Must Read: .NET on Linux, Unix, and Mac

joohang

Lifer
Oct 22, 2000
12,340
1
0
http://scobleizer.manilasites.com/

My stupid MSDN download kept on getting cut off and giving me errors in the past few days. Now I'm trying to download VS.NET beta 2 again and desperate to install it.

I gotta verify this. :)

MS-haters: flame all you want, but I think this is fantastic.
 

lucidguy

Banned
Apr 24, 2001
396
0
0
It's a well-known fact that Microsoft's attacks on Open Source are meant to divert the attention and resources of the Open Source community. Microsoft may be scared of Open Source, but they are not scared enough to make a fool of themselves whining publicly. Obviously, their Big Lie campaign is to divert attention away from one of their other pursuits. However, it is not yet certain what this other pursuit is.

One possibility, as is shown in the article you linked, is that Microsoft will start producing .Net-compatible Linux software. Another possibility is that Microsoft is working with lawmakers to try to outlaw the GNU GPL or at least critical protections of the GNU GPL. Still another possibility is that Microsoft is trying to stall the development of Open Source server software that will directly compete with a comprehensive .Net-like infrastructure. Remember that, even six months ago, .Net was nothing but a buzzword. No one knew what .Net was or did or meant. Microsoft has a lot of product development to do, and they need to distract the Open Source community as much as possible in order to have enough time to get a meaningful head start before them.
 

BlvdKing

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2000
1,173
0
0
I'm confused. Why would we want .NET, a software subscription service, on our free OS? Please explain.
 

Psychoholic

Elite Member
Oct 11, 1999
2,704
0
76


<< It's a well-known fact that Microsoft's attacks on Open Source are meant to divert the attention and resources of the Open Source community. Microsoft may be scared of Open Source, but they are not scared enough to make a fool of themselves whining publicly. Obviously, their Big Lie campaign is to divert attention away from one of their other pursuits. However, it is not yet certain what this other pursuit is.

One possibility, as is shown in the article you linked, is that Microsoft will start producing .Net-compatible Linux software. Another possibility is that Microsoft is working with lawmakers to try to outlaw the GNU GPL or at least critical protections of the GNU GPL. Still another possibility is that Microsoft is trying to stall the development of Open Source server software that will directly compete with a comprehensive .Net-like infrastructure. Remember that, even six months ago, .Net was nothing but a buzzword. No one knew what .Net was or did or meant. Microsoft has a lot of product development to do, and they need to distract the Open Source community as much as possible in order to have enough time to get a meaningful head start before them.
>>



This is a stretch for even a conspiracy theorist. Did you ever stop to think that maybe Microsoft is like any other company in this country??? They want to make money. How does a company make money??? They make their product available to as large of a customer base as they can.

Lucid, maybe you would like to back up some of your possibilities before starting on one of your &quot;Microsoft is evil&quot; rants.

You know what I find ironic about many Linux users??? They call Windows users lemmings but they all line up right behind each other and chant &quot;Microsoft is evil&quot; every opportunity they get.

If you want to use Linux fine, be my guest. What the hell do I care??? It's your computer. However in most business circumstances I have seen Linux doesn't make good business sense right now for many reasons. So if it makes sense for you why not sit down and enjoy it and quit wasting your life coming up with new Microsoft conspiracy theories???
 

joohang

Lifer
Oct 22, 2000
12,340
1
0


<< I'm confused. Why would we want .NET, a software subscription service, on our free OS? Please explain. >>


&quot;Software subscription&quot; is what the media is spreading about .NET, but that is NOT what it is about.

In its most general definition, it is an updated version to Windows DNA with web services in mind. Read through some of the articles listed at: http://msdn.microsoft.com/net/.
 

BlvdKing

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2000
1,173
0
0
I am still confused about what .NET is. Are you happy that Microsoft is including Linux in it's plans? Will this somehow make the transition to a desktop OS easier for Linux? If so, why would Microsoft want to do that?
 

joohang

Lifer
Oct 22, 2000
12,340
1
0


<< I am still confused about what .NET is. Are you happy that Microsoft is including Linux in it's plans? Will this somehow make the transition to a desktop OS easier for Linux? If so, why would Microsoft want to do that? >>


It means that (theoretically) I can write a Windows application in C#, VB, or any language supported by .NET's Common Language Runtime (CLR), and transport it as a Linux application with minimal (or no) changes to the code.

