Minimum Wage increase

[brandonb]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/01/10/minimum.wage.ap/index.html

We are now 1 step closer to having higher income. However, is this really good for America?

This is how I see it:

1) People will be laid off because companies that do not increase the price of their products will have to cut elsewhere, and probably will just cut some jobs here or there. Unlikely to happen. They will just raise prices instead.

2) Because of bullet 1. Now a meal deal at McDonalds is now $7.25... Bread, egg, cheese, and other grocery items will increase in the same proportion. Likewise with every other products for sale.

3) What happens to those making $10.00/h? Do they just fall closer to the bottom? Or will their wage go up? I'm guessing their wage will not going to go up. However, products cost more (see #2)... So this just makes those already making above minimum wage be a slight bit closer to poverty. Effectively shoving more into the poor range, and reducing the middle class (not that $10.00/h is middle class, but you get the idea)

What are the benefits? Please don't say this will help the poor. If that is the case, lets just raise minimum wage to $125/h an get it over with because then everybody will be rich... Right? But theres a flaw with that, right? No, the only thing I see happening from this is inflation, but it does make democrats look "very good" to the morons living in this country who don't know any better.

What are positives of raising minimum wage, because I don't get it.

 

[ntdz]

While minimum wage will most definitely lead to job losses and a small uptick in inflation, it doesn't have nearly the effect it used to have. The main reason for that is that our manufacturing has moved to Asia, so a minimum wage increase here doesn't affect us like it used to.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: ntdz
While minimum wage will most definitely lead to job losses and a small uptick in inflation, it doesn't have nearly the effect it used to have. The main reason for that is that our manufacturing has moved to Asia, so a minimum wage increase here doesn't affect us like it used to.

OMFGBBQ, mark this date down.

Actually agree with ntdz on something.

All the whiners about how people will be laid off because companies that do not increase the price of their products will have to cut elsewhere, and probably will just cut some jobs here or there is a bunch of BS.

 

[zephyrprime]

Most manufacturing jobs used to pay a lot more than minimum wage so I don't seen how the loss of manufacturing jobs would make this less of an issue. If anything, with the loss of manufacturing jobs, the number of low paying service jobs have increased disproporationately thus making the change in the minimum wage more significant.

Also, the biggest cause of inflation is the banks creating so much credit.

 

[HombrePequeno]

This will not help the poor very much. Only 18% of those affected by this increase are in households at or below the poverty. The minimum wage increase would increase workers' wages whose hourly income is between $5.15 and $7.25 by $11 billion. A CBO study found that only $1.6 billion (15%) would go towards households at or below the poverty level.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: The EITC is much more effective in helping people get out of poverty because that is exactly what it targets. Here is a couple scenarios the CBO looked at:

One option was to increase the subsidy rate for childless workers by 50 percent. Another option was to increase the subsidy rate for workers with three or more children by 25 percent. On the basis of data from the CPS, combining those options would have increased total EITC payments by roughly $2.4 billion in 2004, with workers in poor families receiving $1.4 billion of that total.

Source: CBO

The CBO was looking for scenarios that would increase EITC benefits to poor families similar to how much the increased minimum wage would. So out of a $2.4 billion increase, $1.4 billion goes to poor families. Compare that with an increased minimum wage that pays out an extra $11 billion, of which only $1.6 billion gets to poor households.

 

[Craig234]

It's a good thing.

Understand that there are people who don't want to pay the higher wage who fund 'think tanks' to put out propaganda against it, and some here can re-post that.

Originally posted by: brandonb

This is how I see it:

1) People will be laid off because companies that do not increase the price of their products will have to cut elsewhere, and probably will just cut some jobs here or there. Unlikely to happen. They will just raise prices instead.

The studies I've seen show no rise in unemployment (remember all the increase is spent growing the economy), and negligible inflation.

2) Because of bullet 1. Now a meal deal at McDonalds is now $7.25... Bread, egg, cheese, and other grocery items will increase in the same proportion. Likewise with every other products for sale.

