NAS or Server

[Twinpeaksr]

I would a 1TB NAS for $660 at http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=202189912&adid=17071&dcaid=17071

Originally I was going to build a Server for data storage (Areca 1220 w/8 320GB SATA Drives, 7 Drive RAID 5 w/Hot Swap Spare), but at this price I am wondering if this is a better way to go. I was going to have 1.92TB, this would be 1.5TB (RAID 5 w/4 250GB drives X2 units), but it is about $300 cheaper.

Thoughts?

 

[Ayah]

Personally, I would go with the server since I love having servers fold in their spare time.

 

[Madwand1]

Areca vs. consumer NAS box? I pity the foo!

 

[Slowlearner]

I needed an archive server (backup of data backup) for work, and looked at using an old Compaq PIII server running Linux to do the job. After trying various hardware combinations, and having problems configuring Samba to access windows pcs, picked the Buffalo Terastation 1.0TB with sata drives for about 800$ from buy.com, and have been using it for the last three months. Setting it up and connecting it to my large windows network took about 30 minutes and its been running fine so far in RAID 5. The only problem that I have seen was it took quite a while to recover from an intentional power outage - so an UPS will be needed - but even that would not help if power is out for a long time. The device is small, silent and quite well made. None of 250GB WD hds has failed so far, but RAID is not a backup - so I have been burning data dvds.

 

[dev0lution]

Somewhere between that and a server would probably be the SS4000-E from Intel. It just needs drives, so you can pick your capacities and probably upgrade in the future as drives fail or capacity/price grows.

Specs

 

[oynaz]

I have a Synology 106j NAS, and it have worked perfectly so far. Quiet, efficient and cheap. I have even seen a site where they attempt to make folding@home run on it.

 

[Twinpeaksr]

Based on the research that I have done, here is what I have found:

Terrastation 4x250GB, 0.75TB RAID 5 - $0.87/GB, based on many reviews, questionable reliability and speed (hit or miss it seems).
Terrastation 4x400GB, 1.2TB RAID 5 - $0.83/GB, based on many reviews, questionable reliability and speed (hit or miss it seems).
Terrastation 4x500GB, 1.5TB RAID 5 - $0.81/GB, based on many reviews, questionable reliability and speed (hit or miss it seems).
Server 8x320GB, 1.92TB RAID 5 w/hot swap spare, 40GB Boot Drive, - $1.00/GB, based on others who have tried this, more time consuming, higher power usage but faster speed.

I am leaning to the server, I am concerned about the NAS reliability.

I did look at the SS4000-E, but it would be about $1.11/GB at 1.5TB RAID 5 (4x500GB). Not sure if it gives me anything over the Server for the added cost.

Any thoughts?

 

[oynaz]

I have not had nay reliability problems wiht my NAS, at least.

 

[Twinpeaksr]

The problem with the Synology is that is does not support RAID 5, I want fault protection so RAID 5 is a must.

I know there are good experiences with NAS, but I am concerned of the ones that are in my price range. I am hearing about to many people having issues with it that I am not sure I want to take that risk. Thanks for the input!

 

[oynaz]

No problem.

 

[Slowlearner]

Whats this for Home or Office? Do need or have off site backup, how much of a downtime can you tolerate, what backup software do you plan to use etc etc. Do you have a DRP? If it is for large organization, willing to spend a great deal the soultion will be different from a home user trying to to backup mp3s/photos/video clips.

While RAID 5 is more cost effective - for a quicker reaction time RAID 1 is often recommended. Do you need RAID 1?

 

[Twinpeaksr]

This is for my home setup (3 other systems on the network through gigabit switch), this is my main file server for all kinds of data and will probably end up being a media server at some time as well. Speed is important (may need to stream up to 4 HD Video signals eventually) but the fault tolerance is more important. I have done RAID 1 but did not like the wast of space (n/2) I have also thought about RAID 6, but right now am looking at RAID 5 w/hot swap. I am looking at cost effective and reliable. Backup is currently on CD/DVD, not sure what I will replace it with, may just be DL DVD.

Ah the fun of new system design...

 

[Smokey0066]

Twinpeaksr, i'm in somewhat of the same boat. I'm really leaning on the server. I was wondering what your system was going to be? i'm thinking about picking up a tyan server board and I will be using the 1120 instead of the 1220.

