More doom and gloom.

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: irwincur
Maybe we could first figure out why the transportaiton budget grows every year but our infrastructure crumbles. I would hazard a guess to say that we are wasting a ton of money on stupid projects. Furthermore, the States are responsible for a good deal of raodway. We may want to analyze how we are redistributing gas tax monies (those that are specifically for infrastructure). An example of this is that on average the Midwest states which tend to be more densly populated and have harsher winters tend to get less money per capita than Southern states. Michigan is a good example, they are actually at a net loss when it comes to gas tax revenue - yet have some of the highest needs. Distribution has to be tied to need and not to the local influence of elected officials.

It gets tiring for the government to always see more money as the solution to their problems. Odds are there is plenty of money, maybe it is time to streamline government. Businesses do it all the time. But, businesses thrive off of efficiency - government thrives off of waste and excess. When is the last time the government has bothered to trim the fat, or allow for early retirement?

Run the government like a business, with responsibility to the people. Why does the government not send out an annual report outlining spending (a watered down version of the budget)? Because they do not want to taxpayers to know just how poorly it is run.

Exactly. With a federal budget of 3 trillion we cant find money in some bloated program or programs to pay for infrastructure? Instead we have to borrow 825 billion against our future income to do it?

Hmmm... IIRC, when you spend money to build more roads, bridges, pipelines, rails, etc. you then have more of a liability to maintain. Hence, why we can have such a massive transportation budget and crumbling roads... Sure, we could trim the fat in how things are run, but overall infrastructure is always a sound investment in the future. With additional infrastructure comes additional economic opportunity. For too long, however, we've been concentrating on the new stuff without maintaining what we already have. Time to pay the piper...

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

I was unaware that they were entitlements.

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

I was unaware that they were entitlements.

They are jobs created by the government. piasabird claimed government does not create jobs. I gave him a few examples.

 

[ProfJohn]

Our infrastructure is crumbling because politicians would rather spend money on new roads and bridges rather than fixing the old one because the new ones are more visible to voters.

 

[blahblah99]

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

I was unaware that they were entitlements.

They are jobs created by the government. piasabird claimed government does not create jobs. I gave him a few examples.

Only problem is these "jobs" are ALWAYS sub-contracted out about 10 tiers of contractors before actual physical labor begins. Take a look at the Katrina, Blackwater, halliburton, heck even NASA.

Millions of dollars of work given to rebuild with everyone wetting their panties trying to get the contract only to sub-contract it out to another company, who contracts their contract out to another company, who hires minimum wage workers to do the job.

THIS PROBLEM NEEDS TO BE FIXED IF ANY AMOUNT OF PRODUCTIVE WORK IS TO BE DONE, otherwise that 1 trillion dollar stimulus package is going nowhere.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed


Screw those screw sissy commie bridges and roads, live like a real Republican!

It's a VW bug. You stinky hippies should love it.

Only people I see nowadays with bugs are whacked out gunnut libertarian types.

The most hilarious ones are the ones pimped out with the iron cross, german camo colors and fake potato mashers grenades under the back seat of course.

Hippies do not drive, they trainhop, welcome to 2009.

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: blahblah99

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

I was unaware that they were entitlements.

They are jobs created by the government. piasabird claimed government does not create jobs. I gave him a few examples.

Only problem is these "jobs" are ALWAYS sub-contracted out about 10 tiers of contractors before actual physical labor begins. Take a look at the Katrina, Blackwater, halliburton, heck even NASA.

Millions of dollars of work given to rebuild with everyone wetting their panties trying to get the contract only to sub-contract it out to another company, who contracts their contract out to another company, who hires minimum wage workers to do the job.

THIS PROBLEM NEEDS TO BE FIXED IF ANY AMOUNT OF PRODUCTIVE WORK IS TO BE DONE, otherwise that 1 trillion dollar stimulus package is going nowhere.

I can see contracting out portions of work for things that somebody can't do inhouse themselves, however you do make a good point. There are too many middlemen siphoning things off the top. These large companies that engage in this kind of behavior might be large enough to be split up, imho. Cutting down on this would do the public a great service.

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

I was unaware that they were entitlements.

They are jobs created by the government. piasabird claimed government does not create jobs. I gave him a few examples.

I was just being facetious and/or snarky there. Besides, anyone who has taken a basic course in economics knows that the government is a rather large part of the economy in providing jobs. The private sector cannot handle everything, nor should it.

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: GTKeeper
Look at the new House Republican bill. Not 1 penny for infrastructure.

The one thing we actually need in this damn bill is infrastructure.


Its a lose lose situation for America. Either a) we get a lot of pork + some tax cuts from the Dems + infrastructure, or b) a lot of tax cuts and no infrastructure.