Negligible increase in inflation.

3) What happens to those making $10.00/h? Do they just fall closer to the bottom? Or will their wage go up? I'm guessing their wage will not going to go up. However, products cost more (see #2)... So this just makes those already making above minimum wage be a slight bit closer to poverty. Effectively shoving more into the poor range, and reducing the middle class (not that $10.00/h is middle class, but you get the idea)

Wages a little above minimum increase too.

What are the benefits? Please don't say this will help the poor.

This will... help you know who.

If that is the case, lets just raise minimum wage to $125/h an get it over with because then everybody will be rich... Right? But theres a flaw with that, right?

Yes, it's called "slippery slope". "Let's make the speed limit 55 MPH, it'll save gas".
"If you do that, make it 0 MPH and no gas is used."

No, the only thing I see happening from this is inflation, but it does make democrats look "very good" to the morons living in this country who don't know any better.

Seems to me it makes the democrats look bad to those people. People who are informed will like the democrats, however.

What are positives of raising minimum wage, because I don't get it.

It helps the you know who.

 

[techs]

The vote was 315-116. With 80 Republicans supporting it. Thats almost 75 percent of the House. The question is why with so much support the Repubicans never passed it during their reign?
Just goes to show how the Republican "majority of the majority" shall make all decisions type of rule was thwarting the will of the people.

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: techs
The vote was 315-116. With 80 Republicans supporting it. Thats almost 75 percent of the House. The question is why with so much support the Repubicans never passed it during their reign?
Just goes to show how the Republican "majority of the majority" shall make all decisions type of rule was thwarting the will of the people.

I don't think many Republicans were against it, so much as, it just didn't rank very high on their priority list. In DC, their is a differant dynamic now, and the circle jerk is over, for now, the pendulum swings both ways.

 

[fstime]

No, minimum wages and price floors/ceilings only throw the equilibriums price/wage into a disequilibrium.

 

[Darwin333]

I have not made minimum wage since I was 15 years old. Who makes minimum wage? Unskilled people do. After a single year on the job you have ..... skills on said job and (if you aren't an idiot) will be making more than the minimum wage. Poor people do not make minimum wage. Teenagers do.

With that said, I don't think this will drive prices up much. Just some "feel good" legislation.

 

[Jhhnn]

Very few people will be affected by the increase, so inflationary pressure will be nil, particularly compared to the inflationary pressures of increasing debt.

It does, however, serve to dignify the whole idea of work having rewards, to serve the idea that anybody who does work should actually be able to share in the wealth...

Face it, $7.25/hr is a really lousy wage, and won't go nearly as far as would minimum wage 30-40 years ago...

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: Darwin333
I have not made minimum wage since I was 15 years old. Who makes minimum wage? Unskilled people do. After a single year on the job you have ..... skills on said job and (if you aren't an idiot) will be making more than the minimum wage. Poor people do not make minimum wage. Teenagers do.

With that said, I don't think this will drive prices up much. Just some "feel good" legislation.

:thumbsup:

I started at McDonalds when I was 14, working the register, and when I got really lucky they put me on fry duty. I got a raise before I turned 15. I'm still trying to figure out how an adult would still be making minimum wage.

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Very few people will be affected by the increase, so inflationary pressure will be nil, particularly compared to the inflationary pressures of increasing debt.

It does, however, serve to dignify the whole idea of work having rewards, to serve the idea that anybody who does work should actually be able to share in the wealth...

Face it, $7.25/hr is a really lousy wage, and won't go nearly as far as would minimum wage 30-40 years ago...

It does not dignify the whole idea of work having rewards, you are giving people a raise for doing absolutely nothing. It just reafirms the sense of entitlement many people in this country have. Working hard and then getting a raise because you worked hard is what dignifies the idea of work having rewards.

