Muslims riot and kill 50 at Miss World pageant

[SnapIT]

Originally posted by: bizmark
Look all you jackasses, READ THIS, I don't want to repeat it again. The Christian religion has, in the past, been just as closed-minded, jackassed, backwards, repressive, oppressive, violent, and deadly as Islam is today. I'm willing to bet that the number of desires repressed, beauty pageants cancelled, violent crimes committed, and innocent people killed in the name of Christianity (whether rightly or wrongly) throughout history outnumbers the number of desires/pageants/crimes/deaths in the name of Islam (whether rightly or wrongly).

Also, FYI, Lot had children through his incestual relationship with his two daughters, and many other biblical figures had multiple wives, some of them quite young by today's standards. This was the cultural norm back then, and to judge their actions by our modern standards is a fallacy.

In other words, anything that you can say to disparage the religion of Islam, you can equally apply to the religions of Christianity and Judiasm. So check your own house's glass content before you start throwing stones.

WHAM! THANK YOU Bizmark! in a few sentences you said what i tried to... but i have longer quotations so i win anyway... 😀

 

[SnapIT]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: SnapIT

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: SnapIT

Originally posted by: snooker

Originally posted by: SnapITYes, and when reading here how americans want to nuke and kill all muslims... it makes me think that americans are soooo peaceful....

Why not say that blacks did this, them blame all blacks? or whatever? Does the label matter? Of course it does... propaganda makes it matter...

I'm gonna say this now, let's see if i am right in march... no matter what Iraq does, no matter what does or does not turn up, US is going to war with Iraq, not because of anything else than because they feel like it...

What does the color Black have to do with anything?

As for Iraq, only Saddam Hussein can control if his country goes to war or not. He needs to take the UN seriously when reporting his WMD's. Yes the Current US Government is looking for a reason to goto war with iraq, the last thing Iraq needs to do is give them reason to. But if the US Government wanted to goto war with Iraq, why haven't they already??? The US truly does want peace, but can and will use force when the situation warrants that.

What i say is... NO matter what Saddam does, no matter if he follows the regulations perfectly, the US will attack... they will find some excuse (outside of what the UN has told Iraq)...

That is what i say, let's sit back.. and remember this in march... if it doesn't happen, i will apologize for being wrong and thinking that... if i'm right... you do what you want...

The US does NOT want peace... if you truly believe that... well... then you do... the rest of the world does not believe the propaganda...

Snap, that's not a bet I'd take. Because no matter how many rules Sadam breaks, you'll jump in with "SEE! I told you so!"

It's a given by most of the world that Sadam will NOT follow the rules. He hasn't once in 11 years, why would he start now? That's why the UN didn;t want to back the resolution. They knew Sadam would never abide by it. That's why France wanted loophole after loophole and every Get out of Jail Free card added to the resolution.

No, i won't, if he breaks ONE rule.. that is enough for me... but that has to be one of the rules that the UN stated, no other rule... ok?

Why would he start now? hmmm... because he KNOWS what will happen if he don't...

We'll see what happens... and you have got the wrong idea about me... i do not NEED to be right no matter what...

OK, We'll see. But remember, he had MONTHS of warning last time, and did nothing. I don't think he's completely rational.

Saddam not being rational? heh... well, i don't think so either... Saddam wanting to stay in the position he's in? i believe that...

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: bizmark
Look all you jackasses, READ THIS, I don't want to repeat it again. The Christian religion has, in the past, been just as closed-minded, jackassed, backwards, repressive, oppressive, violent, and deadly as Islam is today. I'm willing to bet that the number of desires repressed, beauty pageants cancelled, violent crimes committed, and innocent people killed in the name of Christianity (whether rightly or wrongly) throughout history outnumbers the number of desires/pageants/crimes/deaths in the name of Islam (whether rightly or wrongly).

Also, FYI, Lot had children through his incestual relationship with his two daughters, and many other biblical figures had multiple wives, some of them quite young by today's standards. This was the cultural norm back then, and to judge their actions by our modern standards is a fallacy.

