MSNBC-Melissa Harris-Perry says "kids belong to whole communities"

[*kjm]

Liberal handbook: Make sure whenever you speak to say atleast 3 different things so incase you utter something everyone hates you can always claim that isn't what you meant because of the other 2 things you said.

That gave me a good laugh and you are so right. They keep turning down school choice and we are thinking of home schooling. It's the fastest growing school segment so they are going to get fate.....

 

[Pray To Jesus]

Lets assume that she was trying to make the point that an investment in our children is worth it.

So what are specific plans?

Obviously we have to deal with the problem of the high % of children born out of wedlock and raised by a single parent. How can we do that?

 

[*kjm]

Lets assume that she was trying to make the point that an investment in our children is worth it.

So what are specific plans?

Obviously we have to deal with the problem of the high % of children born out of wedlock and raised by a single parent. How can we do that?

There is our problem.

This is not always the problem but she makes it very clear it can become a problem very fast.

 

[nehalem256]

Lets assume that she was trying to make the point that an investment in our children is worth it.

So what are specific plans?

Obviously we have to deal with the problem of the high % of children born out of wedlock and raised by a single parent. How can we do that?

We make them everyone's children. Duh! ()

 

[Jaskalas]

i am all for "community" help. but never lose the fact i am the parent and i have the final say.

Do you? I can think of one case where you do not.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Do you? I can think of one case where you do not.

I don't see where the rabbi was arrested. The all-wonderful "community" protected him.

 

[monovillage]

Crap is what you bring to the threads You are what smells.

Come join us in DC!

You must accept our decision without further comment.

It is forbidden to comment.

 

[monovillage]

That's not really the case.
CK has actually surprised me with his stance on several issues. Every time I've convinced myself not to like him he goes and gets all reasonable. It's damned annoying when someone refuses to fit my preconceived notions.

I like pointing out that here CK is just another troll poster, he does here that which is forbidden in the DNC.
I will agree with you that on many subjects CK is pretty reasonable and can see both sides of an issue.

 

[davmat787]

Typical libtard mentality

You guys should be proud.

OMG... Did she really just say what I think she said? That someone needs to take responsibility and pay for all of her kids?

 

[Geosurface]

OMG... Did she really just say what I think she said? That someone needs to take responsibility and pay for all of her kids?

I would gladly "take responsibility" for her 15 kids.

 

[waggy]

Do you? I can think of one case where you do not.

err what does that have to do with me? i didn't post it, and i'm not Jewish

 

[1prophet]

Kids don't belong to anyone.

Her point is that society has an interest in ensuring that kids are taken care of properly, because they cannot do so themselves. Usually parents play this role, but when they fail at it, the community has to step in and take over.

Parents have failed, and two communities have taken over,

Hollywood/television that brainwash children into what to think, what to buy, what to believe, and to disdain intellectualism and critical thinking,

and their peers in the hood that they try to mimic to their detriment which some realize later in life.

 

[werepossum]

I believe what we see in this thread is a diffraction of ingrained conditioned reactions, different colors based on where one is on the political spectrum from left to right and in particular on the difference we have been trained and train ourselves to fell about the word community. As we can see, or at least some of us seem to, one need only mention the word community as in this thread and the conservative side of the political spectrum goes quite crazy.

The result, of course, is that the left and the right can't really have a meaningful discussion of community because they are reacting to different meanings and until that problem is thrashed out there can be no cross-understanding.

Everybody thinks he is right about his or her opinions because everybody thinks that what they believe is good, THE GOOD, actually so both the left and the right have good intentions. So each side will believe that disaster lies on the other side.

The right has many more moral standards they call morality than the left, 5 or 6 or more to basically 2. One of the strong factors on the right is team spirit, a sense of community loyalty, but only the community of us and not them. So basically liberals are universalists in their sense of community and conservatives are focused only on other people like them. Their community is the community of people who take care of themselves and live with personal responsibility so if you need something from others you're not one of them. You have a competing philosophy that they despise and this competitiveness amounts to hate. But if you are on their team and are a responsible person that is a known member, if you have needs they will gladly and willingly satisfy them if they can. Conservatives are generous people. They will do for you when they believe you would also do for them out of team identity.

Liberals believe that human evolution has been successful because we cooperated as a team against the natural world, but forget that we also competed against other tribes. They lack this moral sensibility that differentiates us from them. They see the human race as a whole as the team. To a conservative thinking this way is suicide, to a liberal tribal competition is suicide for the race. Until these fundamental unconscious biases are recognized and acknowledged, I don't think it makes much sense to discuss the meaning of what Melissa Harris-Perry said.