 

[blackllotus]

I don't see the value in trying to protect companies that can't survive without paying their workers slave wages

 

[Jhhnn]

Nice spin, JD50. You didn't seem to think about it that way when the repubs gave investors an extra 5% by cutting capital gains taxes- for "doing nothing", as you put it...

 

[Aisengard]

If so little people make minimum wage, then what the hell is so wrong with raising it?

So basically there is no reason to not force companies too cheap to pay slave wages (like blacklotus said) to pay their poor workers more.

Thanks Republicans, you just re-enforced the Democrat's argument. There's still time to join the light side!

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Nice spin, JD50. You didn't seem to think about it that way when the repubs gave investors an extra 5% by cutting capital gains taxes- for "doing nothing", as you put it...

They're not giving investors 5%, they're taking 5% less and encouraging investment. Are you against encouraging investment?

 

[Darwin333]

Originally posted by: blackllotus
I don't see the value in trying to protect companies that can't survive without paying their workers slave wages

$7.25 an hour is hardly a "living wage".

As I said, this will have no affect to actual hard working Americans.

Big business will most likely benefit the most from this legislation. Kids will now have more money to buy Ipods, CD's, and PS3's.

 

[SirStev0]

I actually think in theory it is a good idea. The problem is that in actuality it will do very little if not hurt the little guy. Attempting to force business to pay the worker more is an attempt to force trickle down economics. Rich people DO NOT want to give up thier hard earned inherited money. It is a fact. Giving them tax cuts will not convince them to do it. Forcing them to pay each employee more just gives them a reason to cut jobs. It is an uphill battle either way.

 

[shadow9d9]

You are right! We should never have raised the minimum tax higher than $0.25 like it was in the 60s-70s! That way we could have our own mini China!

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Nice spin, JD50. You didn't seem to think about it that way when the repubs gave investors an extra 5% by cutting capital gains taxes- for "doing nothing", as you put it...

They're not giving investors 5%, they're taking 5% less and encouraging investment. Are you against encouraging investment?

I think you can also say the same about a minimum wage increase no?

an increase in minimum wage could be a catalyst for weaning unemployed people off assistance and back to the workforce...

I dunno...just throwing that out there.

 

[Jhhnn]

JD50 and ntdz are just supporting conservative branding- it doesn't have to make sense, it just has to have the approval of the usual conservative pundits... Raising minimum wage is automatically "bad", because it's not "conservative"...

If cutting capital gains taxes "encourages investment", then raising minimum wage must "encourage work", right?

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Nice spin, JD50. You didn't seem to think about it that way when the repubs gave investors an extra 5% by cutting capital gains taxes- for "doing nothing", as you put it...

They're not giving investors 5%, they're taking 5% less and encouraging investment. Are you against encouraging investment?

I think you can also say the same about a minimum wage increase no?

an increase in minimum wage could be a catalyst for weaning unemployed people off assistance and back to the workforce...

I dunno...just throwing that out there.

I doubt $.75 or whatever the increase is will be enough to get someone who makes more being on social security and doing nothing than working will make them all of the sudden want to work.

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: ntdz
While minimum wage will most definitely lead to job losses and a small uptick in inflation, it doesn't have nearly the effect it used to have. The main reason for that is that our manufacturing has moved to Asia, so a minimum wage increase here doesn't affect us like it used to.

Agreed.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
JD50 and ntdz are just supporting conservative branding- it doesn't have to make sense, it just has to have the approval of the usual conservative pundits... Raising minimum wage is automatically "bad", because it's not "conservative"...

If cutting capital gains taxes "encourages investment", then raising minimum wage must "encourage work", right?

No. Actually raising minimum wage is about the most racist thing we can do. If you support minimum wage then you are a racist.

It's been proven time and time again...

Raise minimum wage = less jobs, more competition for jobs
Education = more desirable worker
Put two and two together and you see what is wrong. Not only do you pass the wage hikes directly to the consumer you affect the poor the most in these increases. You hit minorities with a "double whammy". Higher costs of goods coupled with higher competition for jobs. Way to go minimum wage hike.