Microsoft to collect fees for OpenGL patents [AND web services]

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DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
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ZDNet story OpenGL is the open standards competitor to Windows-only DirectX. Microsoft has been buying up patents from other companies and is now claiming it may hold patents on two forms of lighting and shading. Shady indeed.

Update: they're also joining with IBM to pressure the W3C to allow patented tech in web standards (such as for web services), and possibly collect royalties now or after people are "hooked" (like Unisys did with the GIF format). CNet story
 
ElFenix

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,402
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MS can suck my left nut. they're getting to be worse than rambus.
 
B

Balt

Lifer
Mar 12, 2000
12,673
482
126
Originally posted by: ElFenix
MS can suck my left nut. they're getting to be worse than rambus.
Click to expand...

Funny, when I saw the thread topic "Rambus" was the first thing that came to mind for me as well. Stupid move by Microsoft, IMO, since this seems just a little monopolistic. But then, what do I know?

This is lame. :frown:
 
D

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
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The only thing needed for evil to prosper is for good men to do nothing
- Edmund Burke, (1729-1797).

(Which assumes that you consider the current DOJ to be "good men.")
 
A

Ameesh

Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
23,686
1
0
Originally posted by: geekender
That's as bad as them holding the patent to 1's and 0's.

The onion is a satire for those who don't know.
Click to expand...

"If this patent holds up in federal court, Apple will have no choice but to convert to analog," said Apple interim CEO Steve Jobs, "and I have serious doubts whether this company would be able to remain competitive selling pedal-operated computers running software off vinyl LPs."


hahahaha
 
M

manly

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
13,313
4,088
136
Originally posted by: Balt

Funny, when I saw the thread topic "Rambus" was the first thing that came to mind for me as well. Stupid move by Microsoft, IMO, since this seems just a little monopolistic. But then, what do I know?
Click to expand...
Anti-trust issues don't bother them one bit. They've already been given a free pass from the Bush Administration's DoJ by implementing a few meaningless concessions in a slap-on-the-wrist settlement. Unless the federal judge decides the settlement does not fit the offense (don't hold your breath), then they get off virtually scott-free from being found guilty of illegal abuse of their monopoly (by both a trial judge and a full district Appeals court).

Now I wouldn't be surprised if the ZDNet story as summarized above is true, but when this news was originally linked on Slashdot as minutes of the OpenGL ARB, it was not so sinister. MS claims to hold patents regarding one technology, and were seeking to provide a royalty-free cross-license. In other words, we'll let you use this, but you have to let us use what you developed. Unfortunately it's fairly unlikely they would extend the same licensing terms to GPL efforts (i.e. Mesa). The real problem is that the whole U.S. patent scheme is fatally flawed. It's questionable that software should be patentable, but even if it is, 17 years is a ridiculously long time and totally goes against why Congress created the patent system in the first place (to encourage innovation and commerce, not retard it).
 
The Stigenator

The Stigenator

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
15,216
3
81
Microsoft you may burn in hell.

Who in here wants to start another Open Source GL lib that's compatiable with OpenGL and then basically fsck microshaft.

You know what I am going to play MS tactics.. I am going to exactly what MS does, and if they question me I will just point to the leader.
Let Bill Gates and the rest of the microsoft crew take the blame.

Mr. Gates.. you ARE the DEVIL!
 
A

Ameesh

Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
23,686
1
0
Originally posted by: The_good_guy
Microsoft you may burn in hell.

Who in here wants to start another Open Source GL lib that's compatiable with OpenGL and then basically fsck microshaft.

You know what I am going to play MS tactics.. I am going to exactly what MS does, and if they question me I will just point to the leader.
Let Bill Gates and the rest of the microsoft crew take the blame.

Mr. Gates.. you ARE the DEVIL!
Click to expand...

LOL
 
D

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
MS claims to hold patents regarding one technology, and were seeking to provide a royalty-free cross-license. In other words, we'll let you use this, but you have to let us use what you developed.
Click to expand...
Which assumes you are a major corporation with something to trade them (which is still a cost, since MS gets to use your patent).

However:
"Microsoft said at July's meeting that it would offer "reasonable and nondiscriminatory" terms for the license, but the meaning of this was far from clear. "

In other words, license fees, which rules out freeware and open source. Yet another way to stamp out competition.
 
P

PG

Diamond Member
Oct 25, 1999
3,426
44
91
John Carmack has always been a big supporter of OpenGL.
I say it's about time for a winner take all deathmath: Carmack vs. Bill Gates. :D

 
M

manly

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
13,313
4,088
136
DaveSimmons,

I understand your point, and everybody knows I'm no fan of Mickeysoft, but if they truly hold patent(s) on that technology, then they are trying to cash in on it like any other corporation. The only shady part of that would be if any such patents were purchased from SGI, but even then you'd have to blame SGI as much as MS. Cash-strapped SGI could have sold its IP to any number of companies for probably the same price; apparently they chose to deal with the bottom feeders in the industry. =) The real problem is with the flawed patent regime, one that grants patents on technology that the Patent Office does not understand and often that is not innovative or novel.

I find it somewhat amusing that this thread and the recent WMP EULA update thread generated a lot of bad publicity for MS (at least within ATOT). For years now, as exposed in the anti-trust case, MS plays dirty and clearly at the edge of the law (if not past it) and many consumers seem to happily support them as a good corporate citizen. I think the recent flaps are more an aberration than a shift in perspective.
 
K

kazeakuma

Golden Member
Feb 13, 2001
1,218
0
0
Originally posted by: Balt
Originally posted by: ElFenix
MS can suck my left nut. they're getting to be worse than rambus.
Click to expand...

Funny, when I saw the thread topic "Rambus" was the first thing that came to mind for me as well. Stupid move by Microsoft, IMO, since this seems just a little monopolistic. But then, what do I know?

This is lame. :frown:
Click to expand...

Exactly what I thought of too. Which is why I will never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever be a MS supporter.

 
N

Nefrodite

Banned
Feb 15, 2001
7,931
0
0
Originally posted by: manly
DaveSimmons,

I understand your point, and everybody knows I'm no fan of Mickeysoft, but if they truly hold patent(s) on that technology, then they are trying to cash in on it like any other corporation. The only shady part of that would be if any such patents were purchased from SGI, but even then you'd have to blame SGI as much as MS. Cash-strapped SGI could have sold its IP to any number of companies for probably the same price; apparently they chose to deal with the bottom feeders in the industry. =) The real problem is with the flawed patent regime, one that grants patents on technology that the Patent Office does not understand and often that is not innovative or novel.

I find it somewhat amusing that this thread and the recent WMP EULA update thread generated a lot of bad publicity for MS (at least within ATOT). For years now, as exposed in the anti-trust case, MS plays dirty and clearly at the edge of the law (if not past it) and many consumers seem to happily support them as a good corporate citizen. I think the recent flaps are more an aberration than a shift in perspective.
Click to expand...


yup, sgi is da dumbshit. that or carmack and u open source or whatever dolts shoulda banded together and bought it. buncha slobs...

 
G

Goosemaster

Lifer
Apr 10, 2001
48,775
3
81
Originally posted by: geekender
That's as bad as them holding the patent to 1's and 0's.

The onion is a satire for those who don't know.
Click to expand...



Whoa!....I read the first part of the article without noticing it was "the Onion"....talk about relieved:Q












rolleye.gif
 
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