MythTV backend, OpenELEC_XBMC frontend... record series?

[mvbighead]

Anyone know the answer to this? I am getting the development started of building my HTPC DVR, and I have an Raspberry PI on the way to run as an OpenELEC front end (if sufficient, I'll buy more for other TVs, if not, I'll go with a ChromeBox).

Anyhoo, I am in the process of testing XBMC via my couch laptop. I have the EPG (tv guide), and everything is working great. Only thing I see missing is a 'record series' option.

I am thinking this may only be available through the MythTV frontend, but I suspect that is not available to run on a Raspberry Pi (maybe chromebox?).

Anyone know the answer to this? Thus far everything else is AWESOME. I recorded Jimmy Fallon last night for test purposes, and commercial skipping just worked. Fast forward/reverse were MUCH quicker than my DirecTV DVR, so an improvement there. I just really need a record series option as otherwise I'd have to manage recording programs on a daily basis.

I figure a Mythbuntu Front end is what I'll need, but I am sure hoping to avoid that if the Raspberry OpenELEC front end is sufficient.

 

[poofyhairguy]

So yeah, you need a PVR backend running somewhere on your network for the Live TV functionality in XBMC to work. Here are the options:

http://wiki.xbmc.org/index.php?title=PVR_recording_software

One option is MythTV if you want it all on the same box, then instead of using the Myth interface it just is part of your XBMC menu.

You are correct the Pi doesn't have nearly enough power to do MythTV right (especially if you want commercial skipping which you do). BUT if you want you can also just run one of those Windows backends on your desktop or something and have everything connect to that.

Honestly the big thing that stands out to me is that NOTHING sub-4K is harder to play back than the 1080i stream you get from live TV. I know the Pi has MPEG2 decoding built in, but deinterlacing that kind of content pushes my GT 430s to their max and is WAY past what my ION2 boxes can do. I think those 1080i streams would eat a Pi alive, but maybe it has a built-in deinterlacer too.

If the Pi doesn't work, I would go with a Chromebox for playback no matter what PVR backend you use. The only issue with doing it all on a Chromebox is the small 16GB of space would suck for PVRing and I HATE relying on external drives for something like that. Optimally you have some other non-primary HTPC doing the Myth backend job, connected to a Chromebox for playback (if the Pi chokes on CBS's stream, test it first).

 

[mvbighead]

Sorry, I wasn't very clear in the above.

I have MythTV backend running on a VM on my virtual host. The aim here is to buy a 2-3TB drive and store/record the video there. At this point, the MythTV backend has 3 CPU cores (3 core AMD 3.0GHz CPU unlocked to 4 cores running on the host), 4GB of RAM, and a modest disk until I purchase the video storage drive.

My concern above was that the only feature I am currently missing from the MythTV aspect is the ability to record a series. IE - "Record series - My Name is Earl - All episodes" The XBMC interface allows me to view the program guide and view the live streams just fine, but I other than scheduling individual recordings, I cannot record a series.

In short, my only option is to check in every week and manually select 'Record episode blah on 7/15/2014 at 7pm on Fox'. I'd like the ability to schedule series recordings from the front end.

Hope that helps clear up my question.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Hope that helps clear up my question.

Sure does, I will be honest though if you aren't able to do it under the "Advanced Settings" then maybe the plugin for that backend does not support it. Try asking the question here and maybe someone will know a way:

http://forum.xbmc.org/forumdisplay.php?fid=170

Another option is to pull up MythWeb in the browser, I know that is not slick.

Sorry I can't help more, I haven't tried to use a MythTV backend in years (I go back and forth between WMC- which I know can record series in XBMC- and Mediaportal). Maybe the trick that works for WMC will work for you:

http://wiki.xbmc.org/index.php?titl...7_recording_and_.27cancel.27_series_recording

 

[mvbighead]

If the Pi doesn't work, I would go with a Chromebox for playback no matter what PVR backend you use. The only issue with doing it all on a Chromebox is the small 16GB of space would suck for PVRing and I HATE relying on external drives for something like that. Optimally you have some other non-primary HTPC doing the Myth backend job, connected to a Chromebox for playback (if the Pi chokes on CBS's stream, test it first).