In other words, anything that you can say to disparage the religion of Islam, you can equally apply to the religions of Christianity and Judiasm. So check your own house's glass content before you start throwing stones.

If you are living in the past what you say is true. We are living in the present and are having to deal with the religion that has not and seems unlikely to reform itself as the Christian church has done.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: bizmark
Look all you jackasses, READ THIS, I don't want to repeat it again. The Christian religion has, in the past, been just as closed-minded, jackassed, backwards, repressive, oppressive, violent, and deadly as Islam is today. I'm willing to bet that the number of desires repressed, beauty pageants cancelled, violent crimes committed, and innocent people killed in the name of Christianity (whether rightly or wrongly) throughout history outnumbers the number of desires/pageants/crimes/deaths in the name of Islam (whether rightly or wrongly).

Also, FYI, Lot had children through his incestual relationship with his two daughters, and many other biblical figures had multiple wives, some of them quite young by today's standards. This was the cultural norm back then, and to judge their actions by our modern standards is a fallacy.

In other words, anything that you can say to disparage the religion of Islam, you can equally apply to the religions of Christianity and Judiasm. So check your own house's glass content before you start throwing stones.

Biz, take a stress pill.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: bizmark
Look all you jackasses, READ THIS, I don't want to repeat it again. The Christian religion has, in the past, been just as closed-minded, jackassed, backwards, repressive, oppressive, violent, and deadly as Islam is today. I'm willing to bet that the number of desires repressed, beauty pageants cancelled, violent crimes committed, and innocent people killed in the name of Christianity (whether rightly or wrongly) throughout history outnumbers the number of desires/pageants/crimes/deaths in the name of Islam (whether rightly or wrongly).

Also, FYI, Lot had children through his incestual relationship with his two daughters, and many other biblical figures had multiple wives, some of them quite young by today's standards. This was the cultural norm back then, and to judge their actions by our modern standards is a fallacy.

In other words, anything that you can say to disparage the religion of Islam, you can equally apply to the religions of Christianity and Judiasm. So check your own house's glass content before you start throwing stones.

If you are living in the past what you say is true. We are living in the present and are having to deal with the religion that has not and seems unlikely to reform itself as the Christian church has done.

In all fairness, it took us nearly 2000 years to stop Christian atrocities.

 

[Kev]

The problem with Islam is that most of the people of that religion are still living in the stone age. The biggest reason Christianity has reformed itself is because Christians are actually part of a civilized society.

 

[bizmark]

Originally posted by: etech
If you are living in the past what you say is true. We are living in the present and are having to deal with the religion that has not and seems unlikely to reform itself as the Christian church has done.

yes, but all of this crap being flung at Mohammed, when he did the exact same thing that a lot of the key Biblical figures did.... it's just so.... retarded, hypocritical, dumb! Grrrrr.

Biz, take a stress pill.

LMAO! 😀

In all fairness, it took us nearly 2000 years to stop Christian atrocities.

exactly.

And if there's something that I've tried to communicate in this thread, and it's not exactly PC, it's that most Islamic societies are around 500 years behind us in terms of general 'enlightenment' as we know it. Let's not let that little fact escape us, okay?

 

[MrPALCO]

Few reasonable people would disagree that the Muslim community as a whole has a major public relations problem.


To start pointing fingers instead of doing something to change Muslim behavior, is not a solution.


A large number of people in the United States see Muslims as a group that can?t be trusted.

 

[hungrypete]

Originally posted by: SnapIT

Originally posted by: bizmark
Look all you jackasses, READ THIS, I don't want to repeat it again. The Christian religion has, in the past, been just as closed-minded, jackassed, backwards, repressive, oppressive, violent, and deadly as Islam is today. I'm willing to bet that the number of desires repressed, beauty pageants cancelled, violent crimes committed, and innocent people killed in the name of Christianity (whether rightly or wrongly) throughout history outnumbers the number of desires/pageants/crimes/deaths in the name of Islam (whether rightly or wrongly).

