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Missouri Police Officer guns down unarmed 18 year old

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Jaskalas said:
After already being aggressively beaten?

That's not an option. You draw, you warn, you kill if threatened.

The standing issue is if there was a threat presented. Hands up or rushing forward. Don't know.
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So past deeds affect current decisions? B.S. I say. That's profiling or something.
 
LegendKiller said:
And you believe "most" accounts? This is your problem, you believe the snitches that won't get stitches because they tow the line.

I am sure that it is going to come out that they have very solid proof that Brown was heading towards Wilson. CTH already pointed out the shell casing landing points and how some are *BEHIND* where Brown ended up and they couldn't have traveled that far on their own. This indicates that Wilson's starting point was at least equal, if not behind, Brown's landing point. This points to the fact that Brown was approaching Wilson and his hands were *NOT* up. The unidentified witness, who is going to be far more truthful, clearly said Brown was heading towards Wilson.
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And that's why you are an idiot. Your whole rebuttle against people you disagree with is based on what evidence? Nothing but you sure as shit know, in your never wrong, gut that "snitches get stitches".

We call people like you trolls😉
 
ivwshane said:
And that's why you are an idiot. Your whole rebuttle against people you disagree with is based on what evidence? Nothing but you sure as shit know, in your never wrong, gut that "snitches get stitches".

We call people like you trolls😉
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No, its why I am an unbiased person that considers all evidence. It is my nature to create a mosaic and come up with a reasonable recommendation. Anybody with half a rational analytical brain cell could see where this was going from the start.

This is the thinking that is pervasive in a large portion of the black community. The 60minute piece highlights it. People like you make excuses and vacillate and ignore everything to the contrary because you are a racist ass who wants to drive an agenda. That agenda is to excuse shitty behavior in portions of society.
 
LegendKiller said:
No, its why I am an unbiased person that considers all evidence. It is my nature to create a mosaic and come up with a reasonable recommendation. Anybody with half a rational analytical brain cell could see where this was going from the start.

This is the thinking that is pervasive in a large portion of the black community. The 60minute piece highlights it. People like you make excuses and vacillate and ignore everything to the contrary because you are a racist ass who wants to drive an agenda. That agenda is to excuse shitty behavior in portions of society.
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Lol! Yep, their shitty behavior is the full story! No need to educate yourself further, you've got it all figured out. Thanks oreilly jr!

You've gone full retard indeed! You will note that you still haven't provided any evidence to discredit multiple witnesses, it's evident that facts actually don't form your decisions.
 
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ivwshane said:
Lol! Yep, their shitty behavior is the full story! No need to educate yourself further, you've got it all figured out. Thanks oreilly jr!

You've gone full retard indeed! You will note that you still haven't provided any evidence to discredit multiple witnesses, it's evident that facts actually don't form your decisions.
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There is plenty of evidence to discredit multiple witnesses. Including the "hands up, don't shoot" bullshit, the "he was running away when the cop shot him" and other such garbage. You refuse to acknowledge that and you refuse to acknowledge the truly unbiased and undiscredited witness, the one that wasn't identified and the ones that have not been identified that testified in front of the GJ and apparently corroborated Wilson's version of events. I will expect a full apology from you once the GJ doesn't choose to recommend an indictment and it comes out that these unidentified eyewitnesses did, in fact, corroborate Wilson. They will have completely countered all of your venerable (hah!) "eyewitnesses".

Yes, I do know what happened from the beginning once we heard about the initial shots, the convenience store hold up...etc.
 
highland145 said:
Damn, Mike, that's not how we roll. I'm guessing infractions for you, buddy.

Anyway, I still hope the actual GJ testimony comes out.
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Yep, me too.

The Merg said:
I thought I read that Wilson was 6' or 6-2. Brown was 6-4, right? I think the noticeable difference is in the weight of the subjects.