Some very good points there. I've said for years that one reason we have such difficulty debating between left and right is because we no longer have a common vocabulary. Now we're also seeing people argue that what someone very clearly said is not at all what he or she said and insisting that if you don't understand that you are stupid or dishonest. Yet how can anyone evaluate anything if the words used mean nothing? We cannot even agree on what people say, let alone which is the greater good. Given that, I see no hope no matter how many fundamental unconscious biases are recognized and acknowledged, because we literally have no words in common.

Have to make a new rule - all political debate must now be couched in mathematical equations.

And i think this is part of the problem. Parents of some of these kids NEVER intended to take care of them. The fact that they know that if they aren't doing what they're supposed to, SOMEONE will. Or they'll get paid every month from the state to care for them? Too much of a safety net. We have taken the concept of personal responsibility and thrown it out the window.... it's part of the Lefts Agenda . . .

Quite true, and Melissa Harris-Perry apparently wants to increase this tendency - unless you take the left's position that her words are actually without meaning.

Parents have failed, and two communities have taken over,

Hollywood/television that brainwash children into what to think, what to buy, what to believe, and to disdain intellectualism and critical thinking,

and their peers in the hood that they try to mimic to their detriment which some realize later in life.

Well said, but I think we're seeing four fundamental shifts here. First, due to societal and governmental changes, far too often one parent is doing the work of two. (Granted, sometimes life intervenes or bad choices are made and that one parent is actually better than the two.) Second, government is intentionally intervening more and more into the rearing of the child, diminishing the parents' roles and authority. Third, due to the breakdown of the traditional family we seldom have one parent at home, so there is proportionally more time for peers to influence children. And fourth, we now have much more technological access for Hollywood (and peers) to reach a child without going through a parent.

 

[ivwshane]

Quite true, and Melissa Harris-Perry apparently wants to increase this tendency - unless you take the left's position that her words are actually without meaning.

Well isnt that convenient? We can't have liberals not meeting your stereotyped expectations can we now.

 

[zinfamous]

Well if it wasn't her point then why did she say it?

agreed. but that is not what you have been arguing.



and stop with the partisan asshatery. I'd wager your critical thinking stopped around 9th grade. It just makes me chuckle when you replace "shit I don't understand" with "hur-dur some ebil librul said it!"

 

[werepossum]

Well isnt that convenient? We can't have liberals not meeting your stereotyped expectations can we now.

Sorry, I almost responded using dictionary definitions of your words. Just in time I remembered that I have to wait until someone tells us what you REALLY meant.

 

[nextJin]

Sorry, I almost responded using dictionary definitions of your words. Just in time I remembered that I have to wait until someone tells us what you REALLY meant.

He responded pretty plainly to me earlier, the end result if what he stated is true she used a horrible choice of words.

Investments equals decisions. If I may make an assumption which isn't in her speech one way or another to make a point; she could be saying instead of just throwing money at the problem we could brainstorm for better solutions. They are called investments because nothing is certain and no matter what the solution is, more money, program reform, etc are done with the hopes that the changes made will pay off.

 

[werepossum]

He responded pretty plainly to me earlier, the end result if what he stated is true she used a horrible choice of words.

Granted. However, if we are to posit something reasonable every time someone says something unreasonable, there's hardly any point in listening to the wonks at all. We could merely assume that today she said something with which we agree.

She made and then reinforced a totally unreasonable point. She is a smart or at least highly educated woman; why should I then assume she is incapable of making a cogent and reasonable point and make one for her?

 

[monovillage]

Granted. However, if we are to posit something reasonable every time someone says something unreasonable, there's hardly any point in listening to the wonks at all. We could merely assume that today she said something with which we agree.

She made and then reinforced a totally unreasonable point. She is a smart or at least highly educated woman; why should I then assume she is incapable of making a cogent and reasonable point and make one for her?

Bingo. It's obvious she said what she meant and meant what she said and the idea that some progressives in a forum need to translate it is ridiculous.

 

[Jaskalas]

i am all for "community" help. but never lose the fact i am the parent and i have the final say.

Do you? I can think of one case where you do not.

err what does that have to do with me? i didn't post it, and i'm not Jewish

It's a point. You do not have the final say over your children. In cases of child abuse or neglect, the state has control. Education or lack thereof is along those lines.

Or better yet, vaccinations. How do you feel about parents rejecting those?

 

[waggy]

It's a point. You do not have the final say over your children. In cases of child abuse or neglect, the state has control. Education or lack thereof is along those lines.

