Mexico Leaders Call out For Legalization of MJ aka the POT

TechBoyJK

Lifer
Oct 17, 2002
16,699
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http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/...x.marijuana/index.html

(CNN) -- Former Mexican President Vicente Fox has joined three other ex-leaders of Latin American nations calling for the decriminalization of marijuana.

Fox, who was Mexico's president from 2000 to 2006, said the current policy is clearly not working.

"I believe it's time to open the debate over legalizing drugs," he told CNN on Tuesday. "It must be done in conjunction with the United States, but it is time to open the debate."

He pointed to how the end of Prohibition in the United States in 1933 lessened organized crime violence.

"It can't be that the only way is for the state to use force," he said.

Fox was mirroring a position adopted earlier this year by his predecessor as president of Mexico, Ernesto Zedillo, and the former heads of Colombia and Brazil. The three former chief executives are members of the Latin American Commission on Drugs and Democracy.

At a February meeting in Brazil, the commission called for the decriminalization of marijuana for personal use and a change in tactics in the war on drugs.

"The problem is that current policies are based on prejudices and fears and not on results," former Colombian President Cesar Gaviria said at a news conference in which the 17-member commission's recommendations were presented.

Former President Fernando Henrique Cardoso of Brazil said the group called for only the decriminalization of marijuana and not other illicit drugs because "you have to start somewhere."

Zedillo was president of Mexico from 1994 to 2000. Gaviria was president of Colombia from 1990 to 1994. And Cardoso led Brazil from 1995 to 2002.

Fox said any change in drug laws must be accompanied by an education campaign in schools and homes. And because the United States is a large consumer of marijuana that comes from Latin America, any steps toward legalization must be supported in Washington, he said.

Gaviria said in February that the time is right to start a debate on the subject, particularly with the pragmatic openings provided by the election of President Obama.

"In many states in the United States, as is the case in California, they have begun to change federal policies with regard to tolerating marijuana for therapeutic purposes. And in Washington there's some consensus that the current policy is failing," Gaviria said.

The call for a change in strategy comes amid a horrific explosion of drug-related violence in Mexico, where officials say 10,000 people have been killed since President Felipe Calderon took office in December 2006. Calderon said in a speech earlier this year that 6,500 of those deaths occurred in 2008.

Calderon, who succeeded Fox, ramped up the battle against the nation's narcotics traffickers and brought in the army to reinforce often ineffective local and state police.

That was a change in tactics from Fox, who said he had chosen to strengthen federal police and intelligence-gathering operations and to create a secretary for public security. But now that Calderon has chosen a different approach, he must prevail, Fox said in an exclusive interview with CNN.

"If you go to war, you have to win it quickly and according to regulations," he said. "Human rights are very important."

It also is important that the United States "accept its responsibility," he said. "I would like to see some steps taken here in the United States. We see the drugs are coming across the border and are distributed in Atlanta and Washington and Chicago and all parts of the country."

Fox's comparison of the current battle to Prohibition in the United States in the 1920s was recently touted by Robert Pastor, who was a Latin America national security adviser for President Carter in the late 1970s. He called the problem in Mexico "even worse than Chicago during the Prohibition era."

Pastor said a solution similar to what ended that violence is needed now.

"What worked in the U.S. was not Eliot Ness," he said, referring to the federal agent famous for fighting gangsters in the 1920s and 19'30s. "It was the repeal of Prohibition."

Others are not so sure.

"This has become a world of globalization," said Monte Alejandro Rubido Garcia, Mexico's executive secretary for the National System for Public Safety. "Globalization has many virtues but some errors. I can't conceive that one part of the world would decriminalize drugs because it would become a paradise for drug use. It might bring down violence, but there would be social damage."

NICE!

I think this is a good push. They are having serious violence issues, and I know it's hard for anybody who truly understand what marijuana is to see that its illegal in these days and times, especially when up against much harsher drugs like alcohol or cigarrettes. I know that legalizing MJ wouldn't stop all violence, but it would do severe damage to the drug trade since MJ is the largest part of the trade, and it would seperate casual pot smokers from those that will do harder drugs. It's pretty much obvious it's only a gateway drug because it's illegal, and you have to go to the guy who is also selling cocaine.
 

MikeMike

Lifer
Feb 6, 2000
45,885
66
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Originally posted by: OCguy
A. Wont happen

B. Who the hell would smoke Mexican schwag?

if that mexican schwag was not put under 500lb presses, handled to high hell and back, and then sold... it would not be so bad... you can grow some nice quality shit from mexican schwag, or so i hear...
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
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The reason it was made illegal in the first place was to discriminate against Mexicans in America as there are no serious consequences to having it legal.
 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
27,224
37
91
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The reason it was made illegal in the first place was to discriminate against Mexicans in America as there are no serious consequences to having it legal.