 

[Twinpeaksr]

Glad to here I am not the only one! May have to postpone the server for 6mo (I am also building a new workstation), but the plan as of right now is:

1 Intel SE7230NH1 Socket T (LGA 775) Intel E7230 ATX Server Motherboard - Retail
1 Intel Celeron D 326 Prescott 2.53GHz LGA 775 EM64T Processor w/ Execute Disable Bit Model BX80547RE2533CN - Retail
2 CORSAIR ValueSelect 256MB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 533 (PC2 4200) System Memory Model VS256MB533D2 - Retail
1 LITE-ON 16X DVD±R DVD Burner W/ LightScribe and 5X DVD-RAM Write Black ATAPI/E-IDE Model SHM-165H6S - OEM
1 SILVERSTONE ZEUS SST-ST65ZF ATX12V 650W Power Supply - Retail
1 LIAN LI PC-61 USB Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
1 Microsoft K48-00019 Black PS/2 RF Wireless Optical Desktop Pro - Retail
1 TRIPP LITE OMNI900LCD 900 VA 475 Watts OmniSmart Digital UPS - Retail
2 KINGWIN F-012BB 120mm 2 Ball Case Cooling Fan - Retail
3 COOLMAX SATA POWER ADAPTER Cable - OEM
1 BYTECC SNT-1122BK IDE 5.25 Mobile Rack w/ 2 Fan, BLACK - Retail
1 Link Depot 12" ATA133 UV Cable, 2-Connector Model UV-ATA12-SL-2 - Retail
1 Areca ARC-1220 PCI-Express x8 SATA II Controller Card - Retail
8 Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (Perpendicular Recording Technology) 320GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
1 LIAN LI EX-34B Expension HDD Kit (Black) - Retail

Boot Drive is an ATA133 40GB Barracuda drive, I am planing on using Fedora Core 5 to run this all. The 8 320GB Drives will be 7 drive RAID 5 w/hot swap or 8Drive RAID 6 (1.92TB total). I chose the Intel board for stability and because it has been tested with the Areca card. I had a Tyan board a few years ago but after toasting 2 of them and having stability problems, I have moved away from them. The best boards that I have ever used for stability are Supermicro ones, but I was trying to keep this system under $2000 (I was close!). Good luck with your build, let me know if you have any questions on this one!

 

[Slowlearner]

With the kind of plans you have how could you even be thinking of a NAS. Yes by all means build, though to me it seems like a bit overdone. I have been using an Intel desktop 478 board for my main server at work for the past four years without any problems. However, I would recommend changing the CPU to 531 or better - the price diff being small, and if you are planning to use this system for while you never know how a better processor will help. You might even consider Window XP Media Center as the OS. I would also add a external hd.

Over all your planned build looks good, very good, better than most small busineses' main servers. And I was surprised that Intel server board is so reasonably priced, something I will keep in mind for the next build at work.

 

[jleves]

can you give us the exact total cost? I'm thinking of doing the same kind of thing but I'm going to use an existing mobo/cpu - either a amd 2400, a dual PIII 800 or a dual PIII 1GHz or dual PIII Xeon 550 (yeah, lots of old scrap systems scavanged from salvaged work servers here).

Thanks

 

[Smokey0066]

I'll post up my question here since it is related. Since I'm new to this game here I'd like some advice on a motherboard for this file server.

I was looking at the Tyan S3870 with a dual core opteron, but now I'm wondering if it'd be better to run with a xeon setup, something like a supermicro/xeon(51xx) or intel/xeon(51xx) setup instead. I guess I'm in unfamiliar territory when it comes to this level of equipment and its not like there are alot of reviews with this kind of equipment as well (at least I haven't found any) but i think intel has been in the server environment alot longer than amd.

I'm pretty sure I'll go down the Areca with seagate 7200.10 320 drives. just need a board/cpu for stability and reliability. My budget is pretty flexible but i'd like to be reasonable as well.

Any help in this area would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Megatomic]

I went with a Buffalo Linkstation NAS for my own family's storage needs. I started out with a 250GB device, but I can link more to it and increase my storage as necessary.

My only regret is that it only has a 10/100 network interface, but now that I'm going all wireless that's not going to be an issue for a long time.

 

[Twinpeaksr]

The system I speced about is about $2100, not bad for close to 2TB of RAID! I was contemplating NAS because I don't have enough $$ to build my workstation and this server, I though that might be an option. Since then I have just decided to postpone the server for about 6mo rather than settle for NAS.

