MSI Neo2-FR and E2180 Overclock Issues: 266x10 Max?

veblen · Jan 11, 2008

Hello everyone,

This is my first post in this forum and while I wish I could say I managed an overclock on my E2180 that I can be (somewhat) proud to post, I haven't. So I'm here hoping to get some advice on where I went wrong and what I can try.

Here are my brief system specs:

Intel E2180
MSI Neo2-FR Bios 1.6
OCZ Platinum Rev 2 DDR2-800 4 x 1 GB
XFX 8800GT 512MB
Corsair VX 550W

I'm using a MSI Neo2-FR Bios 1.6 and the highest stable overclock I can get on my E2180 is 2.66 GHz (266 x 10). I managed to post at a variety of clockspeeds but my system restarts when loading windows. I 've tried lowering the multiplier and pushing the FSB and I think I found the FSB limit (around 385 x 8). I've tried increasing vCore all the way to 1.55v and managed to post at 330 x 10 but am unable to load windows...even then, I think it's way too high. I've also tried increasing VID to 1.45v, NB to 1.475v, RAM voltage as high as 2.3v but the system remains unstable once I increase the multiplier. It cannot even boot at 320 x 9/10. Am I going wrong somewhere?

Right now, I am at 375 x 8 = 3.00 GHz, vCore 1.475v and while it manages to complete Aquamark 3, it reboots on Futuremark tests and fails Orthos... I know that means it's unstable but I'm at a loss. Am I just unlucky to get a crappy E2180 or is my mobo or RAM holding me back? I thought of getting Crucial Ballistix or G-Skill to replace my OCZs since I've read posts on how bad they are for OCing (after I bought them of course... :/) but it doesn't seem to make sense since I'm not even running at their rated speeds. Currently, they are at DDR2-750.

Please help. I don't want to OC like mad but I thought I could at least hit 3.2GHz (320 x 10) easy and so far, I'm disappointed.

Tempered81 · Jan 11, 2008

whats your load idle/temp? You could try increasing the NB & vcore volts a little bit more. You've proven you can boot at 385, so it seems its nb/voltage underpowered. Make sure you use a divider to keep your ddr2 within spec. You said you tried Increasing "vid" i dont think you can do that, as thats an intel specification for binning chips.

21stHermit · Jan 11, 2008

Two thoughts:
1] Remove two of the 1GB DIMMs and try again.
2] Not many users of your MSI MB here, most success with Gigibyte and Abit MB's. Your FSB wall is an indication.

I'm curious as to the more knowledgeable replies.

veblen · Jan 11, 2008

Hey jaredpace and 21stHermit,

Thanks for your responses! My idle/load temps are around 30-31C/49-52C. How high can I increase NB volts (within safe specs)? I've tried increasing vCore to 1.55 (the max for my chip I think) and while I managed to post at 333 x 10, it restarts upon booting windows. Sorry I made a mistake, it's not VID, it's VTT volts and I have no idea what it stands for on my mobo.

I've tried removing 2 of the DIMMS, shifting them around and overclocking with just 2GB but I get the same results. Yeah, I knew I should have gotten Gigabyte or Abit...do you think it's my mobo that's causing me to hit the low FSB wall?

I'm hoping that someone with the same mobo can perhaps educate me on the proper voltages to set and test. Can it be due to my OCZ RAM?

The-Noid · Jan 11, 2008

BSEL Mod the chip.

Go buy a defogger kit from the local automotive store.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...howthread.php?t=134939

Tempered81 · Jan 11, 2008

well considering your temp at load is 51 C, You could try going higher on the vcore & NB. see if it boots then, also try your ddr @ 2.2or 2.3volts Gmch & FSB, give those a little bump. A good way to find out if the cpu needs more vcore is to boot into windows at your max. shut down, goto bios decrease vcore by 1 increment. reboot. Repeat until you find the lowest stable cpu voltage. You dont want to increase the vcore from 1.4 to 1.55 if its not necessary.

lopri · Jan 12, 2008

It's got to be the board/BIOS. BSEL mod is in order, I guess. Note, however, that if the CPU is a dud, BSEL mod won't really help. BSEL mod is good for motherboards that can't handle outside the stock FSB. But if the board is capable of handling varying FSB/straps, all BSEL mod does is up'ing its default FSB. Max FSB will be the same regardless. Also, try even higher vTT/vFSB if the board allows. (up to 1.5V) Ironically these 800FSB CPUs could behave as if they were quads.