The one thing I wanted to determine was whether the Chromebox would be suitable to run MythTV frontend instead of OpenELEC/XBMC. Just wondering that bit as I would assume a MythTV frontend is capable of scheduling series recordings. Something has to as they list series recordings as an option for MythTV in some of the guides. I just don't see the option in XBMC from my laptop. Maybe the Pi will be different, but not sure.

 

[mvbighead]

Sure does, I will be honest though if you aren't able to do it under the "Advanced Settings" then maybe the plugin for that backend does not support it. Try asking the question here and maybe someone will know a way:

http://forum.xbmc.org/forumdisplay.php?fid=170

Another option is to pull up MythWeb in the browser, I know that is not slick.

Sorry I can't help more, I haven't tried to use a MythTV backend in years (I go back and forth between WMC- which I know can record series in XBMC- and Mediaportal). Maybe the trick that works for WMC will work for you:

http://wiki.xbmc.org/index.php?titl...7_recording_and_.27cancel.27_series_recording

Sweet. Thanks!

I'll have to see if that trick works for MythTV. From what I've used so far, I really like MythTV, I just need that record series option.

That, and if the Pi works well, I can have whole home DVR at all 3 TVs for a very low cost of $0 per month and an upfront cost of roughly $60 per TV. I suppose with XBMC I could do the same with Windows if I can't get MythTV to record series... just hoping to minimize costs as much as I can.

 

[poofyhairguy]

The one thing I wanted to determine was whether the Chromebox would be suitable to run MythTV frontend instead of OpenELEC/XBMC.

Hmmmmm......good question!!!

The answer is I think so. I know the Linux Intel Driver doesn't have all the de-interlacing options a Nvidia solution has, but geez that Chromebox has enough power to pretty much force anything to play.

So I go with yes it could probably do the job. In fact you could probably use Advanced Launcher to make it load MythTV right out of XBMC.

 

[mvbighead]

Crap... I think I missed something in all of this... MythWeb!!! You even pointed that out.

To be honest, I can deal with that. I think the wife can to if I create her a shortcut and send it to her. Going to try that out when I get home. She always has a tablet on hand so that may be more handy than using the front end to do it.

Truth be told, very rarely does one need to add a series, I just need a convenient place to do it from. I should have noticed your mention of that before. Oye. Well, so long as the Raspberry works from an OpenELEC standpoint, I may be set.

 

[mvbighead]

Hmmmmm......good question!!!

The answer is I think so. I know the Linux Intel Driver doesn't have all the de-interlacing options a Nvidia solution has, but geez that Chromebox has enough power to pretty much force anything to play.

So I go with yes it could probably do the job. In fact you could probably use Advanced Launcher to make it load MythTV right out of XBMC.

I may still consider this for one TV. I'll just have to see how the Raspberry goes.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I may still consider this for one TV. I'll just have to see how the Raspberry goes.

Please let me know if you wouldn't mind. I am very curious about that Pi playing 1080i content.

 

[simas]

I second the question on the how the Pi would work - very curious.

Also, in your set up - what do you use for tuners to feed Myth? I have set up Myth previously as a VM and later converted it to physical , my understanding is that to enable functionality like LiveTV seeking Myth continuously records and as such is a not a great match for VM functionality unless you do some form of direct access pass-through

My set up now is HD HomeRun for Tuner, WMC for desktop computers, and OpenElec on AppleTV1 for the box in the basement. works, wife acceptance is high.

 

[mvbighead]

The Pi should arrive today.

Currently using 1 HDHomeRun with OTA antenna feed. VM host is lightly used. CPU load when recording is nada (I assume post processing to remove commercials may spike the CPU). I'll eventually have a dedicated 3TB WD AV disk for video storage, but for the time being am using a RAID 10 using 4x250GB regular sata disks. That setups will have better write speed than a single disk for sure, but the IOPs so far are very low, so I am not anticipating any trouble.

Live feeds to the laptop were fine, but that has significantly more horsepower than the Raspberry (3rd or 4th gen i3 with 4GB of RAM). Am currently throwing test recordings at the VM to test load.

EDIT: I have seen several youtube feeds where people are using the Pi to live stream straight from the HomeRun with no issue, so I don't anticipate an issue, but again, my config may be different than theirs so who knows.

