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Mobo or CPU or... ?

meltdown75

meltdown75

Lifer
I tried this in TS as well, I apologize for posting it here too. There seems to be a fine line between GH and TS posts in some cases.

I have a system which randomly shuts down / freezes. Here is what I have tried so far:

- replaced PSU with new 250w PSU (budget)
- replaced HD with new 40gb WD HD
- tested memory, no errors. replaced stick of ram with spare - same problems.

System still exhibits same behaviour. Cannot install Windows... install process locks or PC shuts down randomly during install.

mobo: ECS K7SEM v1.2b bios
CPU: Duron 1.3ghz

Please help. This is a client's business system and I need to know whether or not I should just go out and buy them a new mobo / mpu combo or if I am missing something else.

- Meltdown :beer:
 
The OS installed on the original HD was XP pro. It is still bootable also, but the system exhibits the same behaviour regardless of which HD is in, new or old.

I'm thinking of picking up a mobo which supports the CPU and trying it out. I just want to be sure, and this is the only place that can help me!!

edit: oh, the ram tried was a) 128mb of PC133 and b) spare stick of 128mb pc100 that I had laying around. both are error-free in memtest.
 
I had a buddy that bought a new pc (I think it was a gateway). But it was running Windows XP and only had 128MB of ram. The computer was very slow when he first got it. I mean 1-2 minutes just to get the start menu to open. I added another 128MB of Ram and it ran fine. I would not recommend running XP on less than 256MB or Ram.
 
Originally posted by: pea33nut
I had a buddy that bought a new pc (I think it was a gateway). But it was running Windows XP and only had 128MB of ram. The computer was very slow when he first got it. I mean 1-2 minutes just to get the start menu to open. I added another 128MB of Ram and it ran fine. I would not recommend running XP on less than 256MB or Ram.
Click to expand...
I agree completely. I will add more RAM as needed, but for now I need to get this thing stable.
 
I had similar problems when my old PC (PIII 700MHz, 128MB RAM, WinXP Pro) froze randomly. It was the PSU causing the problem. Replacing it with another one with a higher power rating (higher by about 50W) solved the problem. The problem was tracked down to be the PSU fan not working and making the transformer and other components inside the PSU heat up which resulted in halts and system freezing.

Is the approximate time period after which the PC freezes/restarts the same each time?
 
Originally posted by: asadasif
I had similar problems when my old PC (PIII 700MHz, 128MB RAM, WinXP Pro) froze randomly. It was the PSU causing the problem. Replacing it with another one with a higher power rating (higher by about 50W) solved the problem. The problem was tracked down to be the PSU fan not working and making the transformer and other components inside the PSU heat up which resulted in halts and system freezing.

Is the approximate time period after which the PC freezes/restarts the same each time?
Click to expand...
it's random. the longest I have seen it stay up is about 15 minutes though. the strange thing is... i can boot up and go into the BIOS and it will sit there infinitely. 😕

not to mention the PSU is new out of the box... i would be damn pissed if it was faulty out of the box!
 
Are the capacitors on the MB in good shape?
Not leaking or bulging?

Basically, if a CPU runs it's fine.
 
The PSU might be under-powered for the setup you are using. When the system is under load, the power draw increases. You can sit in the BIOS infinitely because the CPU, GPU, etc are not drawing their full required power from the PSU (through the mobo).

My older PC's PSU replacement was 300W. Hence the one I had in it before was of 250W. Is the PSU you are using from a reputable company? Generic/budget PSUs often deliver lesser power than what's specified on the specs sticker, etc. I would expect such a 300W PSU giving 240-270W actual, 250W giving 180-220W and so on.
 
Originally posted by: Blain
Are the capacitors on the MB in good shape?
Not leaking or bulging?

Basically, if a CPU runs it's fine.
Click to expand...
I will have to check that when I get home later. A couple people have suggested that this is a common problem with this make & model of board...
 
Originally posted by: asadasif
The PSU might be under-powered for the setup you are using. When the system is under load, the power draw increases. You can sit in the BIOS infinitely because the CPU, GPU, etc are not drawing their full required power from the PSU (through the mobo).

My older PC's PSU replacement was 300W. Hence the one I had in it before was of 250W. Is the PSU you are using from a reputable company? Generic/budget PSUs often deliver lesser power than what's specified on the specs sticker, etc. I would expect such a 300W PSU giving 240-270W actual, 250W giving 180-220W and so on.
Click to expand...
the PSU is not from a reputable company. 🙁 i made a mistake in the purchase there, definitely. i'm ashamed to even say the name of it.

that said, new out of the box, you would think a budget PSU could get the job done for the specs provided... 1 HD, 1 optical, integrated video & sound. 🙁 frick
 
My newer 300W PSU is manufactured by Mercury.... not very reputable but it gets the job done. You might want to manually check how much power is coming on the +12/+5V rails.
 
