2Xtreme21

Diamond Member
Jun 13, 2004
7,044
0
0
Will we see the Repubs approve her out of spite for the other party? It seems like, anymore, everything is partisan in Congress (and everywhere else) where each person blindly follows his / her party regardless of his own stance. Think they'll be able to think for themselves in this issue?
 

cwjerome

Diamond Member
Sep 30, 2004
4,346
26
81
Two points:

If the majority of Dems reject her, then Reps will fight to approve her. Basically many on the Right are disappointed with the pick, but they'll end up supporting her... ESPECIALLY if the Dems oppose her. Because they won't let the Dems win politically.

If the Majority of Dems reject her, then the conservatives will get what they want: A fight. An honest, public battle of ideas with the Left.
 

imported_Condor

Diamond Member
Sep 22, 2004
5,425
0
0
Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21
Will we see the Repubs approve her out of spite for the other party? It seems like, anymore, everything is partisan in Congress (and everywhere else) where each person blindly follows his / her party regardless of his own stance. Think they'll be able to think for themselves in this issue?

Sure, like Democrats did under Clinton.

 

imported_Condor

Diamond Member
Sep 22, 2004
5,425
0
0
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Two points:

If the majority of Dems reject her, then Reps will fight to approve her. Basically many on the Right are disappointed with the pick, but they'll end up supporting her... ESPECIALLY if the Dems oppose her. Because they won't let the Dems win politically.

If the Majority of Dems reject her, then the conservatives will get what they want: A fight. An honest, public battle of ideas with the Left.

The left will be coming to the battle field unarmed. Should be a short fight.

 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
If they want to fight so bad then let them go to Iraq.


:cookie:

And if you want to post something, try using your brain

What's a matter ChickenHawk?? Don't like my 'tude? LOL
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,745
6,762
126
The Republican lunatic anti abortion crowd were handed the horrible truth by Bush. Roe will not be overturned. All their work and passion was only useful politically. Roe is established law and that's the way it is. But the right to an abortion can be legally limited. As the truth slowly sinks in the right will have a new slogan,,,,,,,Abort Bush!

 

Todd33

Diamond Member
Oct 16, 2003
7,842
2
81
Originally posted by: cwjerome
An honest, public battle of ideas with the Left.

Ok, that's just funny. The right wants a public debate of ideas? LOL
 

cwjerome

Diamond Member
Sep 30, 2004
4,346
26
81
Originally posted by: Todd33
Originally posted by: cwjerome
An honest, public battle of ideas with the Left.

Ok, that's just funny. The right wants a public debate of ideas? LOL


Yeah... because you and the Liberal Left have been getting your faces shoved in sh*t for quite some time, and a little more certainly wouldn't hurt. Actually I think you've grown accustomed to the taste because you always seem to ask for more.

LOL is right ;)

 
Jun 27, 2005
19,216
1
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It's starting to look more and more like NOBODY... left or right... wants Miers.

The Right wanted an honest to goodness, unapologetic hard core right winger appointment to the court. They wanted the fight. They wanted to pull the trigger on the nuclear/constitutional option. They wanted to have the debate with the left out in the open. They wanted Kennedy and Schumer et al to read from the script handed to them by Soros and Neas so the american public could see where the left was coming from. Now they don't get that.

And the left? Well they don't know what they are doing. They don't know if they have another Scalia on their hands or if they've been handed another Souter. If they oppose her, why? Because she's Dubbya's pick? They need a reason otherwise they go back to looking like the stonewalling idiots they've been made out to be over the last five years.

And in the middle of it all you've got Dubbya saying "trust me".

I don't like the pick. The adventurous 'sex-on-the-beach" side of me likes her just because she's an unknown. Nobody knows what she is going to do. Nobody has any idea. Sometimes wildcards are fun. But the rational side of me would rather deal with the fight over a known quantity like Janice Brown or Luddig or any one of a dozen other known constructionist judges.

In my opinion this nom was a cop out. She's a nom that, while they may not have any reason to approve her, they have no real reason to bounce her either.

