My theory on Donald Trump. He's functionally illiterate.

[HomerJS]

First the definition

Functional illiteracy is reading and writing skills that are inadequate "to manage daily living and employment tasks that require reading skills beyond a basic level".[1] Functional illiteracy is contrasted with illiteracy in the strict sense, meaning the inability to read or write simple sentences in any language.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy

Evidence:
Its been stated MANY times Trump refuses to read his own Presidential briefings. Those briefings are long and complicated. The latest person to confirm this was Rex Tillerson a few days ago.
https://boingboing.net/2018/12/07/trump-is-not-only-a-moron.html

His in person briefings have to be dumbed down to an elementary school level. I've read this many times but here is one example.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ds-Trump-reads-understand-complex-issues.html

We've all heard his speech pattern without a script. He talks in very simple phrases and repeats thing MANY times. Sometimes three times in a sentence.

We all know the tweets he sends just by the grammar and spelling

The final piece of evidence for me was on display at the Bush funeral. At one point everyone was given text to read called Apostles' Creed. Trump was called by my a soulless creep for not participating but I looked again when Melania didn't read either. I don't think Trump was capable of reading it. He probably didn't know that would happen and he wouldn't have been able to rehearse. The cameras would have picked up on him muttering gibberish and it would have become another one of those big but highly embarrassing stories. Melania gave him cover by not reading as well.

Anyone agree?

 

[TheVrolok]

In the beginning I honestly thought not, that he may not be brilliant, but that a lot of it was just shtick... Now though? Unfortunately I'm inclined to agree with you.

 

[Mike64]

I'm not sure I'd go quite so far as actual "functional illiteracy". (To be fair, Presidential briefings aren't exactly what "daily living and employment tasks" is intended to encompass.) But like TheVrolok (though I think at a much lower level), I have to admit it seems he's even dumber than I thought he was (and trust me, that's really saying something). His so-called "genius" for deal-making was always an all-too-obvious sick joke and his overall IQ seemed about at "hungover, rich-kid fratboy coasting through college at gentleman's C level before daddy gives him a job after graduation", but I kind of figured he had to have at least a few brain cells firing in some sort of semi-coordinated fashion. But it's been pretty obvious for quite a while now that even that was giving him the benefit of more doubt than he was due...

I know the idea has been bruited about, but at this point even I'm almost tempted to wonder if he's suffering from the early stages of some form of dementia (personally, I'd always assumed he was just kind of dim and lacked any semblance of social skills) But unlike Reagan, everything he's been doing is pretty much in "lifelong character" judging from what there was of his earlier public behavior - he's just - er - behaving so much more publicly, so much more continuously, in a much less controlled/filtered setting than before...

 

[Fanatical Meat]

In the beginning I honestly thought not, that he may not be brilliant, but that a lot of it was just shtick... Now though? Unfortunately I'm inclined to agree with you.

Similar here, I originally thought he was feigning being stupid and when I first heard the claim he could be functionally illiterate I thought it was silly.
I’m not so sure I was right, I am really starting to think Trump is functionally illiterate.
He can’t follow a TelePrompTer
He can’t stay on course with a prepared speech that is more than a few sentences
Many people say he wants bullet point briefings

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Per Joe Scarborough, when he sort of supported Trump

Mika Brzezinski and I had a tense meeting with Trump following what I considered to be a bumbling debate performance in September 2015. I asked the candidate a blunt question.

"Can you read?"
Awkward silence.
"I'm serious, Donald. Do you read?" I continued. "If someone wrote you a one-page paper on a policy, could you read it?"
Taken aback, Trump quietly responded that he could while holding up a Bible given to him by his mother. He then joked that he read it all the time.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...b90a706e175_story.html?utm_term=.e4dccabc115c

 

[Commodus]

I know the idea has been bruited about, but at this point even I'm almost tempted to wonder if he's suffering from the early stages of some form of dementia (personally, I'd always assumed he was just kind of dim and lacked any semblance of social skills) But unlike Reagan, everything he's been doing is pretty much in "lifelong character" judging from what there was of his earlier public behavior - he's just - er - behaving so much more publicly, so much more continuously, in a much less controlled/filtered setting than before...

I'm not sure if it's dementia, but there does appear to be evidence of a cognitive decline. Go back 20 years and you'll see Trump speaking more eloquently. I mean, he was still a narcissist who made his fortune through inheritance and tax fraud, but you at least got the sense that he knew exactly what he was doing. Now? He's a 10-year-old in an ill-fitting suit.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I like to think of Trump as a horse in a hospital, and they are illiterate.

 

[zinfamous]

Well, the two people that wrote his books have more or less testified that he is, indeed, quite illiterate. Shockingly so: no hyperbole. He functionally can not read. It's behavior that manifests in his inability to sit and think, pay attention, for more than five minutes. That is literally true.