- Merg
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Yep, Brown was 6'-4". I'm meh about weight, in as much as it has its own advantages but it's not a predictor of strength, and if it's fat it comes with some disadvantages too.

ivwshane said:
Did you say the same thing when it was learned that Wilson worked on the police force of the nearby county had it's police force closed because of unethical behavior?

You have no clue how biased you are do you?
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You don't want Brown's immediately preceding robbery considered but you have no problem tarring Wilson, who was neither disciplined nor investigated, with his coworkers' misdeeds in the absence of any corroborating evidence. Nice.
 
LegendKiller said:
There is plenty of evidence to discredit multiple witnesses. Including the "hands up, don't shoot" bullshit, the "he was running away when the cop shot him" and other such garbage. You refuse to acknowledge that and you refuse to acknowledge the truly unbiased and undiscredited witness, the one that wasn't identified and the ones that have not been identified that testified in front of the GJ and apparently corroborated Wilson's version of events. I will expect a full apology from you once the GJ doesn't choose to recommend an indictment and it comes out that these unidentified eyewitnesses did, in fact, corroborate Wilson. They will have completely countered all of your venerable (hah!) "eyewitnesses".

Yes, I do know what happened from the beginning once we heard about the initial shots, the convenience store hold up...etc.
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Nothing the witnesses have said has been refuted. In fact the audio (which I quoted in this thread), said it appeared he was shot at but the officer didn't hit him and this is corroborated by the fact that other bullets were found lodged in another building.

You clearly haven't been paying attention to the facts and it's apparent, facts don't matter to you. That's why your whole case rests on, as of yet, unseen info from the grand jury. You've got nothing and you know it.

Now sure the grand jury could have received unreleased evidence that clears wilson and corroborates his story but you don't have that info and it's why I know you are full of shit when you claim to be right based on evidence you haven't even seen.

Troll
 
werepossum said:
Yep, me too.


Yep, Brown was 6'-4". I'm meh about weight, in as much as it has its own advantages but it's not a predictor of strength, and if it's fat it comes with some disadvantages too.


You don't want Brown's immediately preceding robbery considered but you have no problem tarring Wilson, who was neither disciplined nor investigated, with his coworkers' misdeeds in the absence of any corroborating evidence. Nice.
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Lol, you are pathetic! I just pointed out the hypocrisy. Brown wasn't convicted or charged either btw so by your own logic, browns prior actions shouldn't be considered. I don't think I need to tell you how stupid that is and I don't think I need to explain how stupid your excuse for Wilson is either. Feel free to research the incident though and understand why there wasn't any investigation or evidence, or remain ignorant, your choice.
 
ivwshane said:
Nothing the witnesses have said has been refuted. In fact the audio (which I quoted in this thread), said it appeared he was shot at but the officer didn't hit him and this is corroborated by the fact that other bullets were found lodged in another building.

You clearly haven't been paying attention to the facts and it's apparent, facts don't matter to you. That's why your whole case rests on, as of yet, unseen info from the grand jury. You've got nothing and you know it.

Now sure the grand jury could have received unreleased evidence that clears wilson and corroborates his story but you don't have that info and it's why I know you are full of shit when you claim to be right based on evidence you haven't even seen.

Troll
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He's right about one thing though: If some of the shell casings are behind Brown, the case is over. That means Wilson was retreating while firing AND that Brown was advancing while Wilson was firing. I've played Devil's advocate for both sides, but there is no scenario where that is true and Wilson is guilty of a crime. He could not possibly have moved the casings, as a whole neighborhood was watching and even filming by that point. At that point, Brown's supporters are reduced to arguing that he was murdered while trying to give Wilson a conciliatory hug.
 
ivwshane said:
Lol, you are pathetic! I just pointed out the hypocrisy. Brown wasn't convicted or charged either btw so by your own logic, browns prior actions shouldn't be considered. I don't think I need to tell you how stupid that is and I don't think I need to explain how stupid your excuse for Wilson is either. Feel free to research the incident though and understand why there wasn't any investigation or evidence, or remain ignorant, your choice.
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Brown's behavior is fully documented on video. He was saved from being charged and convicted only by being shot dead.
 
werepossum said:
Brown's behavior is fully documented on video. He was saved from being charged and convicted only by being shot dead.
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I guess that's the benefit of working in a corrupt and amoral police station, you get to control what gets recorded and reported.