 

[mvbighead]

When I really sit back and think about it though, the Pi shouldn't be much different than the Roku... Not a lot of horsepower, but built in hardware that can handle the video playback. Now granted, the streams from Netflix and other remote provides may have different bit rates and types etc, but I would figure a locally connected source ought to be a lot smoother interface. At this point a lot of this is very much guesswork, but that'll end hopefully tonight when I get the Pi.

 

[mvbighead]

Hmm, newegg has the Seagate 4TB (ST4000DM000) for $135... I was leaning towards a WD (Purple I think), but 4 TB would be nice...

Reviews for the drive seem overall good, but not sure. Warranty is a year shorter... decisions.

EDIT: purple is surveillance... AV-GP is what I need. Newegg has the 3TB for 119. Probably going that route.

 

[poofyhairguy]

When I really sit back and think about it though, the Pi shouldn't be much different than the Roku... Not a lot of horsepower, but built in hardware that can handle the video playback.

You nailed it, it is exactly like a Roku.

The main difference is that a Roku will NEVER be fed an interlaced source from say Netflix or Hulu- the Roku just plays the very standard 480p+ h264 streams sent to it.

If you were just playing x264 mkvs all day the Pi's work great- my only worry is deinterlacing that video. It takes very certain dedicated hardware to do that, and if its done poorly the video looks like crap.

It is very easy to tell if it is working well, just watch CBS and see if the edges look like combs.

Hmm, newegg has the Seagate 4TB (ST4000DM000) for $135... I was leaning towards a WD (Purple I think), but 4 TB would be nice...

Reviews for the drive seem overall good, but not sure. Warranty is a year shorter... decisions.

EDIT: purple is surveillance... AV-GP is what I need. Newegg has the 3TB for 119. Probably going that route.

I was a huge Seagate fanboy, then I had three of the last six I bought die on me last month (screwed up my array). Now I am WD all the way....

 

[mvbighead]

You nailed it, it is exactly like a Roku.

The main difference is that a Roku will NEVER be fed an interlaced source from say Netflix or Hulu- the Roku just plays the very standard 480p+ h264 streams sent to it.

If you were just playing x264 mkvs all day the Pi's work great- my only worry is deinterlacing that video. It takes very certain dedicated hardware to do that, and if its done poorly the video looks like crap.

It is very easy to tell if it is working well, just watch CBS and see if the edges look like combs.



I was a huge Seagate fanboy, then I had three of the last six I bought die on me last month (screwed up my array). Now I am WD all the way....

Seagate was good to me for some time, and the 7200.12 drives were very good to me. Sounds like they've dropped off since the flooding I guess.

WD seems to be highly regarded everywhere. Newegg had the AV-GP 3TB for 119 so I just bought that and will hope it arrives this week.

All in all, the 250GB 7200.12 Seagates in the RAID array I have have been good, as have the 3 500GB 7200.12 drives in my and my wife's machines, just the recent reviews don't seem as gleaming as they once were.

EDIT: And I have no idea yet on the interlacing piece. I've seen that folks stream straight from the homeruns though, so I am hoping for good results.

 

[mvbighead]

On the topic of deinterlacing, this seems to suggest they have implemented something that will do the job:

http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=18096&p=182057

They referred to it as bob deinterlacing, not entirely sure what that is, but this was posted in 2012 so I would imagine this is already tested well, but again, won't find out till I get the stuff setup and testing.

 

[poofyhairguy]

On the topic of deinterlacing, this seems to suggest they have implemented something that will do the job:

http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=18096&p=182057

They referred to it as bob deinterlacing, not entirely sure what that is, but this was posted in 2012 so I would imagine this is already tested well, but again, won't find out till I get the stuff setup and testing.

Bob/weave is basic level deinterlacing, but that could be enough!

 

[Aikouka]

Hmm, newegg has the Seagate 4TB (ST4000DM000) for $135... I was leaning towards a WD (Purple I think), but 4 TB would be nice...

I use one or two of those Seagate drives, and they work just fine. I did have a 3TB Seagate drive die on me recently, but I'm pretty sure that was my fault for stuffing a 3.5" HDD into a fanless (silent) case as DVR storage.

 

[mvbighead]

Got openelec installed last night, but didn't get my MPG2 key until late night. Did some brief testing in the morning and live TV played back fine.

I suspect I have a vsync issue as during lots of panning, there is some horizontal tearing, but overall the picture quality is excellent on a 60" screen when the image has just a little movement.

