Mods: Please lock AKA

[CZroe]

Original title: What to do w/something valuable when you don't trust the lost & found operators:

EDIT: Because the AndroidVageta epic thread was unlocked, we should continue this there:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=2107564


This is really a "DUH" thread, but I read the whole "Epic" thread from AndroidVageta and was surprised to see no one mention this, so I guess someone needs to spell it out. I've done it several times for wallets, dead cellphones (can't charge to check contacts), etc.

It's so damn simple everyone in ATOT needs a slap in the face for not saying it in the thread:
Leave an item description with your contact information instead! After demonstrating your pretectiveness and willingness to return it, NO ONE will believe that you had the intent to steal, especially when you are now the only party known to have lain hands on it and ensured that it stayed that way. Lost and found operators can't say that you took money out of a wallet or whatever before they received it and if the owner claims that something is missing, well, there is no reason to assume that you are the first to find it. Bonus: If it's never claimed, it isn't some random lucky kid who didn't even find it who ultimately gets to keep it. That's never happened to me (people usually want their valuables back!), but it's possible.

This works even if the item has no contact information... like the wireless Motorola S9 HD A2DP headphones I saw (AND recognized) sitting in a parking space straight ahead while I was stuck at a drive through window waiting for my food. It took forever to get out and I thought "for sure" that some asshole was going to see and steal them before I could go "do my thing" but they sat there 15 minutes without being touched (drive through was ridiculously slow). I pulled in, wrote my contact info on two pieces of paper along with the items description, and dropped a copy at both Subway and El Pollo Loco (both are in the same building). Even if I wanted to turn it in to them, I wouldn't know which one and the owner may only check the one they visited, so it was really the ONLY choice. The only reason I wasn't eating inside was because I had a dog with me, so I parked in that space and ate while keeping an eye out for the owner. Before I could leave, I got a phone call from the owner who was surprised to hear that I was waiting outside for him (he had returned to look for it).

 

[amdhunter]

Yeah but what if you get robbed by some random guy on the street. Then he'll have your info and come after you later if you report anything.

 

[guyver01]

No... the EASIEST WAY... is to ASK FOR A MANAGER.
Give the item to the manager... chances are they'll put it in the store safe, instead of with the L&F baskets.

Get the managers name. If you have a cell phone... take a pic of yourself giving the item to the manager.

a piece of paper will get lost/thrown away/misplaced.

 

[CZroe]

Yeah but what if you get robbed by some random guy on the street. Then he'll have your info and come after you later if you report anything.

There are still any number of possibilities. You could have been approached/contacted by the supposed owner, for example, which could still be a lying douche from the staff that is now "aware" of it. Just because you aren't giving responsibility, it doesn't become your full responsibility. They are the ones who lost it and you are already going above and beyond by not playing the whole "finders, keepers" game OR trusting it to fate with the others you don't know.

 

[CZroe]

No... the EASIEST WAY... is to ASK FOR A MANAGER.
Give the item to the manager... chances are they'll put it in the store safe, instead of with the L&F baskets.

Get the managers name. If you have a cell phone... take a pic of yourself giving the item to the manager.

a piece of paper will get lost/thrown away/misplaced.

How is that easier? Also, who said ease was the goal if you are genuinely concerned with trusting others with it? Of course it's "easier" to just give it to them and not have to worry about your own liability, but that also means that you aren't concerned with the owner recovering it as much as avoiding the responsibility. It wasn't "easy" for me to find the address on the license in the wallet I found in Cypress, CA while picking up motorcycle tires from a forumer (yes, while riding there from 2hrs away on my motorocycle... I have pics). It was past midnight and they obviously did not want to answer the door to a stranger (I guess they didn't know they lost it), but I pressed on and got it returned. Mine had fallen out of my pocket at a stop light two months earlier and had been statched before I could turn around at the next light (I could still see the intersection but I had to watch the light and I never saw the perp). I was livid. I would have been happy if they would just take the money (~$85) and just throw the rest in the mailbox, but I never saw it again.

Also, explain how that applies to El Pollo Loco/Subway... WHICH manager?

 

[BoomerD]

We were at one of the local wally-worlds one evening, and there on a shelf was one of their scanners with the price tag machine attached...What a fabulous opportunity for a price-swapper...I looked around the aisles on both sides...not an employee to be seen.

I took it up front, asked for the store manager, and gave it to him. He was shocked that it had been left on the shelf unattended.

