Question Might be buying an Intel "F" CPU

[t4d]

Thinking about saving a few dollars on an "F"- type Intel CPU.

But........if my GPU stops working will I be able to see anything on the monitor as the system boots up with a non-functional GPU?

How would I know the GPU is not working, or will the system boot and then display some basic text characters?

 

[ZGR]

Your motherboard will have some way of displaying an error.

My cheapo B550 has lights indicating what the failure would be. My old Z97 actually indicates the post code on a little display.

 

[TheELF]

Your motherboard will have some way of displaying an error.

Will have to have...
Not all mobos have this and you would have to make sure to get one that does and that will cost extra.

 

[mikeymikec]

beeeep beep beep beep

 

[Thunder 57]

I wouldn't save ~$30 by giving up iGPU functionality. Just my humble opinion.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I wouldn't save ~$30 by giving up iGPU functionality. Just my humble opinion.

This.

The F model will have no video output at all. Plugging the monitor into the board will do nothing. Troubleshooting diagnostics aside, the iGPU means you can still do daily driver stuff until you can get another vid card.

 

[Markfw]

This.

The F model will have no video output at all. Plugging the monitor into the board will do nothing. Troubleshooting diagnostics aside, the iGPU means you can still do daily driver stuff until you can get another vid card.

My 12700F was like $100 or more less. I will have to look. $312 to $400 12700k

 

[DAPUNISHER]

My 12700F was like $100 or more less. I will have to look. $312 to $400 12700k

You would be comparing to the 12700 if using the non K. If you look at the 12700K and KF it is only a $22 gap on Newegg. And the gap between the 12700 and 12700F on Amazon is about $30.

 

[Tech Junky]

IMO skip anything with F in the model. It's worth the extra small upcharge to have a video output if your $1000+ GPU dies.

It's kind of like the saying "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure"

 

[mikeymikec]

It's a slightly different value proposition at the low end of the market. If you save $30 on a $100 CPU that is quite a saving. On the flipside, add $30 and getting a higher class of CPU but without graphics can be a game-changer. Also, chances are if you're shopping at the low end of the market for CPUs, then you're not buying a $1000+ GPU.

Having said all that this would seem like a no-brainer offer in the pre- pandemic and crazy GPU prices era, but since GPU prices are still pretty crazy, having a backup GPU for $30 doesn't seem like that bad a deal.

However, on the AMD side of things IIRC you lose PCIE channels by going for their G-range CPUs, does anything similar happen with Intel?

 

[TheELF]

beeeep beep beep beep

There are mobos that don't even have a beeper.

 

[mikeymikec]

There are mobos that don't even have a beeper.

So buy a motherboard speaker? They seem to be selling for less than a beer in the UK on ebay...

 

[TheELF]

So buy a motherboard speaker? They seem to be selling for less than a beer in the UK on ebay...

Yes, that was my point from the get go, you have to make sure that it has something to notify you...

 

[t4d]

Well, will the mobo be "aware" that the GPU has failed? Is GPU failure something that they check at start-up?

 

[zir_blazer]

The extra 30 U$D for the Intel IGP means having a backup GPU + more usable video outputs (Sometimes saving you from having to use an adapter. It may be regional variants, but HDMI is a far more common input on Monitors than DP, and you tend to get only one HDMI) + QuickSync for streaming offload + potential SR-IOV support for GPU Virtualization ain't that bad.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I'm of mixed thought on this. Mostly, for budget gaming builds, where you know that you'll have a dGPU, then the $30 you'll save getting the "F" model CPU might be enough of a saving, to boost your memory and / or OS storage SSD capacity. The biggest downside is, no quicksync available for game streaming, although if you choose a modern, "proper" GPU, then it will have media-encoding capabilities.

You're generally not losing any gaming performance by dropping down to an "F" SKU, so if you're on a tight budget, why not?

The benefit of troubleshooting with a non-F SKU, should you find it in the budget, is undeniable as well. The problem is, in a budget build, that extra spend will more than likely cost you performance in the overall build budget.

 

[mikeymikec]

Well, will the mobo be "aware" that the GPU has failed? Is GPU failure something that they check at start-up?

The board checks to see if it can find graphics hardware. If it can't, that beep code is emitted via the board speaker that's been mentioned in this thread. The speaker is also useful for diagnosing other simple failures.

