• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."

Miles Driven Gas Tax

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,183
60
91
Some Officials in government want to tax you vehicle based on miles driven. I wonder how they plan to control this? For the most part passenger vehicles dont have much wear and tare on the roadways. It is more the weight of the vehicles. So trucks and vans and larger vehicles are the ones that should pay more tax.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/way-tax-car-owners-pay-164657091.html

Taxing Electric Cars

"Starting in February the state of Washington will tax electric vehicle owners $100 per year. It's estimated there are a little more than 1,500 electric cars in Washington.

The money raised will go to the state's road maintenance fund. In essence, Washington wants electric car owners to pay $100 for the privilege of driving around the state."



First the government wanted manufacturers to get a lower MPG to produce less pollution and better gas economy. Now they are saying this causes a shortfall in Gas Tax revenues so they cant afford to repair the roads. So after all these years of telling us we need to get more MPG to cut down on pollution, the government wants to punish automobile owners for doing what they wanted them to do.

No good deed goes unpunished.
 
Last edited:

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,255
699
126
So the pizza delivery guy with a Corolla driving hundreds of miles per day will pay far more than the executive driving a 9,000 pound Ford Excursion 20 miles per day, even though the excursion will probably put as much or more wear and tear on the highway. This is just another way to shift and increase the tax burden to the middle and lower classes.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
27,985
3,208
126
general gas tax is simpler and more effective.

those whole drive more are taxed more, those who drive less are taxed less, an those who drive bigger vehicles with lower fuel efficiency also get taxed more vs a lighter vehicle w/ higher fuel efficiency.

and it takes out all the logistical and administrative problems of trying to record and tax people based on mileage.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
28,523
1,573
126
A LEAF weighs 3,300 pounds. A Volt Weights 3,700 pounds. A Prius weighs 3,000 pounds. A Prius C weighs 2,500 pounds.

Batteries are heavy.

A Tesla S weighs up to 4,600 pounds.

There's no reason to discount these vehicles as far as road wear and tear if you are using a mileage tax, imo.
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,435
84
91
and it takes out all the logistical and administrative problems of trying to record and tax people based on mileage.
Mandatory GPS blackboxes can fix that problem. These devices can send your daily travel results directly to Washington without intervention from the user.
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,255
699
126
A LEAF weighs 3,300 pounds. A Volt Weights 3,700 pounds. A Prius weighs 3,000 pounds. A Prius C weighs 2,500 pounds.

Batteries are heavy.

A Tesla S weighs up to 4,600 pounds.

There's no reason to discount these vehicles as far as road wear and tear if you are using a mileage tax, imo.
A Ford Excursion weighs 9,000 pounds. Yep, same class as a Prius in wear and tear. :rolleyes:

How about a semi? Would you think that would be the same?
 

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,395
128
106
general gas tax is simpler and more effective.

those whole drive more are taxed more, those who drive less are taxed less, an those who drive bigger vehicles with lower fuel efficiency also get taxed more vs a lighter vehicle w/ higher fuel efficiency.

and it takes out all the logistical and administrative problems of trying to record and tax people based on mileage.
^^ Agree, and it works btw.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,310
175
106
How about the government quits wasting all our money, running constantly in the red, and spending the majority of their time trying to invent new taxes and fees?
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Administrator
Mar 5, 2001
49,619
162
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
For electric vehicles, it would be far easier to assess a single tax at time of registration. But, this is stupid, because then it makes the perceived cost of owning an electric vehicle higher - while at the same time trying to encourage more people to use electric vehicles.

Personally, I wouldn't want a per-mile tax (Since we've put 130,000 miles on our van in 4 years), unless they simply eliminate the gas tax which covers the same thing. Yeah, like that's going to happen. So, I'm already paying more in taxes via paying the tax on gas in NY.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,313
2
0
Ultimately a hybrid model or total removal of the tax on gas for road maintenance is necessary. Certainly in states that have a yearly safety inspection this kind of thing is easy to assess. I drive an exceptionally fuel efficient vehicle and I do know that I am not "paying my fair share" of road wear with it.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
16,009
1,678
126
NJ already has this (somewhat). They charge very low gas taxes and very high tolls on their two main arterial N/S roads - NJ Turnpike, which is basically I-95, and the Garden State Parkway. The problem is that East/West roads like 80, 78 and 195, and 287 which is a beltway around NYC, don't charge tolls.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,183
60
91
My thought was the logistics of trying to compute tax based on milage would be a major hassle. Who is going to verify the milage? Then when and how is the tax paid? If you check the car once a year then that might be a huge tax bill all at once. It is just stupid-ville.

Now if you had to relicense your car every 12 months and pay the tax at time of registration, that might be doable. If they just came up with a stard milage chart for the tax and maybe a multiplier for the weight. Just because a mini-cooper weighs less maybe their tax should be less also. This might actually be enough of an incentive to buy a smaller car.

