MoveOn.Org Calls For The Wiping Of Student Load Debt

[JSt0rm]

I don't think it should. However it's pretty easy to find ones that do, and judging by other students I know, they've managed to do just that.

Maybe its the schools that are just raising prices because they can suck it out of the financial institutes and they have no need to compete or lower costs at all?

how is this the students fault?

 

[blinblue]

What's really funny is that we're on page 2 of this thread and no one has said a word about the high prices that public colleges and universities are charging the students. The local college here has increased tuition by 300% in less then 10 years and done nothing to cut the bloated non-educational bullshit programs. Cut the faculty fat, reduce spending or do any other common sense program to reduce spending. What they have been doing is cutting the number of students admitted and raising tuition. FFS start looking at some of the reasons why higher education is so expensive.

I would imagine a lot of the reason is due to the abundance of student loans. It's a lot easier to convince students to pay $25k/year when it gets paid in the form of a loan that students don't need to think about until after they are done with school.

Most in-state universities tuition are in the $4k-$6k ranges. Which is quite reasonable and you could probably work a part time job and pay for it as you went.

edit:

Maybe its the schools that are just raising prices because they can suck it out of the financial institutes and they have no need to compete or lower costs at all?

how is this the students fault?

See my comment about in-state tuition. If the kids are truely worried about their student loans at graduation, there are plenty of decent (perhaps not Amazing) schools to go to that are pretty affordable ($4-$6k range). Not to mention doing things like a community college for 2 years then transferring to a 4-year university.

 

[JSt0rm]

Because people will pay it. Free Market is voodoo to the mind of a liberal and common sense to everybody else.

hey retard, if you understood capitalism you would understand that higher edu is broken capitalism.

but I would only expect you to know how to prepare for the rapture, clean guns and store canned food properly.

 

[spidey07]

hey retard, if you understood capitalism you would understand that higher edu is broken capitalism.

but I would only expect you to know how to prepare for the rapture, clean guns and store canned food properly.

No it's not. Nobody forces you to go to college, it's a product and you can choose to buy at the price you feel has value. How old are you? Are you 12? You think like you're 12.

 

[Brigandier]

I think they should be able to return their degrees for a forgiveness of debt.

 

[blinblue]

I think they should be able to return their degrees for a forgiveness of debt.

lol, I like that idea.

 

[Brigandier]

lol, I like that idea.

I can see the average response being, "But I EARNED it!"

 

[blinblue]

I can see the average response being, "But I EARNED it!"

I suppose to be fair, along with returning the degree, they should also have their brain removed too as it has benefited (one would hope anyway) from the education.

 

[LegendKiller]

I really can't see student loans being bankrupt-able, much less being forgiven en masse. Loaning money to a student to get an education is a terrible investment for the lender, the only way it can be done at all is if there is a guaranteed that it will be paid off one way or the other (ie, unbankrupt-able). As has been pointed out before, far too many kids would just got their $100k 4-years of partying for free and then declare bankruptcy.

What I would be in favor of is giant huge warnings that this debt NEVER goes away unless you're are permanently disabled or die. And then limit the student loans to $x/year, where $x is a reasonable amount for a in-state tuition school. No reason to subsidize anything more than that, if you want to go to a fancy expensive school, that's great. But no need to subsidize anything more than what is required for in-state tuition.

Stupid kids, easy money, and delayed consequences is not a recipe for success.

There are opportunity costs for lending AND borrowing. The first mistake we make in the US is to not educate students in this type of finance as a requirement in HS. They should HAVE to take a basic personal finance class which discusses simple topics like TVM, micro-economics, personal finance, especially student loans and credit cards to show the basic impact of this type of decision. I think that alone would probably cure some of the issue and it'd only be a single semester. That one class alone would probably help significantly.

It has nothing to do with "stupid" kids. Plenty of smart kids take out these loans because they don't fully understand the consequences. Parents should be part of that but, as a whole, I think our society would be vastly improved by simple educational tweaks in finance.

I know, for certain, I didn't fully understand the impacts of me taking out 20k in loans to get my undergrad. I got a BS in psych. Then, only after I could see my job prospects, did I see that a Masters was required to go anywhere. I got my MBA, but only for another 50k. It was a good financial decision for me, but a hard one that I can see the full impact now.

We have a 6mo old and personal finance is going to be a major discussion throughout his life. I won't let my kids make my mistake.


I do agree with the poster above that we need to take the stigma out of community colleges and tech schools. In fact, rather than offering so many government grants, I'd be more in favor of allowing students to have at least 1 year of free CC/Tech education. It'd weed out the marginal students but allow others to test it out and try to succeed where they can.

 

[Howard]

What's really funny is that we're on page 2 of this thread and no one has said a word about the high prices that public colleges and universities are charging the students. The local college here has increased tuition by 300% in less then 10 years and done nothing to cut the bloated non-educational bullshit programs. Cut the faculty fat, reduce spending or do any other common sense program to reduce spending. What they have been doing is cutting the number of students admitted and raising tuition. FFS start looking at some of the reasons why higher education is so expensive.

Why would they need to charge less? Demand is super high.

 

[Engineer]

There are opportunity costs for lending AND borrowing. The first mistake we make in the US is to not educate students in this type of finance as a requirement in HS. They should HAVE to take a basic personal finance class which discusses simple topics like TVM, micro-economics, personal finance, especially student loans and credit cards to show the basic impact of this type of decision. I think that alone would probably cure some of the issue and it'd only be a single semester. That one class alone would probably help significantly.

I agree with this statement about as much as I've have ever agreed with anything posted on this forum. :thumbsup:

Also, I agree with pretty much everything you posted especially the CC/tech school paragraph.