The MB and related was chosen so that I have more flexibility in the future if I add to the functionality of the server (File server now, but may add web server and some sort of DB server in the future). I know I could use a cheaper MB arrangement, but this seems like a good solid board and gives me PCI-E, which is nice! I didn't do a Xeon because of cost and I would not be using that processing power, I put the power in the workstation for my number crunching (C2D 6400).

I wanted to avoid Windows as an OS because I don't see it as worth the money and I think Linux is a better solution for this task, especially if I add the Web server and such later. I have enough headaches with The other systems I have on Windows, I would like to avoid it (not looking for a Linux vs windows battle, just my personal choice).

As for Snokey0066 question, depends on what the server will be used for. If you are using if as I am for a RAID File server, there will not be a lot of processing power needed, Find a good stable basic board (I like the one I am using) and add as you go. Spend the money where you are going to use it (IE file server money goes to the Drives, Number crunching server goes to the CPU/RAM, etc...)

This will be on my 3Com Gigabit Switch, and there are 3-4 computers on the network at a time. I don't think this will be a bottleneck for dishing out the data!

Thanks for the input, let me know if there are any other questions. Thanks!

 

[Madwand1]

If I was going to this much trouble in quest of stability, I'd (1) double-check the backup plan -- is maintaining 2 TB on DVD really viable? How long would a full restore take? How could I be sure that the DVDs would be good? (2) Consider ECC RAM (3); RAID 6 (as mentioned); (4) A more stable-target OS (no offense intended to FC, but perhaps there's a more stable "distro" out there for such a role).

My own solution to problem (1) was to build an entire (relatively inexpensive) second server for backup purposes. This puts a strain on the budget, so is worth thinking about up front. Large external drives might be more affordable and simpler solutions -- esp. over time as drive prices drop for higher capacities. I'd re-check the state of affairs in 6 months, for both the primary array and backup possibilities. In the best case, there could be additional / more affordable large backup options at that time.

 

[Twinpeaksr]

Currently everything is on DVD or CD, and there are a lot of disks (over 700 at least). My goal is to make a stable array so that I don't need to constantly back it up (before you start typing bare with me). A lot of the data that I am storing is multimedia files, and some large CAD files, about 30GB is general Data. The general data is the most crucial, that is what I need a backup of and I will have. I will have 2 systems that sync with the server and backup that data at set intervals, so that will take care of the critical. the rest of it, yes it would be a pain to have to do a rebuild, but if the system is stable and set, with the redundancy in the Array and the OS (whatever that may be) being stable, I don't see what would cause a catastrophic failure that would require a rebuild.

I am also working on setting up a VPN so that critical data is backed up to a system in a different physical location.

Hope it makes sense, I really don't want to backup 2TB to about 400DVD's!

I do plan to switch to ECC RAM, forgot the 1GB I have here is not DDR2 (doh!) other thoughts are mandriva for an OS. If you know of some highly stable ones that are also well supported by the hardware, that would be great! Thanks!

 

[Madwand1]

Originally posted by: Twinpeaksr
other thoughts are mandriva for an OS. If you know of some highly stable ones that are also well supported by the hardware, that would be great! Thanks!

I've only tried CentOS myself for this purpose, and found not-so-great support for my nVIDIA chipset at that time. I'm sure it's improved since, and you'd have better luck with an Intel chipset. There may be other better choices; it's hard to keep track. I'd suggest taking this question to the OS forum among others perhaps.

 

[Twinpeaksr]

I chose Fedora Core 5 because I know there are drivers for both the MB and the RAID card. I think it will get posted at some point to the OS guys, thanks for the info!

 

[Smokey0066]

well my box is together. i'm installing windows server 2k3 on there as i type this. i've only got 2 drives running raid1 on the onboard controller.

will pick up the controller with the 8 drives once i get the OS setup. hoping maybe a cheap drive deal comes up in the mean time.

thanks for the help guys..

oh one thing I got that wasn't on your list twin. I picked up 2 icydock sata backplane 5 drives in 3.. it looks great and has great airflow. I haven't tested the functionality of hotswap yet but i think it still a great way to mount that many drives in such a small box;i got a lianli 6077

 

[Twinpeaksr]

Thanks for the info, hope the new system screams! I Decided that I wanted to build it right, so I only have enough to build my Workstation now, server will have to wait till next year (sad really). But I was thinking of adding some backplanes to make things a little easier, I have some other things speced that I have also added.

Enjoy the powerhouse of your new server!