Or better yet, vaccinations. How do you feel about parents rejecting those?

what does that have to do with anything?

education is needed. IF i wanted i have the option to home school. Abuse? someone like in that story abuse's my kid they are still my kids (btw i wouldn't allow some nutcase to suck off my son for a "religion").

vaccinations? they are there to keep them healthy. so its a good thing.


so again what's the point? I do the things that are needed for them to be healthy and productive members of society. just because some things are mandated by law does not erase the fact they are my kids

 

[Jaskalas]

so again what's the point? I do the things that are needed for them to be healthy and productive members of society. just because some things are mandated by law does not erase the fact they are my kids

They are yours, but also belong to society as we all do. They are provided for due to that, and protected in various ways. Public education is a thing because they are not "just" yours. That's the subject, Melissa Harris-Perry speaking of the social contract's need to "invest" in public education, cause those children are / will be members of society.

Their well being is our well being.

 

[ivwshane]

Here we go:
Was I wrong?


http://tv.msnbc.com/2013/04/09/why-caring-for-children-is-not-just-a-parents-job/

My inbox began filling with hateful, personal attacks on Monday, apparently as a result of conservative reactions to a recent “Lean Forward” advertisement now airing on MSNBC, which you can view above. What I thought was an uncontroversial comment on my desire for Americans to see children as everyone’s responsibility has created a bit of a tempest in the right’s teapot.*Allow me to double down.
One thing is for sure: I have no intention of apologizing for saying that our children, all of our children, are part of more than our households, they are part of our communities and deserve to have the care, attention, resources, respect and opportunities of those communities.
When the flood of vitriolic responses to the ad began, my first reaction was relief. I had spent the entire day grading papers and was relieved that since these children were not my responsibility, I could simply mail the students’ papers to their moms and dads to grade! But of course, that is a ridiculous notion. As a teacher, I have unique responsibilities to the students in my classroom at Tulane University, and I embrace those responsibilities. It is why I love my job.
Then I started asking myself where did I learn this lesson about our collective responsibility to children. So many answers quickly became evident.
I learned it from my mother who, long after her own kids were teens, volunteered on the non profit boards of day care centers that served under-resourced children.
I learned it from my father who, despite a demanding career and a large family of his own, always coached boys’ basketball teams in our town.
I learned it from my third-grade public school teacher, who gave me creative extra work and opened up her classroom to me after school so that I wouldn’t get bored and get in trouble.
I learned it from the men who volunteered as crossing* guards in my neighborhood even if they don’t have kids in the schools.
I learned it from the conservative, Republican moms at my daughter’s elementary school, who gave her a ride home every day while I was recovering from surgery.
I learned it watching the parents of Newtown and Chicago as they call for gun control legislation to protect all the children of our communities.
I learn it from my elderly neighbors who never complain about paying property taxes that support our schools, even if they have no children in the schools today.
And I have learned it from other, more surprising sources as well. I find very little common ground with former President George W. Bush, but I certainly agree that no child should be left behind. And while I disagree with the policies he implemented under that banner, I wholeheartedly support his belief that we have a collective national interest in all children doing well.
I’ll even admit that despite being an unwavering advocate for women’s reproductive rights, I have learned this lesson from some of my most sincere, ethically motivated, pro-life colleagues. Those people who truly believe that the potential life inherent in a fetus is equivalent to the actualized life of an infant have argued that the community has a distinct interest in children no matter what the mother’s and father’s interests or needs. So while we come down on different sides of the choice issue, we agree that kids are not the property of their parents. Their lives matter to all of us.
I believe wholeheartedly, and without apology, that we have a collective responsibility to the children of our communities even if we did not conceive and bear them. Of course, parents can and should raise their children with their own values. But they should be able to do so in a community that provides safe places to play, quality food to eat, terrific schools to attend, and economic opportunities to support them. No individual household can do that alone. We have to build that world together.
So those of you who were alarmed by the ad can relax. I have no designs on taking your children. Please keep your kids! But I understand the fear.
We do live in a nation where slaveholders took the infants from the arms of my foremothers and sold them for their own profit. We do live in a nation where the government snatched American Indian children from their families and “re-educated” them by forbidding them to speak their language and practice their traditions.
But that is not what I was talking about, and you know it.
I venture to say that anyone and everyone should know full well that my message in that ad was a call to see ourselves as connected to a larger whole. I don’t want your kids, but I want them to live in safe neighborhoods. I want them to learn in enriching and dynamic classrooms. I want them to be healthy and well and free from fear. I want them to grow up to agree or disagree with me or with you and to have all the freedom and tools they need to express what they believe.
And no hateful thing that you say to me or about me will ever change that I want those things for your children.

The defective brain of the right strikes again. By the way what policies was she pushing? Lol

 

[unokitty]

They are yours, but also belong to society as we all do.

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families."
--M. Thatcher

A graph illustrating what happens when a child’s parents refuse to accept responsibility for that child.

Uno

 

[Pr0d1gy]

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families."
--M. Thatcher

A graph illustrating what happens when a child’s parents refuse to accept responsibility for that child.

Uno

Quoted for being a very misleading pile of partisan BS.