Just listen to the people that have actually worked with him. The guy has the mind of a 5 year old. That isn't hyperbole.

The dude that actually wrote Art of the Deal, had a few dozen early meetings with the Orange One in his office in TT. They lasted about 10 minutes each (the actual meeting time: the rest was watching Trump cut out magazine and news clippings where his name was mentioned, and make collages--literally true. That is on his daily schedule. I'm guessing that safety scissors were involved). The meetings ended pretty early on, because there was nothing to be gained by them. The dude that wrote the book, actually stopped meeting with Trump before he started putting down the first draft.

Think about Elaine's meetings with J Peterman, when she was tapped to write his autobiography in those Sienfeld episodes. It was that situation, but more surreal. Trump didn't give a damn about the truth, like Peterman, but he also didn't know how to sit, listen, or read any notes that were given to him. The guy is the literal definition of a moron.

 

[zinfamous]

I'm not sure I'd go quite so far as actual "functional illiteracy". (To be fair, Presidential briefings aren't exactly what "daily living and employment tasks" is intended to encompass.) But like TheVrolok (though I think at a much lower level), I have to admit it seems he's even dumber than I thought he was (and trust me, that's really saying something). .

Dude. His daily intelligence briefing has been condensed down to a single page, with Ikea info-graphics. There are basically 5 words on our POTUS's daily Intelligence briefing. THe information is spoken to him, and he allots something like 5 or 10 minutes to the entire briefing, including the one page summary that is handed to him.

This is true.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...396801049ef_story.html?utm_term=.05e614747842
https://www.usnews.com/opinion/thom...-doesnt-read-his-daily-intelligence-briefings
https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...dbb23c75d82_story.html?utm_term=.d22226d028be

At least Bush allowed up to 5 pages, IIRC (typed words). Obama's format averaged out at 12 pages per day.

 

[trenchfoot]

He must be a knucklehead because he had the highest office in the land in the tiny palm of his tiny hands given to him by a bunch of folks who would believe every single lie he's ever told them and yet here he is chin deep in the worst stink'in shit any POTUS could ever get themselves in.

 

[whm1974]

I wonder if he will only be save from prison due to being mentally unfit to stand trial? Geez I don't what is worse. prison or getting committed to a mental facility?

 

[Jaskalas]

The problem with Trump is he was the only person on national stage to speak to our people at THEIR level.
Not all of us.... but far far too many.

 

[trenchfoot]

The problem with Trump is he was the only person on national stage to speak to our people at THEIR level.
Not all of us.... but far far too many.

He used their loyalty to party to get them to bite the bait he put out there, and then he hook'ed 'um, crook'ed 'um and cooked 'um by appealing to nothing other than their raw gut emotions using nothing other than lie upon lie stacked on more lies of which to this very day they have had to ignore every single thing Trump has screwed up and down to keep on believing the lies.

That loyalty and those lies he told are now being sorely tested the more the facts and the truths of Trump's and his associate's malfeasance gets exposed. It's going to get to the point where there will be nothing left to believe in Trump and the only thing that's going to be keeping the Repub Party in any semblance of an organized defense of party is the hate and fear of the Democrats they were all instilled with by their party leadership for decades and assuredly on into the future.

The Repub Party has given their constituency what they were told was good for them like trickle down economics that only makes the rich ever more richer at the expense of the working class and the poor. Or that any kind of gov't program that gives the working class affordable health care is a really bad thing. Or that getting rid of or privatizing every entitlement and benefit the gov't now provides to the working class is going to somehow benefit them in the long run. Or that giving the wealthy tax cuts they don't need is going to create jobs and bring so many other really fantastic things that only the Repub Party can bring them but never ever have or will, of which has already been proven by the latest round of tax cuts the Repubs have blessed the wealthy with.

I agree with you that the level of which Trump has spoken to those that have come to support him is part of his success story, but that "level" has been exploited and corrupted from perpetrating a monumental con job on the populace of which is being brought to light every time Mueller convicts, indicts or turns another one of Trump's associates.

 

[Mike64]

The problem with Trump is he was the only person on national stage to speak to our people at THEIR level.

I have to admit I never thought I'd be quoting this in my own lifetime (or at least not my own middle age), but it's not like no one saw this coming, and, well, things don't always work out the way you expect them to:

We move toward a lofty ideal. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the​

land will reach their heart’s desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a​

downright moron." HL Mencken (Baltimore Evening Sun, July 26, 1920)​

​

Go back 20 years and you'll see Trump speaking more eloquently … least got the sense that he knew exactly what he was doing. Now? He's a 10-year-old in an ill-fitting suit.