I'm sure you understand this, am sure you get my point, because I'm sure you aren't that ignorant.
 
ivwshane said:
I guess that's the benefit of working in a corrupt and amoral police station, you get to control what gets recorded and reported.


I'm sure you understand this, am sure you get my point, because I'm sure you aren't that ignorant.
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That would certainly explain while that corrupt and amoral police department is still operating business as usual. Oh wait . . .

I will grant that we cannot be absolutely sure that Wilson (or indeed, any cop - or any person) is not corrupt. Neither do we have any evidence that Wilson is or was corrupt. But if we are to presume Wilson is corrupt because he worked at a police department where many cops were corrupt, should we not then go on to conclude that Brown should have been shot since we absolutely know he had just robbed a store? Not worked at a place where stores were robbed, but he personally, on video, robbed a store. Surely what's good enough for one party is good enough for the other. If so, then surely what Wilson's cop buddies did years before cannot be any more of an indictment than what Brown did minutes before. Guilt by association simply cannot be more diagnostic than guilt by one's own actions.
 
highland145 said:
My intent is to try and look objectively with what information we have. The thumb shot and blood in the car are enough to give reasonable doubt to the cop. Earlier in this thread, some opinions were that MB was never even near the cop. Some insisted he was running away but that was just opinion too. Unfortunately, we don't have video.

If this is accurate
No bill.
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Something that struck me about Melinek's words were that Brown took TWO shots to the chest. The report that was posted here showed one chest wound IIRC, and that wound was attributed to the shot that struck his eye and exited his jaw. If Brown took another shot to the chest, then he probably would have been falling when shot in the eye AND when shot in the crown. That doesn't settle charging versus coming forward in good Christian fellowship, but it would solve one of my bigger concerns with the charging story - the idea that he was charging with his head down, so that one round could strike his eye and exit his jaw and another strike the crown of his head. That never made any sense to me. Why charge with your head down? The arm strikes didn't seem likely to cause crumpling (although curling into a fetal position seemed a reasonable possibility) but a chest shot certainly would. A chest shot would be just the thing to cause one to crumple, exposing that angle to fire.

boomerang said:
If I lived in Ferguson I'd be stocking up on plywood for my windows right about now.
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Plywood's flammable. If you are going to rely on something flammable for protection, it had better burn significantly more, um, energetically. 😉

Seriously, I think the people who need fear a no true bill verdict are those in the tonier suburbs within angry mobbing distance. Some good lootin' there, compared to Ferguson.
 
werepossum said:
Something that struck me about Melinek's words were that Brown took TWO shots to the chest. The report that was posted here showed one chest wound IIRC, and that wound was attributed to the shot that struck his eye and exited his jaw. If Brown took another shot to the chest, then he probably would have been falling when shot in the eye AND when shot in the crown. That doesn't settle charging versus coming forward in good Christian fellowship, but it would solve one of my bigger concerns with the charging story - the idea that he was charging with his head down, so that one round could strike his eye and exit his jaw and another strike the crown of his head. That never made any sense to me. Why charge with your head down? The arm strikes didn't seem likely to cause crumpling (although curling into a fetal position seemed a reasonable possibility) but a chest shot certainly would. A chest shot would be just the thing to cause one to crumple, exposing that angle to fire.





Plywood's flammable. If you are going to rely on something flammable for protection, it had better burn significantly more, um, energetically. 😉



Seriously, I think the people who need fear a no true bill verdict are those in the tonier suburbs within angry mobbing distance. Some good lootin' there, compared to Ferguson.
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A bullet trajectory can do strange things once it hits a person. For instance, the bullet could hit the top of the orbital bone and then deflect downwards causing it to come out the jaw. Have any of the autopsy reports explained the trajectory of the bullets as after they struck Brown?