Graphics cards can fail in ways that don't produce the beep sequence though.

 

[Shmee]

I kinda have mixed feelings on this. I don't really need the integrated GPU, and would rather have a spare video card if mine were to fail. You cannot game on the iGPU really anyway. That said, if the difference in price is small, perhaps better to get the version with the graphics? But then again, will the iGPU models maybe not OC/boost as well? Not sure.

Also, keep in mind some of the nicer motherboards don't have display outs, as they use that room for additional USB or network ports, etc...so bottom line is, invest in a spare video card, certainly while prices are good.

 

[mikeymikec]

I kinda have mixed feelings on this. I don't really need the integrated GPU, and would rather have a spare video card if mine were to fail. You cannot game on the iGPU really anyway. That said, if the difference in price is small, perhaps better to get the version with the graphics? But then again, will the iGPU models maybe not OC/boost as well? Not sure.

Also, keep in mind some of the nicer motherboards don't have display outs, as they use that room for additional USB or network ports, etc...so bottom line is, invest in a spare video card, certainly while prices are good.

I guess it depends on how serious the problem is. I ended up doing a platform upgrade for what turned out to be a faulty graphics card once. Eventually I tried a lowlier graphics card but still enough to run the likes of StarCraft 2 / XCOM2 / Skyrim before I was certain of the diagnosis. Even in my line of work I was lucky to have a spare graphics card of a compatible calibre.

 

[Lil'John]

I'll piggy back on this since I'm looking at 12100f.

Does things like Handbrake suffer from lack of IGpu(Quicksync??)?

Is there a lack of Watts by not going with IGpu?

Basically, aside from the 'lack of diagnostic capability', is there any real downfall?

 

[Thunder 57]

I'll piggy back on this since I'm looking at 12100f.

Does things like Handbrake suffer from lack of IGpu(Quicksync??)?

Is there a lack of Watts by not going with IGpu?

Basically, aside from the 'lack of diagnostic capability', is there any real downfall?

No Quicksync.

 

[TheELF]

Does things like Handbrake suffer from lack of IGpu(Quicksync??)?

If you convert with quicksync it is much faster than using the CPU cores but if you have a GPU that has hardware encoding than you can use that instead.

Is there a lack of Watts by not going with IGpu?

The whatt now?
The CPUs use and/or have available the same amount of power no matter if they have the iGPU or not.

 

[BorisTheBlade82]

However, on the AMD side of things IIRC you lose PCIE channels by going for their G-range CPUs, does anything similar happen with Intel?

No. The AMD G-range is a completely different product in comparison to their other desktop products. These are basically their monolithic mobile chips which have less cache and PCIE lanes.
With Ryzen 7000 there will be an iGPU in more or less every Desktop CPU as well.

 

[TheELF]

With Ryzen 7000 there will be an iGPU in more or less every Desktop CPU as well.

It would be stupid of AMD to not go the same way as intel with F and normal CPUs, putting the igpu in every unit will increase prices for every unit.

On the other hand it might be even costlier for amd to set up two assembly lines and produce two different chipsets (or however these are assembled) and they might not be able to afford it.

 

[Lil'John]

If you convert with quicksync it is much faster than using the CPU cores but if you have a GPU that has hardware encoding than you can use that instead.

The whatt now?
The CPUs use and/or have available the same amount of power no matter if they have the iGPU or not.

I thought that the iGPU had quicksync and other video type functionality(h264???) integrated in it. Thus no iGPU, no quicksync, etc. But I haven't done any real research into it and I'm relying upon old/stale knowledge.

My question on power is related to whether the iGPU pulls overhead away from the CPU maximum ability. For example, iGPU whether in use or not impacts max turbo or not/etc.

It would be stupid of AMD to not go the same way as intel with F and normal CPUs, putting the igpu in every unit will increase prices for every unit.

On the other hand it might be even costlier for amd to set up two assembly lines and produce two different chipsets (or however these are assembled) and they might not be able to afford it.

I'd be beyond shocked if Intel has some special "F assembly line". I think the F series are more than likely non-F chips that the iGPU features failed on... kind of like how Intel segments cpu cores based upon pass/fail or max turbo based upon how the chip tests out.