I found a fanny pack in one of the rest rooms at Yosemite. Inside was some cash, (<$20_ and a cell phone. I tried the "last number dialed thing," but it was to an 800 number, so I went through the phone book looking for an ICE number, home, mom, or anything similar...no such luck. It was (IIRC) a Sprint phone, so I called Sprint's customer service and explained the situation. They agreed to call the customer's home number and let them know I had found it and where to get it. (park service lost & found) I also called the cell phone from my cell and left a voice mail, in case the owner happened to check voice mail...which he did. I got a return call from him the next day, thanking me for being honest. He thought it was long gone.

AV's response to finding a phone was just plain stupid, and given his apparent history, was just asking for trouble.

 

[CZroe]

We were at one of the local wally-worlds one evening, and there on a shelf was one of their scanners with the price tag machine attached...What a fabulous opportunity for a price-swapper...I looked around the aisles on both sides...not an employee to be seen.

I took it up front, asked for the store manager, and gave it to him. He was shocked that it had been left on the shelf unattended.

I found a fanny pack in one of the rest rooms at Yosemite. Inside was some cash, (<$20_ and a cell phone. I tried the "last number dialed thing," but it was to an 800 number, so I went through the phone book looking for an ICE number, home, mom, or anything similar...no such luck. It was (IIRC) a Sprint phone, so I called Sprint's customer service and explained the situation. They agreed to call the customer's home number and let them know I had found it and where to get it. (park service lost & found) I also called the cell phone from my cell and left a voice mail, in case the owner happened to check voice mail...which he did. I got a return call from him the next day, thanking me for being honest. He thought it was long gone.

AV's response to finding a phone was just plain stupid, and given his apparent history, was just asking for trouble.

We should probably make this a "brag about your good deeds" thread.

Good job, BoomerD! *thumbs up*

 

[guyver01]

Also, explain how that applies to El Pollo Loco/Subway... WHICH manager?

The store manager? Whoever the fuck says theyr'e the manager?

The way i see it... the person who lost the item obviously didn't care about the item enough to insure they had it. (no.. i have never lost an item in 39 years) .. i will not become jesus to insure they get the item back. i'll give it to a person in charge at the location it was found.. and if they backtrace their steps.. they'll find it.

 

[CZroe]

The store manager? Whoever the fuck says theyr'e the manager?

The way i see it... the person who lost the item obviously didn't care about the item enough to insure they had it. (no.. i have never lost an item in 39 years) .. i will not become jesus to insure they get the item back. i'll give it to a person in charge at the location it was found.. and if they backtrace their steps.. they'll find it.

READING COMPREHENSION. The parking lot was for two businesses in the same building which would have two different managers. The person who lost it could have been patronizing either and would probably only check one, assuming that they lost it while inside.

TWO business, ONE building, ONE parking lot, SEPARATE entrances, TWO drive-throughs:
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...803,-117.144454&spn=0.000783,0.00086&t=h&z=20

 

[BoomerD]

We should probably make this a "brag about your good deeds" thread.

Good job, BoomerD! *thumbs up*

meh...it's just a matter of doing the "right" thing...

 

[guyver01]

The parking lot was for two businesses in the same building which would have two different managers.

Then choose one?

do i have to think of everything for you people?
Some people just want to do everything the hard way.

Why re-invent the wheel... when someone already invented it and it works fine?

 

[CZroe]

Then choose one?

do i have to think of everything for you people?
Some people just want to do everything the hard way.

Why re-invent the wheel... when someone already invented it and it works fine?

Did you conveniently leave out the next part of the quote?

The person who lost it could have been patronizing either and would probably only check one, assuming that they lost it while inside.

Or did you forget that this is only for those concerned with trusting someone else with it, as AV claimed to be? Your suggestion does not apply to that scenario.

Gah! Need to edit to fix "assiming."

Edit: Fixed here and there.

 

[guyver01]

"The person who lost it could have been patronizing either and would probably only check one, assiming that they lost it while inside."

If i ever lost something... i'd ask EVERY store.

To only ask one store, when there are two on the premise... is stupid.

But then again.. i don't lose my posessions.. so i don't know what those who lose things would think.

 

[CZroe]

If i ever lost something... i'd ask EVERY store.

To only ask one store, when there are two on the premise... is stupid.

Not if you assumed that you lost it in a particular store. Get real. If it fell off in the parking lot, the last place they'd likely remember seeing it was inside on a table or tray. I'd go straight in and check the trash!

You have the right idea for most situations. I don't want to argue, just read and understand before contradicting for the sake of contradicting. Let's not turn this into AV Epic Thread mark 2.

 

[her209]

You don't trust the lost and found operators but you shop there?

 

[guyver01]

Let's not turn this into AV Epic Thread mark 2.

:'(

 

[CZroe]

You don't trust the lost and found operators but you shop there?

Who controls the hiring where they shop? I'd have to be a mighty important customer to have any control over such a thing as hiring and I'd have to be an awfully knowledgeable and nosy one to know that much about the staff before choosing to shop somewhere.