Also, FYI, Lot had children through his incestual relationship with his two daughters, and many other biblical figures had multiple wives, some of them quite young by today's standards. This was the cultural norm back then, and to judge their actions by our modern standards is a fallacy.

In other words, anything that you can say to disparage the religion of Islam, you can equally apply to the religions of Christianity and Judiasm. So check your own house's glass content before you start throwing stones.

WHAM! THANK YOU Bizmark! in a few sentences you said what i tried to... but i have longer quotations so i win anyway... 😀

Unfortunately your own logic is a fallacy. You see, in the past, people had no choice but to be ignorant. In modern times, there is no excuse for such ignorance, as the world as a whole is well informed. It's people like you who let murderers go over a technical detail. You don't realize it, but by defending thier actions you make yourself look equally ignorant.

Not that's not to say we should go and kill everyone from X religion. It just means we shouldn't put up with retarded excuses as to why someone is justified in killing an innocent.

 

[ZaneNBK]

Originally posted by: bizmark

Originally posted by: Amused

Well, it all boils down to reality. Are the westernized nations going to give up oil any time soon? Nope. So that's not even an option beyond idealistic dreams.

Get your head out of the clouds. "Free thinker" doesn't mean "irrational dreamer." 😛

ah, but you'll notice that I didn't say that we should give up oil, I just said that we should give up oil from Middle Eastern countries. Sure it's a sh|tload of the world's oil supply, but we could still get by, and maybe with that sort of impetus we'd start developing technologies to start weaning ourselves off of it.

BTW I acknowledged that the oil debate per se was not at all relevant to this discussion! I had an answer based on other factors....

Yes, but what do you think will happen when the Middle East is suddenly without any income? Those countries will sink deeper into poverty and violence will begin to look more and more attractive to the common man there. Basically we'd leave them with no choice but to attack or starve to death.

Yes, I realize not every country there is dependant upon oil income but a good number of the large ones are.

 

[BoberFett]

So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

That's what we were discussing this morning. The option to leave them alone is not open.

 

[Lucky]

christians arent innocent in this either, they torched and destroyed muslim businesses and mosques.

 

[MrPALCO]

Some marginal Muslim leaders have made half hearted attempts to soothe our outrage.


Standard procedure is to whine that the rest of the world has made is hard on Muslims, and that a wink and a nod at terrorists is justified. The fact is that Allah has not provided as the God of America has provided. They are disillusioned and confused even as they crawl over themselves to come to America.


It is time for real Muslim power brokers to appeal to their flock to abandon hate for America.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: MrPALCO
Some marginal Muslim leaders have made half hearted attempts to soothe our outrage.


Standard procedure is to whine that the rest of the world has made is hard on Muslims, and that a wink and a nod at terrorists is justified. The fact is that Allah has not provided as the God of America has provided. They are disillusioned and confused even as they crawl over themselves to come to America.


It is time for real Muslim power brokers to appeal to their flock to abandon hate for America.

That's about the first post you've made that I can agree with. Muslims and specifically, Muslim leaders world wide need to take a FAR more proactive stance against this crap, or the fear and suspicion will continue to grow.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BoberFett
So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

That's what we were discussing this morning. The option to leave them alone is not open.

Yes, but the lefties keep parroting the same line. "Christianity is just as bad" "We have no room to criticize" "Blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Peaceniks just don't get it. Maybe we could send all these peaceniks out to search for terrorists in the middle east to give them all a big hug, and tell them that they understand how the terrorists feel. We'll soon have far fewer hippies to worry about.

 

[MinorityReport]

Hmmm ... lots of interesting posts from people who have not been to a single moslem or third world country. ( apologise to those who been there )

Well you have no clue what is the "mob" mentality in third world nations.
And add to that, islam's 'kill the infedel' stature that adds fuel to the fire.

For example, Jerry Falwell made some remarks about the prophet Mohammed some time ago. In India, 20 people killed as muslims attacked Hindus and Hindus retalialed. How the hell are moslems in India bothered with what a whiskey tango conservative christian bigot has to say ??