I'm hoping she gets bounced in committee quickly so we can move on to a real nomination.

EDIT: (Then again maybe Dub knows what he's doing and he's saving the best for last. He has three years left and the odds say that he'll have another nom before he's done. Maybe he's boning up for a real fight later. Meh. Who knows)
 

CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
Another Regilious Activist ?

<Fort Worthless Rag>

Uh-oh. Now we are in trouble. Doesn't take much to read the tea leaves on the Harriet Miers nomination.

First, it's Bunker Time at the White House. Miers' chief qualification for this job is loyalty to George W. Bush and the team. What the nomination means in larger terms for both law and society is the fifth vote on the court to overturn Roe vs. Wade.

Miers, like Bush himself, is classic Texas conservative Establishment, with the addition of Christian fundamentalism. What I mean by fundamentalist is one who believes in both biblical inerrancy and salvation by faith alone.

She attended Valley View Christian Church of Dallas for at least 20 years before moving to Washington five years ago. Among that church's alumni is Nathan Hecht of the Texas Supreme Court, considered second only to former Justice Priscilla Owen as that court's most adamantly anti-abortion judge.

According to Miers' friends, she was pro-choice when a young woman but later changed her mind as a result of a Christian experience of some kind.

Miers had the support of feminists when she ran for office first in the Dallas bar and later when she became the first female president of the State Bar of Texas, even though the feminists were aware she was anti-choice.

At that time, the far more conservative Texas bar was at odds with the American Bar Association and sometimes threatened to withdraw from the national organization. Miers was considered a moderate in that she did not want to withdraw from the ABA but favored a proposal to change the organization's stance from support for abortion rights to a position of neutrality.

One of Miers' key backers was Louise Raggio, a much-revered Dallas feminist lawyer. The female lawyers groups favored Miers despite her stand on abortion because she was a candidate acceptable to the Establishment, thus making her electable as a woman.

Miers sometimes took female judicial candidates through her very prestigious law firm for the obligatory meet-'n'-greet and even donated to Democratic candidates.

The slightly feminist tinge to her credentials is a plus, but she is quite definitely anti-abortion.

She ran for the City Council in 1989 as a moderate but struggled during her interview with the lesbian-gay coalition. (At the time, it would have been considered progressive to even show up.) The Dallas Police Department did not then hire gays or lesbians, and when asked about the policy, Miers replied that the department should hire the best-qualified people -- the classic political sidestep answer.

When pressed, she said she did believe that one should be able to legally discriminate against gays, and it is the recollection of two of the organization's officers that the response involved her religious beliefs.

I have said for years about people in public life, "I don't write about sex, drugs or rock 'n' roll." If I had my druthers, I wouldn't write about the religion of those in public life, either, as I consider it a most private matter.

Separation of church and state is in the Constitution because this country was founded by people who had experienced both religious persecution and state-supported religions. I think John F. Kennedy's 1960 statement to the Baptist ministers should stand as a model of how public servants should handle the relation between religious belief and public service.

Nevertheless, we are now beset by people who insist on dragging religion into governance -- and who themselves believe they are beset by people determined to "drive God from the public square."

This division has been in part created, and certainly aggravated, by those seeking political advantage. It is a recipe for an incredibly damaging and serious split in this country, and I believe we all need to think long and carefully before doing anything to make it worse.

As an 1803 quote attributed to James Madison goes: "The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries."

 

joshw10

Senior member
Feb 16, 2004
806
0
0
Has anyone thought that it's possible when Bush (or any president) looks for a nominee, there could be any discussion such as "If you agree to vote this way on these cases that may come up, I'll appoint you for the job" ? Unless perhaps both President and candidate are afraid to make such a proposition so they talk in "code". I think there absolutely is going to be a litmus test with anyone, "Shares my judicial philosophy" has to mean something. Of course it is unknown whether Republican *politicians* really want Roe v. Wade overturned.