I was able to take an E2140 to 8x435 on BadAxe 2 (!) by setting vFSB=1.525V.

Gillbot · Jan 12, 2008

Originally posted by: lopri
It's got to be the board/BIOS. BSEL mod is in order, I guess. Note, however, that if the CPU is a dud, BSEL mod won't really help. BSEL mod is good for motherboards that can't handle outside the stock FSB. But if the board is capable of handling varying FSB/straps, all BSEL mod does is up'ing its default FSB. Max FSB will be the same regardless. Also, try even higher vTT/vFSB if the board allows. (up to 1.5V) Ironically these 800FSB CPUs could behave as if they were quads. I was able to take an E2140 to 8x435 on BadAxe 2 (!) by setting vFSB=1.525V.

I've had my Neo2-FR to over 500fsb so it's probably not the board.

Check to be sure you have good cooling and get some better ram. I had all kinds of issues using OCZ Platinum on my board. I could barely get over 333fsb on a 333fsb chip until OCZ had me make LOADS of changes in bios to get theor ram to work.

I gave up on the OCZ and got some Buffalo Firestix (Crucial Ballistix works as well) and my system booted right in to windows at 500fsb without a single issue. Only change was going from OCZ to Buffalo Firestix ram.

here's my thread on it: http://forums.anandtech.com/me...125293&highlight_key=y

imported_wonderwrench · Jan 12, 2008

Originally posted by: veblen
Hey jaredpace and 21stHermit,

Thanks for your responses! My idle/load temps are around 30-31C/49-52C. How high can I increase NB volts (within safe specs)? I've tried increasing vCore to 1.55 (the max for my chip I think) and while I managed to post at 333 x 10, it restarts upon booting windows. Sorry I made a mistake, it's not VID, it's VTT volts and I have no idea what it stands for on my mobo.

I've tried removing 2 of the DIMMS, shifting them around and overclocking with just 2GB but I get the same results. Yeah, I knew I should have gotten Gigabyte or Abit...do you think it's my mobo that's causing me to hit the low FSB wall?

I'm hoping that someone with the same mobo can perhaps educate me on the proper voltages to set and test. Can it be due to my OCZ RAM?

Hi veblen,

I have a P35 Neo2-FR also and find overclocking very easy. I can run 400 mhz FSB using cheap Corsair DDR2 667 value ram using a 1 to 1 ratio with complete stability. I have since replaced this ram with the ram in my sig for my move to Vista 64 bit. This is using a E6400 BTW. Whats holding me back is CPU temp. I'm still using the retail heatsink.
At 3 GHz my CPU can hit 68-70C using OCCT or Prime95 which is still stable but I'm not going to try going higher without a better cooling solution. I have read and re read your posts and I think the CPU is holding you back. Are you sure of your CPU temps?

What are you using to measure CPU temp? Many utilities report CPU temps incorrectly. CoreTemp is a free utility that is about as accurate as it gets. http://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/
Also how are you loading your CPU? Prime95 is a great way to load your CPU to test load temps. http://forums.anandtech.com/me...id=28&threadid=1901991.
I use OCCT as its easier to work with. http://www.ocbase.com/perestroika_en/index.php?Download
Be sure and watch your CPU temps closely when using these apps and stop the test if temps get much over 70C. OCCT will abort by default at 70C.

I just wonder if you have a dud CPU or need to remount you heatsink. You do not state if you are using the retail heatsink. If you are does it have a copper base or an aluminum base. If its aluminum you will need a better heatsink for sure.

lopri · Jan 12, 2008

He is running an e2180, not E6600 or E6400.

Gomeler · Jan 12, 2008

I'd have to blame the CPU or RAM before I'd blame that motherboard. I've had mine up to 490FSB on a Q6600 and 535FSB on a X3040 on air. I'd just say ram more volts down the chips throat, 1.55-1.60, it'll droop to 1.50-1.55 under load and frankly you won't be using this chip in three years, or atleast I hope you won't be. You may want to manually set the ram timings in the BIOS also, I've found that with my Firestix the board sets stupidly loose timings. More volts should solve your problem, just keep core temps under 70C.
note: this board is basically a MSI P35 Platinum, it's got great components and capable of some phenomenal results.