Some time ago in US, specially in southern Bible belt, we had simlar lynchings of blacks and slaves. Do not forget whats been happeneing in our own backyard before we call othes uncivilized or living in stone age.

A nation that allowed segregation baed on skin color till 1960's ... has no right to point figers at bigots elsewhere. We have too many of those still .. living good lives.

America in early 1900's = most third world nations in 2002

Simple

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BoberFett
So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

That's what we were discussing this morning. The option to leave them alone is not open.

Yes, but the lefties keep parroting the same line. "Christianity is just as bad" "We have no room to criticize" "Blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Peaceniks just don't get it. Maybe we could send all these peaceniks out to search for terrorists in the middle east to give them all a big hug, and tell them that they understand how the terrorists feel. We'll soon have far fewer hippies to worry about.

Well, my point is, while we have every right to criticize their actions and take action against them, we have no right to condemn the entire religion because of those actions. My point is that if Christians want to base condemnation of an entire religion on atrocities, they better take a long hard look at the history of their own religion.

 

[hungrypete]

America in early 1900's = most third world nations in 2002

Ah yes and that justifies murder. Glad we could rationalize that one out!

You can't just say 'well bob in accounting did it so I am too and that's ok right?'. It doesn't work like that.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BoberFett
So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

That's what we were discussing this morning. The option to leave them alone is not open.

Yes, but the lefties keep parroting the same line. "Christianity is just as bad" "We have no room to criticize" "Blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Peaceniks just don't get it. Maybe we could send all these peaceniks out to search for terrorists in the middle east to give them all a big hug, and tell them that they understand how the terrorists feel. We'll soon have far fewer hippies to worry about.

Wow.. someone is confused. "Christians are bad too" is used to keep from appearing racist.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BoberFett
So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

That's what we were discussing this morning. The option to leave them alone is not open.

Yes, but the lefties keep parroting the same line. "Christianity is just as bad" "We have no room to criticize" "Blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Peaceniks just don't get it. Maybe we could send all these peaceniks out to search for terrorists in the middle east to give them all a big hug, and tell them that they understand how the terrorists feel. We'll soon have far fewer hippies to worry about.

Wow.. someone is confused. "Christians are bad too" is used to keep from appearing racist.

Last time I looked, there were Christians ans Muslims of all races. How could someone who hated Islam be "racist?"

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: hungrypete

America in early 1900's = most third world nations in 2002

Ah yes and that justifies murder. Glad we could rationalize that one out!

You can't just say 'well bob in accounting did it so I am too and that's ok right?'. It doesn't work like that.

In this case it's more like Bob's great grandfather did it so I can too.

 

[bizmark]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: BoberFett
So what do we do with the fact that Muslim countries have decided not to join us in the modern world? Do we shrug our shoulders, pat them on the head and say "boys will be boys"?

I'm not about to give them a hundred years to catch up with us. That'll be plenty of time for them to kill everyone.

That's what we were discussing this morning. The option to leave them alone is not open.

Right. I'm not the guy with all the answers, as much as I try to be 😀 This is certainly something that's up for discussion. For most of this thread I've been trying to get everyone to understand the *current* situation as I see it, and trying to get people's heads out of their asses about whether one religion is inherently more tolerant than another. (BTW I believe that a true, strong believer and follower of ANY religion will necessarily be very intolerant of other religions. At least for all the religious paradigms I've been exposed to.) What we do in the future is up for debate. I personally still believe that withdrawal, to the fullest extent possible -- a "live and let live" philosophy, would be best. Obviously there are those who disagree with me, and frankly I don't know if this can ever be decided. It's a very complicated situation, involving literally billions of people, and there won't be any simple solutions. *shrugs shoulders* I don't know.

 

[MrPALCO]

Sadly, there is no solution short of armed conflict.


That conflict will leave the God of America as the final victor.

 

[spaceman]

Originally posted by: MrPALCO
Sadly, their is no solution short of armed conflict.


That conflict will leave the God of America as the final victor.

Mr. Palco, while some of the things you say disturb me,i admire you for your unquenchable conviction.