Perhaps Miers is close enough a friend to Bush that they can have this kind of discussion and that makes it a sure bet for Bush and he's saying "trust me *wink wink*"
 

zendari

Banned
May 27, 2005
6,558
0
0
Originally posted by: joshw10
Has anyone thought that it's possible when Bush (or any president) looks for a nominee, there could be any discussion such as "If you agree to vote this way on these cases that may come up, I'll appoint you for the job" ? Unless perhaps both President and candidate are afraid to make such a proposition so they talk in "code". I think there absolutely is going to be a litmus test with anyone, "Shares my judicial philosophy" has to mean something. Of course it is unknown whether Republican *politicians* really want Roe v. Wade overturned.

Not only is that possible, I think it's quite likely.

 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
I guess maybe I am missing the resentment towards her ourside of the MSM.
I saw the usual suspects like Reid, Boxer, Pelosi all giving the green thumbs up. If those hacks arent blocking her I dont know who will.
 

imported_tss4

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2004
1,607
0
0
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: joshw10
Has anyone thought that it's possible when Bush (or any president) looks for a nominee, there could be any discussion such as "If you agree to vote this way on these cases that may come up, I'll appoint you for the job" ? Unless perhaps both President and candidate are afraid to make such a proposition so they talk in "code". I think there absolutely is going to be a litmus test with anyone, "Shares my judicial philosophy" has to mean something. Of course it is unknown whether Republican *politicians* really want Roe v. Wade overturned.

Not only is that possible, I think it's quite likely.


Impossible. Bush doesn't use a litmus test. ;)
 

imported_tss4

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2004
1,607
0
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
I guess maybe I am missing the resentment towards her ourside of the MSM.
I saw the usual suspects like Reid, Boxer, Pelosi all giving the green thumbs up. If those hacks arent blocking her I dont know who will.

This is interesting. Either Bush is absolutely brilliant and will manage to get a conservative in with little fight from the dems. OR he's about to seriously piss off his base (if she's not that conservative)
 

zendari

Banned
May 27, 2005
6,558
0
0
Originally posted by: tss4
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: joshw10
Has anyone thought that it's possible when Bush (or any president) looks for a nominee, there could be any discussion such as "If you agree to vote this way on these cases that may come up, I'll appoint you for the job" ? Unless perhaps both President and candidate are afraid to make such a proposition so they talk in "code". I think there absolutely is going to be a litmus test with anyone, "Shares my judicial philosophy" has to mean something. Of course it is unknown whether Republican *politicians* really want Roe v. Wade overturned.

Not only is that possible, I think it's quite likely.


Impossible. Bush doesn't use a litmus test. ;)

I didn't say it was a litmus test in the sense you vote this way or else. But I would be surprised if it wasn't a consideration.
 

BDawg

Lifer
Oct 31, 2000
11,631
2
0
Originally posted by: Todd33
Originally posted by: cwjerome
An honest, public battle of ideas with the Left.

Ok, that's just funny. The right wants a public debate of ideas? LOL

Of course they don't want a debate. They want a yelling match where the shout the same lies over and over again. Dubya lost all 3 debates in 04. Cheney lost his 1. Yet they won because they over shouted terrah, terrah, terrah, homos.
 

wiin

Senior member
Oct 28, 1999
937
0
76
...Separation of church and state is in the Constitution because this country was founded by people who had experienced both religious persecution and state-supported religions. I think John F. Kennedy's 1960 statement to the Baptist ministers should stand as a model of how public servants should handle the relation between religious belief and public service. ..

Why do people keep saying that the seperation of state and church is in the constitution when no such statement appear in the constitution?

 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,745
6,762
126
Originally posted by: tss4
Originally posted by: Genx87
I guess maybe I am missing the resentment towards her ourside of the MSM.
I saw the usual suspects like Reid, Boxer, Pelosi all giving the green thumbs up. If those hacks arent blocking her I dont know who will.

This is interesting. Either Bush is absolutely brilliant and will manage to get a conservative in with little fight from the dems. OR he's about to seriously piss off his base (if she's not that conservative)

His base IIIIIISSSSS pissed. They want a known anti abortionist and don't want to trust the president. He stabbed them on the Roberts nomination.