- Merg
 
The Merg said:
A bullet trajectory can do strange things once it hits a person. For instance, the bullet could hit the top of the orbital bone and then deflect downwards causing it to come out the jaw. Have any of the autopsy reports explained the trajectory of the bullets as after they struck Brown?

- Merg
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Not that I've seen. I'd have an easier time buying the magic bullet theory though if we were talking about a lightly stabilized, highly energetic (velocity vs momentum) rifle bullet than a well stabilized, low energy pistol bullet. Seems to me that even at point blank range, that would require an essentially elastic collision with a near-ninety degree turn retaining sufficient power to shatter facial bones and then also shatter the collar bone. Seems . . . unlikely.

But then I'm far from an expert in terminal ballistics and we are talking thin bones (absent the orbital bone of course) so YMMV.
 
werepossum said:
Brown's behavior is fully documented on video. He was saved from being charged and convicted only by being shot dead.
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Why you sooooo racist. Brown was a gentle giant, would never hurt a soul, was about to start college with full merit scholarship. He took those goods from the stores (on video) so he could give them to homeless folks. Anything else is just below the belt character assassination. Whoaaaaaaaaaaaa...soooo rrrrrraaacccciiiiiisssssttttt !!!!!!! <rinse and repeat with louder volume and wildly waving arms each time for even more effect>

<tongue in cheek parody of a typical Brown supporter>

😀
 
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In another thread I've made great fun (for good reason) of Vox.com as a news source, but it's taught me a couple of things that assuming they are true I should have learned from the MSM. http://www.vox.com/cards/mike-brown-protests-ferguson-missouri/mike-brown-ferguson-MO-protests

1. Brown was only in that area to visit his grandmother.
2. Brown was killed two days before he was to start classes at Vatterott College, a Missouri trade college. Seems axiomatic to me that thugs don't go to trade school, no?
3. Wilson was cognizant of the robbery, according to Chief Jackson:

The officer who shot Ferguson teen Michael Brown stopped Brown and another teen because they were walking in the street, not because of a robbery a few minutes earlier, Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said Friday afternoon.

Jackson said the officer was aware cigars had been taken in the robbery of a store nearby, but did not know when he encountered Brown and Dorian Johnson that they might be suspects. He stopped them because they were walking in the street, Jackson said.

But Jackson told the Post-Dispatch that the officer, Darren Wilson, saw cigars in Brown's hand and realized he might be the robber.
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After telling them to get out of the street - and them telling him to bite it, they were almost where they were going - Wilson noticed the cigars in Brown's hand and realized he might be the robber. This was why Wilson reversed back to them - and no doubt colored his reaction as much as it would have Brown's. http://www.vox.com/cards/mike-brown-protests-ferguson-missouri/mike-brown-ferguson-MO-protests I should also note that this seems to contradict what Jackson said earlier about this subject.

4. Brown died approximately 35' from Wilson's vehicle. Either that was the shortest chase in history or Brown did travel significantly back toward Wilson.

It's a pretty formulaic left-leaning story, but with a lot of good information clearly presented, as opposed to the he said/she said reporting so common today.
 
werepossum said:
He's right about one thing though: If some of the shell casings are behind Brown, the case is over. That means Wilson was retreating while firing AND that Brown was advancing while Wilson was firing. I've played Devil's advocate for both sides, but there is no scenario where that is true and Wilson is guilty of a crime. He could not possibly have moved the casings, as a whole neighborhood was watching and even filming by that point. At that point, Brown's supporters are reduced to arguing that he was murdered while trying to give Wilson a conciliatory hug.
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There's no released evidence to shell casings being behind Brown's body AFAIK, just maybe a claim made by CTH. Also remember that Brown ran 95 feet from Wilson's truck with Wilson in pursuit and firing but missing with those shots.
 
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