"Eloquence" isn't a word I've ever associated with him, and "exactly what he was doing" is a long stretch, but you've got a point. At least he didn't actually sound like his IQ was no more than slightly below literal average. Or as Zinfamous put it, like he "has the mind of a 5 year old." (And not a terribly bright 5 year old, I'll add.)

Dude. His daily intelligence briefing has been condensed down to a single page, with Ikea info-graphics. There are basically 5 words on our POTUS's daily Intelligence briefing. … At least Bush allowed up to 5 pages, IIRC (typed words).

OK, OK, y'all have convinced me. I guess I really am a hopelessly (or maybe desperately) optimistic idealist. It would be ridiculous to even think of Obama, or Clinton, or Bush Senior, or for that matter any President in living memory at the same time as Trump (including pre-Alzheimer's-Reagan, who was politically-adept but never what you might call an "intellect", or even Dubya in all his fratboy glory). I guess I was giving Trump what little "credit" Dubya deserves. Probably because until his Presidential campaign I tried to ignore his existence as an actual person as much as humanly possible. Living in NYC, I couldn't ignore his business-related shenanigans, but that didn't require really thinking about him per se.

 

[UNCjigga]

I used to think he was smarter when he was younger...even a decade ago...and his mind is being slowly whittled away. Not dementia, senility or anything like that--he still manages to keep his basic wits about him. But he acts like a man who stopped reading and learning a few decades back and let his mind go to waste. Supposedly he never drinks alcohol, never smoked, and those should be positives for him?

So yeah, I just thought he wasn't the same man he was in the early aughts... but now I wonder whether we ever truly got to see the man he is until now??

 

[Mike64]

but now I wonder whether we ever truly got to see the man he is until now??

Yeah, that's pretty much the conclusion I've come to myself. Not only did we see and hear from him on a non-continuous basis, he didn't run off at the mouth about "politics in general" all that much back then, and his public image was massively propped up by city and state politicians at the time. People laugh at his book now (not to mention his "reality show"), but for a lo-ong time the general public ate that shit up by the bucketful... And especially if you're weak-minded and pathologically egotistical to begin with, that's really not going to have a positive impact.

 

[HomerJS]

I'm not sure I'd go quite so far as actual "functional illiteracy". (To be fair, Presidential briefings aren't exactly what "daily living and employment tasks" is intended to encompass.) But like TheVrolok (though I think at a much lower level), I have to admit it seems he's even dumber than I thought he was (and trust me, that's really saying something). His so-called "genius" for deal-making was always an all-too-obvious sick joke and his overall IQ seemed about at "hungover, rich-kid fratboy coasting through college at gentleman's C level before daddy gives him a job after graduation", but I kind of figured he had to have at least a few brain cells firing in some sort of semi-coordinated fashion. But it's been pretty obvious for quite a while now that even that was giving him the benefit of more doubt than he was due...

I know the idea has been bruited about, but at this point even I'm almost tempted to wonder if he's suffering from the early stages of some form of dementia (personally, I'd always assumed he was just kind of dim and lacked any semblance of social skills) But unlike Reagan, everything he's been doing is pretty much in "lifelong character" judging from what there was of his earlier public behavior - he's just - er - behaving so much more publicly, so much more continuously, in a much less controlled/filtered setting than before...

I have a hard time understanding how reading a Presidential daily briefing is not an employment function of the President

 

[interchange]

I think his capacities, although not remarkable on a purely intellect level, depend greatly upon his interest in what is being presented to him. It seems that interest correlates only to 1. what makes him look powerful or 2. what makes others look weak. The connection to those interests must be obvious and direct. In many ways Trump certainly has mental acumen, but not ways that are particularly academic. It is probable that he was more able to engage in topics that aren't directly tired to his immediate self interest in the past, although if you listen to his previous interviews where he comes across as competent, it is obvious he's taking any subject presented to him and transforming it into some way he sees things differently. He attributes that perspective to superiority, and when he hits the mark, it provides powerful confirmation bias. As has been demonstrated before, he'd likely be in similar or superior financial position should he have conservatively invested his inheritance instead of playing businessman. That's especially remarkable because of how much he has cheated. All that said, I don't see him as a failure in business. A criminal, blight, damaging to the community, but not a failure. He's gained an awful lot out of his ventures that isn't measurable in dollars.

 

[Mike64]

I have a hard time understanding how reading a Presidential daily briefing is not an employment function of the President

Yes, of course, but the definition of "functional illiteracy" isn't a sliding-scale measurement like "competency at one's chosen profession". It's a much more fundamental "average Joe and Jane Schmoe on the street" sort of concept. Even if you can't make much sense of an article in the NY Post or Fox News blog, if you can manage to open a bank account, fill out a job application, and file a short form tax return - even with some degree of assistance - you're not what's conventionally meant by "functionally illiterate".