Why can't we do

c) Tax cuts and infrastructure spending ?

Why can't they maintain the bridges with the tolls they collect?

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: winnar111

Originally posted by: GTKeeper
Look at the new House Republican bill. Not 1 penny for infrastructure.

The one thing we actually need in this damn bill is infrastructure.


Its a lose lose situation for America. Either a) we get a lot of pork + some tax cuts from the Dems + infrastructure, or b) a lot of tax cuts and no infrastructure.

Why can't we do

c) Tax cuts and infrastructure spending ?

Why can't they maintain the bridges with the tolls they collect?

Because toll bridges suck. Not every bridge is a toll bridge, nor should they be. Perhaps the toll bridges themselves can keep up with their revenues, but there are waaaaaay too many bridges for this to be even close to viable.

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: winnar111

Originally posted by: GTKeeper
Look at the new House Republican bill. Not 1 penny for infrastructure.

The one thing we actually need in this damn bill is infrastructure.


Its a lose lose situation for America. Either a) we get a lot of pork + some tax cuts from the Dems + infrastructure, or b) a lot of tax cuts and no infrastructure.

Why can't we do

c) Tax cuts and infrastructure spending ?

Why can't they maintain the bridges with the tolls they collect?

Because toll bridges suck. Not every bridge is a toll bridge, nor should they be. Perhaps the toll bridges themselves can keep up with their revenues, but there are waaaaaay too many bridges for this to be even close to viable.

The Verrazano charges $10 for me to drive on. What are they doing with that $10?

I pay $.60 to drive 5 miles on the Turnpike. What are they doing there?

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: winnar111

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: winnar111

Originally posted by: GTKeeper
Look at the new House Republican bill. Not 1 penny for infrastructure.

The one thing we actually need in this damn bill is infrastructure.


Its a lose lose situation for America. Either a) we get a lot of pork + some tax cuts from the Dems + infrastructure, or b) a lot of tax cuts and no infrastructure.

Why can't we do

c) Tax cuts and infrastructure spending ?

Why can't they maintain the bridges with the tolls they collect?

Because toll bridges suck. Not every bridge is a toll bridge, nor should they be. Perhaps the toll bridges themselves can keep up with their revenues, but there are waaaaaay too many bridges for this to be even close to viable.

The Verrazano charges $10 for me to drive on. What are they doing with that $10?

I pay $.60 to drive 5 miles on the Turnpike. What are they doing there?

Lining somebody's pockets. Those should be converted to public-access bridges, free to use, especially if it is gvt-owned and/or built. Fuck toll bridges and the horse they rode in on.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Our infrastructure is crumbling because politicians would rather spend money on new roads and bridges rather than fixing the old one because the new ones are more visible to voters.

Like where? The US has hardly increased its roads in a meaningful way in decades compared to the decades prior, this despite a doubling of automobile traffic.

The Verrazano charges $10 for me to drive on. What are they doing with that $10?

You obviously don't realize how much these people make who work the tolls. In NY state the big toll highway was to only have a toll until it was paid off. It did become paid off, but of course did the tolls go away? No, instead toll booth operators--who do nothing but hand out the same card to every automobile that goes through (unless they are on the other end and actually make change)--can make $20/hour. Yes, you heard me right. $20 hour to hand out a stack of cards to motorists.

 

[BarneyFife]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Our infrastructure is crumbling because politicians would rather spend money on new roads and bridges rather than fixing the old one because the new ones are more visible to voters.

You obviously have no idea about capital preventative maintenance.

 

[Elias824]

I thought alot of the roads were supposed to be maintained by the states? If we are going to waste trillions we could at least have something to show for it.

 

[BarneyFife]

Originally posted by: Elias824
I thought alot of the roads were supposed to be maintained by the states? If we are going to waste trillions we could at least have something to show for it.

Its hard to maintain something with a shoe string budget and a 50% decline in staff from 20 years ago.

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: piasabird
Government does not create jobs, it just creates entitlement programs you can not get rid of.

That is incorrect; the number one employer in many counties is the government, when you factor in Military bases, Universities and research facilities, Police, Fire and other first responders, Border Patrol and public services. Or were you unaware that these are "government" jobs?

I was unaware that they were entitlements.

They are jobs created by the government. piasabird claimed government does not create jobs. I gave him a few examples.

I was just being facetious and/or snarky there. Besides, anyone who has taken a basic course in economics knows that the government is a rather large part of the economy in providing jobs. The private sector cannot handle everything, nor should it.

Yeah, I was kind of curious about your post; I guess my snarkometer has decroded batteries.