Maybe compute an average milage per year and charge that for the license fee and if you go over you have to pay more. Less milage gets you a credit when you relicense your vehicle.
 
Last edited:

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
8,445
0
0
A repost from this D. Cowen thread.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2294343

The New Way to Tax Car Owners: Pay Per Mile Driven
1-7-2013

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/way-ta...164657091.html

The New Way to Tax Car Owners: Pay Per Mile Driven



Starting in February the state of Washington will tax electric vehicle owners $100 per year. It's estimated there are a little more than 1,500 electric cars in Washington.



Meanwhile, lawmakers in Oregon are kicking around the idea of taxing high mileage vehicles starting in 2015. The Oregon tax could be a flat annual fee and/or a tax per mile driven.


Big Brother Tracking Where You Drive?


As more states look to VMT or per-mile driven taxes, they will wrestle with the tricky issue of calculating how many miles people drive.

There is also the idea of monitoring how many miles are driven using transponders on all cars and trucks. This idea pits benefit of having a more accurate read on the mileage of each vehicle against concerns the state will be able to monitor where you have driven your car.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
13,211
2,817
136
How about a small tax on electricity to make up for the loss in gas taxes? This actually created a new benefit for switching over to electric cars as the cost will be distributed across everyone if they are driving an electric or not.
 

Attic

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2010
4,284
2
76
Semis do an order of magnitude more wear and tear on roads than your average commuter vehicle.

How about the gbmt just acts responsibly and fixes the roads with the money they bring in from the rainbow of taxes they hit everybody with all the time (gas tax, dmv tax, state tax, sales tax, ect)

If this thinking is tolerated then you are an idiot if you dn't ask yourself "what's next?"
 

Nintendesert

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2010
7,761
5
0
So the pizza delivery guy with a Corolla driving hundreds of miles per day will pay far more than the executive driving a 9,000 pound Ford Excursion 20 miles per day, even though the excursion will probably put as much or more wear and tear on the highway. This is just another way to shift and increase the tax burden to the middle and lower classes.



DERP. Taxes on gas have always been highly regressive. Welcome to forever. o_O
 
Nov 29, 2006
14,649
2,457
126
Arent we already taxed this way? I mean if you drive more you fill up more, thus paying more taxes than someone who doesnt drive as much. Seems the current gas tax system is fine.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
13,211
2,817
136
Arent we already taxed this way? I mean if you drive more you fill up more, thus paying more taxes than someone who doesnt drive as much. Seems the current gas tax system is fine.
What the states are worried about is the trend is moving to electric cars or hybrid cars, which use little or no gas.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,321
2
0
general gas tax is simpler and more effective.

those whole drive more are taxed more, those who drive less are taxed less, an those who drive bigger vehicles with lower fuel efficiency also get taxed more vs a lighter vehicle w/ higher fuel efficiency.

and it takes out all the logistical and administrative problems of trying to record and tax people based on mileage.
You mean like the 50 cents a gallon in taxes that a lot of states already have?
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,255
699
126
What the states are worried about is the trend is moving to electric cars or hybrid cars, which use little or no gas.
Of course, they forget about the tax that you pay to the electric company on the electricity that you use.
 

theevilsharpie

Platinum Member
Nov 2, 2009
2,323
14
81
First the government wanted manufacturers to get a lower MPG to produce less pollution and better gas economy. Now they are saying this causes a shortfall in Gas Tax revenues so they cant afford to repair the roads. So after all these years of telling us we need to get more MPG to cut down on pollution, the government wants to punish automobile owners for doing what they wanted them to do.

No good deed goes unpunished.
I love how you conveniently omitted the paragraph that came directly after:

Take a look at the Washington electric vehicle tax and compare it to the state's current gas tax of 37 cents per gallon. If somebody drives an internal combustion car that gets 30 MPG and they average 12,500 miles driven each year, they'll pay about $154 a year in state gas tax. By comparison, electric car owners will be paying less at just $100 per year.
 
Nov 8, 2012
19,223
4,205
136
general gas tax is simpler and more effective.

those whole drive more are taxed more, those who drive less are taxed less, an those who drive bigger vehicles with lower fuel efficiency also get taxed more vs a lighter vehicle w/ higher fuel efficiency.

and it takes out all the logistical and administrative problems of trying to record and tax people based on mileage.
But... but... those electric car owners are THEIVES I TELL YOU!

The government is getting more and more abusive with tax dollars, and we just keep feeding and feeding. Anyone live in places with toll ways? Originally created to pay for the roadway that was built, then they realized "Oh shit, this is decent money... lets just...keep this toll way pay going :cool:" ... and no one notable ever complains because your average person is too stupid to know.

The abuse continues to plague the general middle class consumer, yet liberals encourage this kind of activity apparently.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY