players make fistfulls more per year for the coach and actually beat on the people coming to their games and this coach gets hammered for making a comment.

Somebody has some serious insecurity issues.

What does that have to do with anything?!?! Anyway... back to more ref bias. I think its always been this way in the league. Usually its an individual ref with some kind of own personal agenda.

 

[Queasy]

Stern is just pissed because Van Gundy won't tell who gave him the information off the referee site.

But agree with Fausto. I haven't watched an NBA game in two years.

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: Fausto
Meh. The NBA sucks.

/thread

 

[hdeck]

the NBA sucks. rockets got screwed out of another win last night by terrible referee calls (out of bounds calls, not calling dirk's 6th foul, etc).

 

[Miramonti]

I haven't watched this series so I don't have an opinion of the refereeing, but Stern is an ass for making a bigger deal out of this than it is.

However the man is fueled by incessant greed, and the thought of turning a billion chinese against the nba due to its treatment of their player must have given him a near aneurysm thinking about it. That's all this is about, and it would be much different imo if Yao wasn't the subject of complaint.

 

[KK]

Originally posted by: FoBoT

Originally posted by: Fausto
Meh. The NBA,MLB,NFL sucks. NHL Rules...

/thread

 

[Hossenfeffer]

Can't get around that officiating is a highly imperfect occupation. Subjective stuff is gonna happen all the time.

 

[iamme]

officiating in the nba is pretty tough, imo. ideally, a foul is a foul and should be called regardless. however, given the physical nature of the game, you'd have players fouling out constantly.

i hate it when refs make calls at the end of very close games that determine the outcome. however, in a 7 game series, the refs don't win game for teams.

if there was some terrible conspiracy in the NBA, it would be FOR Yao to succeed.

 

[ElFenix]

the NBA's officiating is almost as bad as the WWF's. and at least in the WWF the bad officiating is intentional and part of the act.

dirk's 6th foul where he slapped yao in the mouth there was no one anywhere near them, and it got called on someone else. wtf. is there an honest ref in the nba or do they seriously not see these things? why can't they put more refs on the court? i stopped watching the NBA years ago because the refereeing is so bad. i guess not a damn thing has changed. t-mac's 5th was bullsh!t too. he didn't even touch dirk diggler and got called for a foul. wtf.

 

[vi edit]

What does that have to do with anything?!?!

My point is that the fines just don't make any sense. They are completely arbitrary and knee jerk.

Players get a slap on the wrist for their physical actions while a coach makes a comment to some reporters and he gets hit up for $100,000.

It just doesn't add up.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: iamme
officiating in the nba is pretty tough, imo. ideally, a foul is a foul and should be called regardless. however, given the physical nature of the game, you'd have players fouling out constantly.

i hate it when refs make calls at the end of very close games that determine the outcome. however, in a 7 game series, the refs don't win game for teams.

if there was some terrible conspiracy in the NBA, it would be FOR Yao to succeed.

you haven' been watching this series. the refs have had it out for the rockets the WHOLE time. game 1 the mavs took 3x the free throws the rockets did. don't even try to argue the rockets could possibly have committed 3x the fouls the mavs did.

 

[LeonarD26]

Fouls against big men are not the same as fouls against guards..... at least in the refs eyes. Doesn't make it right...

 

[iamme]

Originally posted by: vi_edit

What does that have to do with anything?!?!

My point is that the fines just don't make any sense. They are completely arbitrary and knee jerk.

Players get a slap on the wrist for their physical actions while a coach makes a comment to some reporters and he gets hit up for $100,000.

It just doesn't add up.

players got suspended without pay. Artest lost around 5 million bucks for his season long suspension.

 

[PlatinumGold]

the point of the fine is: JVG claimed that the NBA as an organization conspired against Yao Ming (pretty ludicrous if you ask me).

why would the NBA do that?

 

[MrChad]

Last night's game

Officials: Bennett Salvatore , Joe Derosa , Tony Brothers

Sports guy's comment on Sunday

I don't think the NBA fixes games, but they have one trick that they use for situations like this ? when they want a home team to win the game, they invariably assign the worst referees possible to that game for two reasons: Bad referees have a tendency to get swayed by the home crowd, and bad referees never have the stones to make a tough call on the road. In a related story, I went to 35 Clippers games this year and kept a list of the referees in my pocket, which I also used to follow the referees for any televised games. And yes, the referees in the NBA ? as a whole ? have never been worse. But there were six referees that stuck out as being especially terrible. Here they are:

5. Tom Washington and Rodney Mott (tie) ? Two newer guys who were just gawd-awful. My dad described the new breed of refs like this: "They're all built like running backs, they're all incompetent, and they all blow the whistle one-two seconds late every time."

4. Luis Grillo ? He's been terrible for like 20 years.

3. Tommy Nunez ? He's been terrible for like 30 years.

2. Bennett Salvatore ? Always one of the worst, he took it to another level this season. If you see him on the court at the start of the game, get ready for about six technicals, two near-brawls and both coaches having to be restrained by their assistants at various times.

1. Violet Palmer ? Here's what I wrote about her four months ago: "During last week's Celtics game, the legendary Violet Palmer was involved, who deserves her own 'SportsCentury' at some point. Nobody has ever been worse at their job, in any vocation ? not even the people who work at Home Depot selling Christmas trees. When Violet started officiating a few years ago, she was so incompetent, players and coaches actually avoided arguing with her ? whenever she screwed up, they would always glance around helplessly, the same way you would if your puppy dropped a deuce on the living room carpet. But now she's been around for a few years and people are fed up. On Monday night, Doc Rivers was one bad Violet call away from ending up in a white Bronco with Al Cowlings. I love this stuff."

 

[jsoles]

The finley thing should have been called. Sad that the officals did not see it.
On the rockets previous possession the mavs got the rebound and howard got called for a foul on yao without touching him (dirk didnt touch him either). The refs called the foul because yao got hit in the face with the ball and his head bounced back....not a foul.

Cuban sent in a tape in using the NBAs process to get the screens reviewed. Many of them were reviewed by officials and the mavs got word saying they should have been called. Had van gundy used this process instead of blasting through the media he wouldnt have been fined.

The officiating has been piss poor in this series all the way around.

I can see the fine on Van Gundy because he is basically accusing the commish and the league of cheating and he cited an inside source without naming a name. He wont face a lifetime ban but he will probaby get a short suspension.

 

[JujuFish]

NBA playoffs make me wish all the more for the NHL.... sniff...

 

[iamme]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: iamme
officiating in the nba is pretty tough, imo. ideally, a foul is a foul and should be called regardless. however, given the physical nature of the game, you'd have players fouling out constantly.

i hate it when refs make calls at the end of very close games that determine the outcome. however, in a 7 game series, the refs don't win game for teams.

if there was some terrible conspiracy in the NBA, it would be FOR Yao to succeed.

you haven' been watching this series. the refs have had it out for the rockets the WHOLE time. game 1 the mavs took 3x the free throws the rockets did. don't even try to argue the rockets could possibly have committed 3x the fouls the mavs did.

i have been watching.

i understand there are objectionable calls and that SOME calls do affect the outcome of a game. however, blaming the refs for Houston losing 3 straight to Dallas completely disregards everything the players control....like missing shots, FT's, etc.

Houston lost by 3 points last night, but missed 11 FT's. they were 5-13 from three point range.

also, i don't understand how FT attempts must be equal in a game. isn't it possible that one team commits more fouls than another team?

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: LeonarD26
Fouls against big men are not the same as fouls against guards..... at least in the refs eyes. Doesn't make it right...

Too true on all levels of the game. If anyone fouled Earl Boykins (or Allen Iverson) like they do Shaq, assault charges would be laid.

I don't agree with the fine being so extravagant ... methinks a nerve was struck, and Stern's knee-jerk reaction was over-the-top. The fine will be appealed in most likelihood ... and reduced. Refereeing is, and always will be subjective, especially in such a fast, physical game. That said, the NBA does pass directives to the refs to pay attention to particular things. Whether or not Cuban was directly influencing what they're looking at or not, who knows? Every team sends tapes of 'violations' to the league.

 

[Queasy]

Originally posted by: Patt
Whether or not Cuban was directly influencing what they're looking at or not, who knows? Every team sends tapes of 'violations' to the league.

From what I understand, it wasn't that Cuban sent in a tape. It was that there was a message on the referee site that basically said to keep a close watch on Yao Ming according to Van Gundy.

 

[vi edit]

Having watched the NBA for about 15 years, I feel pretty confident that there isn't a conspiracy per se, but a definite....desire.....to spread out playoff games as long as possible. It always seems like they try to sway things one way or another to stretch out a series as long as they can. Increased ticket sales. Increased TV time for ads. Increased vending sales. Ect. Why else would they switch to a best of 7 instead of 5 for the opening playoff round?

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: iamme
i have been watching.

i understand there are objectionable calls and that SOME calls do affect the outcome of a game. however, blaming the refs for Houston losing 3 straight to Dallas completely disregards everything the players control....like missing shots, FT's, etc.

Houston lost by 3 points last night, but missed 11 FT's. they were 5-13 from three point range.

also, i don't understand how FT attempts must be equal in a game. isn't it possible that one team commits more fouls than another team?

yes, the players miss shots. but when they don't have the opportunity to take additional shots because the refs screw up so bad on damn near every play, and the fouls aren't put on the right people so that 'superstars' can remain on the floor when they should be out of the game certainly doesn't mean that the refs have no bearing on the outcome of close games. no, i can't say that the rockets absolutely should have won last night's game. but i can say that they got several bad breaks down the stretch that hurt their chances of winning. yes, the actions of the first two teams on the court affect the outcome of the game, but the actions of the third certainly do as well. to say otherwise is to ignore reality.

and i didn't say that free throws have to be equal. i said that the mavs taking 3x the number that the rockets did is ridiculous. i don't think its possible that one team commit 3x the fouls that another does.