 

[Darwin333]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...calling-for-wiping-out-all-student-loan-debt/

LOL - These guys become a bigger joke every day. Its not like anyone held a gun to the head of these ass clowns and made them take out student loans and choose a field that had/has no future.

You are correct but they do sort of have a gun to their head making them pay it back since student loans, unlike almost all other debt, can not be discharged in bankruptcy.

You do believe in free markets don't you? Why shouldn't a lender who made a bad decision have to eat the consequences, along with the dumbass borrower?

 

[nageov3t]

What's really funny is that we're on page 2 of this thread and no one has said a word about the high prices that public colleges and universities are charging the students. The local college here has increased tuition by 300% in less then 10 years and done nothing to cut the bloated non-educational bullshit programs. Cut the faculty fat, reduce spending or do any other common sense program to reduce spending. What they have been doing is cutting the number of students admitted and raising tuition. FFS start looking at some of the reasons why higher education is so expensive.

it was in the second post, even

 

[Argo]

You are correct but they do sort of have a gun to their head making them pay it back since student loans, unlike almost all other debt, can not be discharged in bankruptcy.

You do believe in free markets don't you? Why shouldn't a lender who made a bad decision have to eat the consequences, along with the dumbass borrower?

I agree with this statement. I don't have background on this - why are student loans not dischargeable in bankrupcy?

 

[monovillage]

Why would they need to charge less? Demand is super high.

If they were making a profit or were a private institution i'd agree with you.

 

[monovillage]

it was in the second post, even

You're right! My mistake and i agree with you 100%.

 

[Darwin333]

Why would they need to charge less? Demand is super high.

Maybe demand has something to do with the fact that you can get $100K in loans that will net you a $30K a year job that you can not default on under any circumstances.

 

[Darwin333]

I agree with this statement. I don't have background on this - why are student loans not dischargeable in bankrupcy?

because the .gov guarantees them and they say so.

 

[Darwin333]

No it's not. Nobody forces you to go to college, it's a product and you can choose to buy at the price you feel has value. How old are you? Are you 12? You think like you're 12.

No one forces you to buy a 60" plasma either but for some silly reason the .gov doesn't force you into indentured servitude for that fuckup.

The lender and borrower take a loss and the world goes round and round. Isn't that the way the free market is supposed to work? Or is it just the banks that enjoy the "free" part of the market in your opinion?

 

[Darwin333]

See my comment about in-state tuition. If the kids are truely worried about their student loans at graduation, there are plenty of decent (perhaps not Amazing) schools to go to that are pretty affordable ($4-$6k range). Not to mention doing things like a community college for 2 years then transferring to a 4-year university.

You expect a kid that just graduated from high school (especially considering the state of public education in this country) to figure that out before signing on the dotted line?

I am all for "stupid is supposed to hurt" but this is like throwing dynamite in a pond and saying the fish should have moved the fuck out of the way.

 

[Brigandier]

You expect a kid that just graduated from high school (especially considering the state of public education in this country) to figure that out before signing on the dotted line?

I am all for "stupid is supposed to hurt" but this is like throwing dynamite in a pond and saying the fish should have moved the fuck out of the way.

Um, yeah, 18 year olds should be able to figure it out, unless, of course, their parents have done well and the kid expects to skate by on that. All of the kids from my economic class in high school have done well, some went to CC, some went to trade school, a few went to University and graduated. Yes, some got loans for stupid degrees, but mostly not. Most of the useless degree kids I see come from upper-middle class families, and drive nicer cars than the college graduates from my group.

Is it America's fault that there are adults over their head in loans for useless degrees? Not at all, and to forgive loans because of it is irresponsible.

 

[blinblue]

You expect a kid that just graduated from high school (especially considering the state of public education in this country) to figure that out before signing on the dotted line?

I am all for "stupid is supposed to hurt" but this is like throwing dynamite in a pond and saying the fish should have moved the fuck out of the way.

Well I'm all for making it painfully clear what they signing up for. And I do feel some sympathy for students who got suckered in to and made some pretty poor decisions, and they do have some right to be mad for being "lied to." But they should be mad at their parents for not being a better mentor (though probably the parents aren't much smarter with money), they should be mad at "society" for telling them the lie that they must go to college and whatever the cost will be worth it, and perhaps most importantly they should be mad at their university for not telling them that it's a terrible idea to sign up for tens of thousands of loans without knowing how you'll pay them off. Not particularly the government's fault (though they really didn't help much).

Now seems like a ripe time to change societies views on higher education.

 

[TridenT]

I think this is a bad idea. Also, it won't ever happen.

I think a good idea would to have more government funded internships.

 

[Bryf50]

I currently go to a city funded university. The tuition is 1/8th of a higher cost private schools. Even still a few weeks ago there was a bunch of dumbasses picketing for free tuition. They were chanting this word for word "What do we want? Free Tuition. When do we want it? Now" I lol'd hard. The irony of it all was that they all didn't go to the classes they were paying for that day.

 

[mchammer187]

Horrible Idea.

I graduated from a 4 year state school paying about about $5000. Was on academic scholarships but that even if I had paid in full it would have been in the neighborhood of 50K which is reasonable for an EE degree. That is without having to work at all during school or summers. Had I gone to private school that would have been 150K which I think an absurd price for any undergraduate degree considering I only graduated 7 years ago and the price of a 4 year education at many schools is well over 200K now.

The problem with education today is the subsidization. Subsidizing the costs of education only increases demand for it where what we ought to do is increase supply. Encourage more people to start out in CC. The attitude of just do it and worry about the cost later is the attitude we need to change because I thought about it every step of the way.