EDIT: Because the other thread was unlocked, we should continue this there:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=2107564

 

[pontifex]

Once you turn it into the store lost and found or whatever, its out of your hands/not your responsibility. If someone at the store steals it, then so what? You didn't steal it, you did the right thing by turning it in.

It's the store's problem that they have thieves or unscrupulous people working there, not yours.

 

[alkemyst]

No... the EASIEST WAY... is to ASK FOR A MANAGER.
Give the item to the manager... chances are they'll put it in the store safe, instead of with the L&F baskets.

Get the managers name. If you have a cell phone... take a pic of yourself giving the item to the manager.

a piece of paper will get lost/thrown away/misplaced.

Just the manager would suffice...the rest unneeded.

 

[Nik]

pretectiveness

I quit reading at this point. You're an idiot.

It doesn't matter what else you do. If you don't turn it in, you're a thief. It's not like you can't go to the police and say "I found this at Target" or whatever.

With very FEW exceptions, you are a thief if you keep it. Plain and simple.

As an example exception, I was sitting at San Francisco airport about 11pm for a layover a couple years ago. The only people around were headed for the same plane, to PDX, but weren't really talking with each other much. Anyway, one guy who'd been waiting too, looked like a college kid, suddenly stood up, gathered his carryons, and walked away but left his cell phone on the chair next to him. I waited a few minutes to see if he'd return, but he didn't so I went over to pick up the phone. I looked through his contacts, found "mom&dad" so I called it asking for the man of the house. I explained what happened and said that if I didn't see the kid before arriving in PDX, I'd call them back the next morning to exchange contact info so I could mail the phone to them. I didn't see him return or board the plane, so I kept the phone in my pocket intending to do exactly what I said I would.

Could I have just kept my mouth shut and gone home with it? Sure. Would anyone have known? Nope. Could I have switched out the sim and wiped the cell phone's network ident number to sell for some cash? No problem. Did I? No.

As I boarded the plane and walked back to my seat, I noticed the dude sitting on the plane. He'd returned just before boarding and slipped in without me noticing. I stopped and said "oh, hey, I have your phone. You dropped it when you left."

I got a hand shake and a thank you and it was done.

No matter what situation you're in, there's always something you can do to show that you're not a thief. Quietly putting it in your pocket and walking away is fucking stupid.

 

[alkemyst]

Cool story, lots of little details....but why the need to ask for the man of the house and why not just get up and catch up to him at first with the phone?

Did you just feel guilty about 'finding' it and then decided to do the right thing?

 

[pmv]

I quit reading at this point. You're an idiot.

It doesn't matter what else you do. If you don't turn it in, you're a thief.

I _guess_ this is a justifiable positon. But does it not just pass the dilemma on to someone else? If you hand it in, the same dilemma that applied to you now applies to whoever you handed it in to. Logically to avoid being considered a thief, _they_ have to immediately hand it in to someone else. And so on. Where does it end?

And I personally don't consider the police necessarily trustworthy in these matters, based on stories I've heard. Certainly I know for a fact that shop managers are not particularly to be trusted, I'd only feel sure it had gotten back to the owner if I could contact them myself.


I've twice in my life found a lost wallet (stuffed with cash and cards).

Once I gave it in to the porter of the building, before afterwards thinking that was dumb as for all I know he kept it. Plus it had an ID in it, with address, and I could have just gone there and returned it in person - but would that be 'stealing' then?

The second time I found a phone number in the wallet, phoned the number and found out the owner was working in a fast-food place a short walk away. Went there, person came out from a back room, grabbed the wallet out of my hand without even looking me in the eyes, yet alone saying 'thank you', and walked out without a word. Really pissed me off. Not sure what that story proves but it still annoys me.

The concept of 'stealing by finding' makes me more inclined to just leave lost things where they are rather than trying to return them.

 

[Nik]

Cool story, lots of little details....but why the need to ask for the man of the house and why not just get up and catch up to him at first with the phone?

Did you just feel guilty about 'finding' it and then decided to do the right thing?

No, shithead. The guy disappeared quickly and was gone for more than 40 minutes. I honestly have no idea how I didn't see him return to the gate, but I was watching for him intently until I had to gather my things to board the plane.

If he turned around 10 feet away to get his phone I didn't want to be the obsessive stalker type standing right behind him when he turned and handing him his phone.

I waited a few minutes for him to come get it.

He didn't.

When he didn't, I felt compelled to act even if it's to protect a complete stranger. If I left it with the airport security, he'd potentially go home and not even know where he dropped it, not know where to start looking (who needs MORE stress while travelling?), increasing the likelihood that he'd never get it back. If I just left it on the seat, the likelihood that some asshole would come along to pocket it would also increase.