Gillbot · Jan 12, 2008

Originally posted by: Gomeler
I'd have to blame the CPU or RAM before I'd blame that motherboard. I've had mine up to 490FSB on a Q6600 and 535FSB on a X3040 on air. I'd just say ram more volts down the chips throat, 1.55-1.60, it'll droop to 1.50-1.55 under load and frankly you won't be using this chip in three years, or atleast I hope you won't be. You may want to manually set the ram timings in the BIOS also, I've found that with my Firestix the board sets stupidly loose timings. More volts should solve your problem, just keep core temps under 70C.
note: this board is basically a MSI P35 Platinum, it's got great components and capable of some phenomenal results.

+1

As I said, I had LOADS of problems with mine until I dumped the OCZ ram.

imported_wonderwrench · Jan 12, 2008

Originally posted by: lopri
He is running an e2180, not E6600 or E6400.

Yes he is so whats your point.

imported_wonderwrench · Jan 12, 2008

If you read his original post it points to the CPU not the ram. It would have been nice if the info given was more complete though.

Gillbot · Jan 12, 2008

Originally posted by: wonderwrench
If you read his original post it points to the CPU not the ram. It would have been nice if the info given was more complete though.

If you read through my thread, I have VERY similar issues and it was 100% ram. I tried lowering the multi and everything and I even had trouble running stock speeds until I tried my brothers Ballistix. I set the fsb to 500 and it booted right in without blinking an eye.

With the OCZ ram installed, it was VERY picky at particular FSB's from under stock 333 at 280 to 405. Some would boot ok then later fail.

Tempered81 · Jan 12, 2008

yeah hes got ocz, bad, and 4x1gb of it, bad too.

he need to stick 2gb 2x1gb of some popular ocing ram in that thing and i bet itll shoot on up to 3.6, given hes correct about his cooling & temperartures. He still may have to volt the cpu, fsb & nb a little.

veblen · Jan 12, 2008

Thanks for all your responses, guys! Yeah, I've read your posts regarding your E6850 and the MSI Neo2-FR, Gillbot, and I just wanted to be sure it's the OCZ RAM before I go out and get more overclockable RAM. I was thinking of either G-Skill, Corsair XMS or Crucial Ballistix -- I don't have much money to spare anymore. Which one do you guys think will work best?

The only issue I have is that I'm not even running the OCZs at their rated speeds given my lower than 400FSB -- I'm currently at 375MHz with 8x multiplier. Because I cannot get the chip to run at a 9x multiplier or its stock 10x multiplier at FSBs above 300, I suspected my bad luck of the draw with my E2180. Gomeler, you're right...I basically got this chip to tide me over the time it takes to save up for a Penryn so I suppose I shouldn't worry about pumping vCore up to 1.6v.

I also suspected that perhaps I'm not setting up my voltages correctly. Currently, I have vCore 1.475v | VTT 1.40v | NB 1.45v | SB 1.8v | RAM 2.10v. I've gone up to vCore 1.55v | VTT 1.45v | NB 1.50v | SB 1.8v | RAM 2.30v in a vain attempt to boot at 350 x 9 or 320 x 10. My temps are fine: I'm using a Cooler-Master Hyper TX-2 cooler. Power is not an issue since I have the Corsair VX 550W.

So basically, I was wondering if owners of the board or seasoned OCers can help me figure out voltages to try or to confirm that I should forget the OCZs and buy a pair of more overclockable RAM modules.

Gillbot · Jan 12, 2008

All I can say about the OCZ is, it took A LOT of tweaking for me to get it to run stable at it's rated speed on my Neo2-FR. Let me find the thread at OCZ and maybe you can tweak the settings to get better performance. http://www.ocztechnologyforum....showthread.php?t=33457

I can understand about not wanting to buy more though as I was in the same boat. I'd recommend Ballistix because I know it worked well with my board up to and over 500fsb but if tweaking your OCZ can get you more then try it forst. Personally, I got tired of messing with mine over and over just to get it to run at 400 when I knew my chip would do well over 500.

chuckm · Jan 12, 2008

Here's some Ballistix (2Gb) $40 after MIR;
http://www.newegg.com/product/...p?item=N82E16820148076
A thread at xtreme systems dedicated to this board;
http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...howthread.php?t=161618
This appears to be a board with good potential, one of the people I do builds for is considering it and I'm looking forward to it. Most people appear to be using bios 1.1

Tempered81 · Jan 12, 2008

veblen i have supertalent (the cheapest most generic memory money can buy) with heat spreaders and they are oc'd above their spec in spd with the same ddr800 timings. thats just me though. 50 bucks ought to get you 2gb of ddr2 800mhz. try testing that 320x10 with your 2nd set of voltages and only 1gb of your ocz in the first dimm. that may let you know if you're having ocz memory issues. If it boots into windows at 320x10 with those volts & 1gb, but won't do it with 4gb, its pretty obvious its the mem.