 

[HomerJS]

Yeah, that's pretty much the conclusion I've come to myself. Not only didn't we see and hear from him on a non-continuous basis, he didn't run off at the mouth about "politics in general" all that much back then, and his public image was massively propped up city and state politicians at the time. People laugh at his book now (not to mention his "reality show"), but for a lo-ong time the general public ate that shit up by the bucketful... And especially if you're weak-minded and pathologically egotistical to begin with, that's really not going to have a positive impact.

And therein lies the real problem. If someone sticks their hand in a tiger cage and gets it mauled off is it the tigers fault?

Most of us easily saw Trump for what he is. Are all those "weak-minded" people who voted for him really that gullible, a big F.U. to the system or was Hillary hate that palpable to the point people voted for someone so obviously unqualified?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I think his capacities, although not remarkable on a purely intellect level, depend greatly upon his interest in what is being presented to him. It seems that interest correlates only to 1. what makes him look powerful or 2. what makes others look weak. The connection to those interests must be obvious and direct. In many ways Trump certainly has mental acumen, but not ways that are particularly academic. It is probable that he was more able to engage in topics that aren't directly tired to his immediate self interest in the past, although if you listen to his previous interviews where he comes across as competent, it is obvious he's taking any subject presented to him and transforming it into some way he sees things differently. He attributes that perspective to superiority, and when he hits the mark, it provides powerful confirmation bias. As has been demonstrated before, he'd likely be in similar or superior financial position should he have conservatively invested his inheritance instead of playing businessman. That's especially remarkable because of how much he has cheated. All that said, I don't see him as a failure in business. A criminal, blight, damaging to the community, but not a failure. He's gained an awful lot out of his ventures that isn't measurable in dollars.

While I cannot nor want to hate the man I do believe he is at his core an example of the worst of humanity. At the end of it all from a complex emotional perspective, what's the dominant sense? One of true pity even though I know what he says, does and represents. Strange perhaps, but there it is.

 

[HomerJS]

Yes, of course, but the definition of "functional illiteracy" isn't a sliding-scale measurement like "competency at one's chosen profession". It's a much more fundamental "average Joe and Jane Schmoe on the street" sort of concept. Even if you can't make much sense of an article in the NY Post or Fox News blog, if you can manage to open a bank account, fill out a job application, and file a short form tax return - even with some degree of assistance - you're not what's conventionally meant by "functionally illiterate".

I hear what you are saying. However there is other evidence out there, some I didn't know until the replies in the thread that buttress my theory.

I think anyone who is not functionally illiterate could read the following without practice...

I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth.
I believe in Jesus Christ, God's only Son, our Lord,
who was conceived by the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried;
he descended to the dead.
On the third day he rose again;
he ascended into heaven,
he is seated at the right hand of the Father,
and he will come to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic Church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and the life everlasting. Amen.

 

[interchange]

While I cannot nor want to hate the man I do believe he is at his core an example of the worst of humanity. At the end of it all from a complex emotional perspective, what's the dominant sense? One of true pity even though I know what he says, does and represents. Strange perhaps, but there it is.

I'm not sure if you're asking me or sharing your own feelings. I believe, were Trump a patient of mine, I could have appropriate empathy for him to see his individual experience as tragedy. Interesting that you might feel the same even though you call that core the worst of humanity. I agree that it is human and universally so. And there is nothing universally human that I'd say is not something that isn't supposed to be part of us in some way or another.

 

[Mike64]

And therein lies the real problem. If someone sticks their hand in a tiger cage and gets it mauled off is it the tigers fault?

When it's actually a tiger, no. But when it's a "human tiger" above the age of, let's say, 8 years old and who isn't (literally) clinically insane (er, no further comment), I can't absolve the tiger of responsiblity, even though I agree that the people whose hands are mauled off have no right to "complain" about losing their hands due to their own sheer stupidity...

Are all those "weak-minded" people who voted for him really that gullible, a big F.U. to the system or was Hillary hate that palpable to the point people voted for someone so obviously unqualified?

I assume that's a rhetorical question? I don't think any of it was an "FU" to the system per se, but in answer to to options (a) and (c), I'll just say: "very few politicians have ever ruined their careers by betting heavily on the gullibility of the 'average voter' "...<vb sigh>

 

[HomerJS]

I'm not sure if you're asking me or sharing your own feelings. I believe, were Trump a patient of mine, I could have appropriate empathy for him to see his individual experience as tragedy. Interesting that you might feel the same even though you call that core the worst of humanity. I agree that it is human and universally so. And there is nothing universally human that I'd say is not something that isn't supposed to be part of us in some way or another.

I agree and would have sympathy for a person like this as a patient. However he emcompasses the worst in humanity and gives aid, comfort, support and amplifies the worst in Americans as a whole. Admittedly I hate all of it.