Originally posted by: velis
Did you check the heatsink on the CPU? Seems to me you have standard CPU overheating issue.
Click to expand...
temps are fine, that's one of the first things I normally check. I agree though, the symptoms are very similar.
Originally posted by: asadasif
My newer 300W PSU is manufactured by Mercury.... not very reputable but it gets the job done. You might want to manually check how much power is coming on the +12/+5V rails.
Click to expand...
I had a quick look in BIOS and everything looked pretty tight with respect to that. I'm not too keen on testing it with an actual voltmeter, but I realize that's the only true way to gauge the voltage on the rails.

if the capacitors look ok, i might have to pick up yet another PSU... eek!
 
did some preliminary checks to see what is in stock around here for Socket A boards...

one shop has two in stock, an ECS (aaaah!) and a PC Chips. both with integrated everything. $59+tax.

hmm :/
 
Tell us a lttile more about the computer. Is this a new build? Or was this computer running stable and then it started having instability problems?
 
Originally posted by: Rockhound1
Tell us a lttile more about the computer. Is this a new build? Or was this computer running stable and then it started having instability problems?
Click to expand...
it's an older build, a store-bought system in a crappy Daewoo case that already had one colossal power-switch problem in the past.

as far as i know, this PC has never been stable. this is the third time i have had it brought to me for repairs. every time it is the same issue - random shutdowns & freezes.

i hope to heck it's not the power switch again... i thought i fixed that thing for good last time.

i'm thinking about picking up a new case too. i guess buying all new components is one way out. it's starting to look like the ONLY way out...
 
Well, based on what you have described, I would have to predict that the problem lies with your motherboard. You have tested your memory, replaced the PSU (although I would have purchased a 300 Watt as a minimum), and your CPU seems to be okay.

However, your system is not going to draw a lot of power and a 250 Watt PSU should be okay, but you said it is a cheap PSU, and those have a tendency not to run at their rated power. If you could return the current PSU and exchange it for a better rated unit, I would feel much more confident in predicting the failure is in your motherboard.

Bottom line - the problem is probably your motherboard, but there is a chance it could be your PSU.

Let us know how you proceed and what the outcome is.

 
Thanks Rockhound1, and thanks to others who helped. I appreciate it very very much, and will try to give back to the AT community in terms of help where ever I can - whether it is in Tech Support, GH or even taking it easy in OT.

I decided to tell the owners that the best route is for a new build anyway. I'll keep the 250W PSU on hand as a tester unit / backup for older systems, but I'm going to pick up a case with a decent-branded 350W PSU.

In it I'm going to install their new motherboard (PC Chips or ECS, haven't decided yet but local Socket A stock is limited - another place has Asrock but I think it's even less reputable than the other two). I'm going to get them a single stick of 512mb DDR ram to go with it.

Just waiting for them to call back and approve the purchases. I will feel much more secure knowing that no old parts are in the new system (save for the CPU).
 
Originally posted by: meltdown75
I have a system which randomly shuts down / freezes. Here is what I have tried so far:

- replaced PSU with new 250w PSU (budget)
- replaced HD with new 40gb WD HD
- tested memory, no errors. replaced stick of ram with spare - same problems.

Please help. This is a client's business system and I need to know whether or not I should just go out and buy them a new mobo / mpu combo or if I am missing something else.

- Meltdown :beer:
Click to expand...
1. Any business system should be run with a high quality PS. You don't need extreme performance. But you do need reliable performance. That's something that generic and some low end PS just can't offer.
2. Any business sytem should be run with a high quality MB to avoid data corruption, etc.
If you stay with his Duron, at least install good MB that uses the GF2 chipset, instead of the SiS that you have now.
The ECS that you have is a Micro-ATX, so make sure you get the same size to replace it.
My vote is for the Biostar M7NCG 400.
It has onboard video, just in case his video card craps out. 😉

 
wow, that board is much better than the one being offered at the shop i'm dealing with.

i'm going to call around to see if someone else has that. thanks! :beer:

dangit. no one's got it... One guy has an Asus E7V400-MX but it's for $119!!! @_@

another guy said, "we can't get Socket A boards anymore, sorry. *click*" :Q 😕
 
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