XBoxLPU · Jan 12, 2008

Originally posted by: jaredpace
veblen i have supertalent (the cheapest most generic memory money can buy) with heat spreaders and they are oc'd above their spec in spd with the same ddr800 timings. thats just me though. 50 bucks ought to get you 2gb of ddr2 800mhz. try testing that 320x10 with your 2nd set of voltages and only 1gb of your ocz in the first dimm. that may let you know if you're having ocz memory issues. If it boots into windows at 320x10 with those volts & 1gb, but won't do it with 4gb, its pretty obvious its the mem.

I have 4GB (2 x 2Gb) Supertalent w/ heat spreaders at 900 Mhz with 5-5-5-15 timings

Tempered81 · Jan 12, 2008

nice!

supertalent roxors and its cheaper than dirt

veblen · Jan 13, 2008

Hey jaredpace,

I tried what you suggested and I managed to boot into windows at 320 x 10 with only 1 GB of RAM. So yes, it's the RAM then...time to shell out some more money but hopefully it'll be worth it!

Thanks again for all your responses!

Originally posted by: jaredpace
veblen i have supertalent (the cheapest most generic memory money can buy) with heat spreaders and they are oc'd above their spec in spd with the same ddr800 timings. thats just me though. 50 bucks ought to get you 2gb of ddr2 800mhz. try testing that 320x10 with your 2nd set of voltages and only 1gb of your ocz in the first dimm. that may let you know if you're having ocz memory issues. If it boots into windows at 320x10 with those volts & 1gb, but won't do it with 4gb, its pretty obvious its the mem.

Tempered81 · Jan 13, 2008

Originally posted by: veblen
Hey jaredpace,

I tried what you suggested and I managed to boot into windows at 320 x 10 with only 1 GB of RAM. So yes, it's the RAM then...time to shell out some more money but hopefully it'll be worth it!

Thanks again for all your responses!

Originally posted by: jaredpace
veblen i have supertalent (the cheapest most generic memory money can buy) with heat spreaders and they are oc'd above their spec in spd with the same ddr800 timings. thats just me though. 50 bucks ought to get you 2gb of ddr2 800mhz. try testing that 320x10 with your 2nd set of voltages and only 1gb of your ocz in the first dimm. that may let you know if you're having ocz memory issues. If it boots into windows at 320x10 with those volts & 1gb, but won't do it with 4gb, its pretty obvious its the mem.

Click to expand...

nice, glad i could help. now just ebay that ocz, or head over to the FS/FT forums with it. you can find some of that supertalent i have for 30 bucks right now for 2gb

2GB ddr2 pc 6400 RAM for less than $35, no rebates:

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php...1f1c521b955e7603c5e08a

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php...1f1c521b955e7603c5e08a

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...y)-_-A-DATA-_-20211165

the first link are the ones im using at 930mhz 5 5 5 15

veblen · Jan 14, 2008

Just a quick question regarding the affordable supertalent.

Do you know if they use Micron D9 chips? It seems RAM with these chips are best for overclocking.

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: veblen
Hey jaredpace,

I tried what you suggested and I managed to boot into windows at 320 x 10 with only 1 GB of RAM. So yes, it's the RAM then...time to shell out some more money but hopefully it'll be worth it!

Thanks again for all your responses!

Originally posted by: jaredpace
veblen i have supertalent (the cheapest most generic memory money can buy) with heat spreaders and they are oc'd above their spec in spd with the same ddr800 timings. thats just me though. 50 bucks ought to get you 2gb of ddr2 800mhz. try testing that 320x10 with your 2nd set of voltages and only 1gb of your ocz in the first dimm. that may let you know if you're having ocz memory issues. If it boots into windows at 320x10 with those volts & 1gb, but won't do it with 4gb, its pretty obvious its the mem.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

nice, glad i could help. now just ebay that ocz, or head over to the FS/FT forums with it. you can find some of that supertalent i have for 30 bucks right now for 2gb

2GB ddr2 pc 6400 RAM for less than $35, no rebates:

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php...1f1c521b955e7603c5e08a

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php...1f1c521b955e7603c5e08a

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...y)-_-A-DATA-_-20211165

the first link are the ones im using at 930mhz 5 5 5 15

MSI Neo2-FR and E2180 Overclock Issues: 266x10 Max?

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