Think Java compiled down to assembly code. :)
 

BlvdKing

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2000
1,173
0
0
I guess I'm a bit sceptical about this. Again, why would Microsoft want to make the transition to desktop easier for Linux? How will it make $$ of this? There has to be a catch...

EDIT: If it's true, this will be really nice.
 

joohang

Lifer
Oct 22, 2000
12,340
1
0
I'm not sure about their business reasons, but think about Java on Windows and then .NET in Linux. :)
 

MGMorden

Diamond Member
Jul 4, 2000
3,348
0
76
BlvdKing: MS doesn't really give a jack whether or not windows is the #1 desktop OS. Their main profits are made from MS Office, not Windows. Now if they can make their future stuff available for Windows AND Linux, then that's all the more money for them (and that's all they want: to make money).
 

odz

Senior member
Jan 10, 2001
491
0
0


<< BlvdKing: MS doesn't really give a jack whether or not windows is the #1 desktop OS. >>



I disagree. I think that MS beleives Windows must be preserved -almost- above all else, and that will bring about their demise,
Here's a quote from Neal Stephenson's In the Beginning Was the Command Line:



<< Why, then, do I say that Microsoft is not such a great operating systems company? Because the very nature of operating systems is such that it is senseless for them to be developed and owned by a specific company. It's a thankless job to begin with. Applications create possibilities for millions of credulous users, whereas OSes impose limitations on thousands of grumpy coders, and so OS-makers will forever be on the sh*t-list of anyone who counts for anything in the high-tech world. Applications get used by people whose big problem is understanding all of their features, whereas OSes get hacked by coders who are annoyed by their limitations. The OS business has been good to Microsoft only insofar as it has given them the money they needed to launch a really good applications software business and to hire a lot of smart researchers. Now it really ought to be jettisoned, like a spent booster stage from a rocket. The big question is whether Microsoft is capable of doing this. Or is it addicted to OS sales in the same way as Apple is to selling hardware?

Keep in mind that Apple's ability to monopolize its own hardware supply was once cited, by learned observers, as a great advantage over Microsoft. At the time, it seemed to place them in a much stronger position. In the end, it nearly killed them, and may kill them yet. The problem, for Apple, was that most of the world's computer users ended up owning cheaper hardware. But cheap hardware couldn't run MacOS, and so these people switched to Windows.

Replace &quot;hardware&quot; with &quot;operating systems,&quot; and &quot;Apple&quot; with &quot;Microsoft&quot; and you can see the same thing about to happen all over again. Microsoft dominates the OS market, which makes them money and seems like a great idea for now. But cheaper and better OSes are available, and they are growingly popular in parts of the world that are not so saturated with computers as the US. Ten years from now, most of the world's computer users may end up owning these cheaper OSes. But these OSes do not, for the time being, run any Microsoft applications, and so these people will use something else.

To put it more directly: every time someone decides to use a non-Microsoft OS, Microsoft's OS division, obviously, loses a customer. But, as things stand now, Microsoft's applications division loses a customer too. This is not such a big deal as long as almost everyone uses Microsoft OSes. But as soon as Windows' market share begins to slip, the math starts to look pretty dismal for the people in Redmond.

This argument could be countered by saying that Microsoft could simply re-compile its applications to run under other OSes. But this strategy goes against most normal corporate instincts.
Again the case of Apple is instructive. When things started to go south for Apple, they should have ported their OS to cheap PC hardware. But they didn't. Instead, they tried to make the most of their brilliant hardware, adding new features and expanding the product line. But this only had the effect of making their OS more dependent on these special hardware features, which made it worse for them in the end.

Likewise, when Microsoft's position in the OS world is threatened, their corporate instincts will tell them to pile more new features into their operating systems, and then re-jigger their software applications to exploit those special features. But this will only have the effect of making their applications dependent on an OS with declining market share, and make it worse for them in the end.
>>




 

BlvdKing

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2000
1,173
0
0
odz,
that's a good read and makes alot of sense. Microsoft doesn't have the rocks to let thier dominince of the OS scene slip away in favor of creating applications for multiple OS's. Windows XP is a prime example of this...
 

joohang

Lifer
Oct 22, 2000
12,340
1
0
odz, excellent quote. Very interesting points.

I expected a lot of anti-MS flaming in this thread, but I see quite a few intelligent posts today. This is nice. Keep it up, please. :)