The only solution was to personally make sure the phone got back into his hands before leaving PDX airport after the flight, but I was prepared with a backup plan (contacting parents for meeting up or mailing) if that didn't happen -a plan that I began putting in place immediately by calling his folks to let them know. That also lets the parents know that if they need to get ahold of him in an emergency and they can't, they know why.

Nobody likes your stupid, worthless, agenda-driven insinuations ya damn drunk.

 

[Nik]

I _guess_ this is a justifiable positon. But does it not just pass the dilemma on to someone else? If you hand it in, the same dilemma that applied to you now applies to whoever you handed it in to. Logically to avoid being considered a thief, _they_ have to immediately hand it in to someone else. And so on. Where does it end?

You're being incredibly stupid.

Your reply is far too stupid to warrant a reply, but I will anyway.

You don't just pass the object to the next person you see, like a moron or something. You either make a significant effort to return it to the owner immediately or you turn the object in to people who are responsible for looking after lost items.

 

[CZroe]

Once you turn it into the store lost and found or whatever, its out of your hands/not your responsibility. If someone at the store steals it, then so what? You didn't steal it, you did the right thing by turning it in.

It's the store's problem that they have thieves or unscrupulous people working there, not yours.

Ugh. Do you not get it? Someone used their so-called "legitimate" concern for the owner receiving their property as reasoning for NOT doing that. This suggestion SPECIFICALY says that it is for those LEGITIMATELY concerned with the owner receiving their property back... not with lazily shrugging off responsibility. OF COURSE we know that you can do that but some good samaritans may be willing to take extra effort and responsibility with valuable items and this is the way to do it.

If you found a $50 bill on the ground and suddenly three people told you that they lost $50, what would you do? If possible, I would try to prevent that from happening in the first place. I would try to hide the amount, notify those around me that some lost money was found, and ask them to give any information (location, amount, bundling technique, circumstance, etc). It sounds like you would just throw it at the nearest person in charge and let them make the same claim.

Anyway:

Because the other thread was unlocked, we should continue this there:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=2107564

*Sigh* I might as well respond to the rampant idiocy expressed here.

I quit reading at this point. You're an idiot.

You stopped reading because of a typo? I don't know what to tell you. A simple search will tell you that I know how to spell "protect."

It doesn't matter what else you do. If you don't turn it in, you're a thief. It's not like you can't go to the police and say "I found this at Target" or whatever.

With very FEW exceptions, you are a thief if you keep it. Plain and simple.

WRONG. They are no more entitled to handle someone else's property than you.

As an example exception, I was sitting at San Francisco airport about 11pm for a layover a couple years ago. The only people around were headed for the same plane, to PDX, but weren't really talking with each other much. Anyway, one guy who'd been waiting too, looked like a college kid, suddenly stood up, gathered his carryons, and walked away but left his cell phone on the chair next to him. I waited a few minutes to see if he'd return, but he didn't so I went over to pick up the phone. I looked through his contacts, found "mom&dad" so I called it asking for the man of the house. I explained what happened and said that if I didn't see the kid before arriving in PDX, I'd call them back the next morning to exchange contact info so I could mail the phone to them. I didn't see him return or board the plane, so I kept the phone in my pocket intending to do exactly what I said I would.

You seriously don't see ANY similarities to what I was suggesting? Handling it youself for other concerning reasons is justified as well.

Could I have just kept my mouth shut and gone home with it? Sure. Would anyone have known? Nope. Could I have switched out the sim and wiped the cell phone's network ident number to sell for some cash? No problem. Did I? No.

OK, why are you even bringing up the actions a theif would take? We are specifically saying that this is what someone who is NOT a thief could do if they were GENUINELY concerned.

As I boarded the plane and walked back to my seat, I noticed the dude sitting on the plane. He'd returned just before boarding and slipped in without me noticing. I stopped and said "oh, hey, I have your phone. You dropped it when you left."

I got a hand shake and a thank you and it was done.

No matter what situation you're in, there's always something you can do to show that you're not a thief. Quietly putting it in your pocket and walking away is fucking stupid.

Exactly why I did not suggest quietly putting it in your pocket and instead suggested giving all the relevant information to those in charge in a gesture of full transparency.

You're being incredibly stupid.

Your reply is far too stupid to warrant a reply, but I will anyway.

You don't just pass the object to the next person you see, like a moron or something. You either make a significant effort to return it to the owner immediately or you turn the object in to people who are responsible for looking after lost items.

Just because they made themselves responsible does not make them the only ones ALLOWED to be responsible, like you implied when you said that taking responsibility yourself would be stealing. Legally, it's not theirs either and they are the same as anyone else who has found property that does not belong to them.