Unfortunately, I was not able to get CEC to work yet, so I was controlling things by a USB mouse. I'll either figure out the CEC piece tonight or install the IR dongle that I bought with it. I figured the IR dongle wouldn't be needed with CEC, so I didn't bother installing it, but it's looking like I may end up using it.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Got openelec installed last night, but didn't get my MPG2 key until late night. Did some brief testing in the morning and live TV played back fine.

Awesome! Thanks for the follow up and congratulations on getting it all to work!!!

 

[mvbighead]

I'm wondering if something like this would have more oomph from a useability standpoint:

http://www.amazon.com/RK3188-Quad-co...ords=chromebox

Some users report playing back 1080P HD without issue after recent firmware fixes, etc. Not sure if it was be as user friendly as the Pi from a DVR interface standpoint, but 2Gb instead of 512MB, 4 core 1.6Ghz instead of a single 700/800 whatever. As long as the video play back is clean, i don't care, and the price is pretty much the same.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Personally I am not a huge fan of Android XBMC clients. You run into the same issue as Pi (most everything including the best plugins are developed for x86) without the same community that backs the Pi. So there is potential for regression in use, despite a little more power.

If I personally was going to buy an ARM device for XBMC, I would pick one with LOTS of community support like a FireTV. That way I have answers if I hit snags and I know future XBMC Android builds will take my device into account.

Honestly 1.6ghz seems like a lot, but a Haswell Celeron (like in the Chromebox) will eat it alive. ARM devices like this aren't powerful enough to be a clear improvement over a Pi in the three areas a Pi is lacking- CPU decoding support, third party plugin support and better skin support. The clear upgrade from a Pi (as in you can then play ANY file, use ANY plugin, use ANY skin) is the Chromebox, but then that is twice as much.

Are you having issues with the interface performance? If so maybe the best course of action is a lighter skin. My favorite XBMC skin for lower-powered clients is Bello, but I will be honest I have not tested it with PVR support.

 

[mvbighead]

Personally I am not a huge fan of Android XBMC clients. You run into the same issue as Pi (most everything including the best plugins are developed for x86) without the same community that backs the Pi. So there is potential for regression in use, despite a little more power.

If I personally was going to buy an ARM device for XBMC, I would pick one with LOTS of community support like a FireTV. That way I have answers if I hit snags and I know future XBMC Android builds will take my device into account.

Honestly 1.6ghz seems like a lot, but a Haswell Celeron (like in the Chromebox) will eat it alive. ARM devices like this aren't powerful enough to be a clear improvement over a Pi in the three areas a Pi is lacking- CPU decoding support, third party plugin support and better skin support. The clear upgrade from a Pi (as in you can then play ANY file, use ANY plugin, use ANY skin) is the Chromebox, but then that is twice as much.

Are you having issues with the interface performance? If so maybe the best course of action is a lighter skin. My favorite XBMC skin for lower-powered clients is Bello, but I will be honest I have not tested it with PVR support.

I've read turning the RSS feed off helps tremendously, so i'll be doing that when I get back.

And, it isn't terribly slow, but I'd figure something with a little more horsepower would be nice. I do agree that the backing of the Pi is ginormous, so I've been hesitant to try something else. The simply thing is that the android box has a LOT more power and the cost is roughly the same, and WiFi is included (I gave $65, so an extra $15 is nothing I'll worry about)

 

[poofyhairguy]

The problem with ARM is that each SoC is different, and many require custom XBMC builds to work with hardware decoding. Even then not all features get into every build due to SoC issues, and there is always the potential that they next major XBMC release will never have a build that works for you if you pick an unpopular device.

For example, the FireTV- by far the most popular non-Apple ARM device- still can't decode MPEG2 in hardware (which is terrible for your PVR stuff):

http://wiki.xbmc.org/index.php?title=Amazon_Fire_TV#Known_issues

That is pretty common for these Android devices to miss that feature or this one. I am not saying don't go with an ARM device, just be careful that it might not be a 100% upgrade from the Pi due to a more splintered development community.

I agree turning off RSS can help, but the default Confluence skin is kinda a pig. Gotham Bello has PVR support in the list:

http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=196205

I would try it out. It is snappy on my AppleTV 1 for crying out loud!!!