Why did Canada and most of the rest of the world outlaw it?
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.

To largely reduce the problems with drug crimes, you could just legalize marijuana.

The organized crime analogy to prohibition is fitting. Sucks billions from their pockets.
 

TechBoyJK

Lifer
Oct 17, 2002
16,699
60
91
Originally posted by: OCguy
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The reason it was made illegal in the first place was to discriminate against Mexicans in America as there are no serious consequences to having it legal.

Why did Canada and most of the rest of the world outlaw it?

fear and ignorance
 

TechBoyJK

Lifer
Oct 17, 2002
16,699
60
91
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.

To largely reduce the problems with drug crimes, you could just legalize marijuana.

The organized crime analogy to prohibition is fitting. Sucks billions from their pockets.

The idea of having to legalize everything is BS. Meth, Coke, LSD (harmless imho), are in a totally different class. Pot is just pot. No big deal. Alcohol and cigarrettes should be illegal before weed.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: OCguy
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The reason it was made illegal in the first place was to discriminate against Mexicans in America as there are no serious consequences to having it legal.

Why did Canada and most of the rest of the world outlaw it?
Victorian Principals
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: OCguy
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The reason it was made illegal in the first place was to discriminate against Mexicans in America as there are no serious consequences to having it legal.

Why did Canada and most of the rest of the world outlaw it?

Regarding Canada, it's a mystery.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: alchemize
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: OCguy
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The reason it was made illegal in the first place was to discriminate against Mexicans in America as there are no serious consequences to having it legal.

Why did Canada and most of the rest of the world outlaw it?
Victorian Principals
Oh yah!
LOL..err Principles

 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: TechBoyJK
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.

To largely reduce the problems with drug crimes, you could just legalize marijuana.

The organized crime analogy to prohibition is fitting. Sucks billions from their pockets.

The idea of having to legalize everything is BS. Meth, Coke, LSD (harmless imho), are in a totally different class. Pot is just pot. No big deal. Alcohol and cigarrettes should be illegal before weed.

I'm interested in criminalizing tobacco - including the distribution to other nations.

I don't think the demand would be the same, necessarily, as for recreational drugs - the real issue with tobacco is the nicotine addiction.

The key may be to prevent new addicts while having a plan for existing addicts.

Alcohol does not seem to warrant prohibition to me. I would outlaw marijuana before alcohol - but suspect neither should be outlawed.
 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
27,224
37
91
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.

What would someone who is addicted to Meth do when he ran out and no longer could afford it, even if it is legal?



Oh yea, STEAL.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
We can't even grow the low THC content hemp for industrial use, and that would provide jobs and help the economy as well as the environment. They are never going to pass the kind preferred for smoking just because people want to get high. If money will not do it, then nothing can.
 

frostedflakes

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2005
7,925
1
81
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.
My understanding is that marijuana is the main cash cow for the cartels. It may not eliminate the drug smuggling problem, but legalization would likely deal a significant blow to the cartels.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
Originally posted by: frostedflakes
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.
My understanding is that marijuana is the main cash cow for the cartels. It may not eliminate the drug smuggling problem, but legalization would likely deal a significant blow to the cartels.

Yeah Mexico supplies marijuana while Columbia supplies cocaine. The USA provides methamphetamine in return. Nice little foreign trade agreement they got going .
 

ebaycj

Diamond Member
Mar 9, 2002
5,418
0
0
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.

No.

Most "drug" users do not do cocaine, heroin, meth, etc... Most "drug" users only smoke pot. If you were told differently, you were lied to.

I would estimate that something on the order of 85% of drug crime in the USA is marijuana related (and ONLY marijuana related, no other "drugs" involved). Hell, let's reduce it to 50% just so nobody bitches about my estimate being too high/low/whatever.

You're telling me that:
Reducing drug crime by 50% is not a positive thing?
Saving imprisonment costs (approx $50k per year per inmate) on 50% of drug-related prisoners is not a positive thing?
Taxing the living hell out of it ($20 tax on a $5 pack of 20 marijuana cigarettes) and then using that money for something useful (UHC comes to mind) is not a positive thing?

Give me a break.
 

ebaycj

Diamond Member
Mar 9, 2002
5,418
0
0
Originally posted by: Modelworks
We can't even grow the low THC content hemp for industrial use, and that would provide jobs and help the economy as well as the environment. They are never going to pass the kind preferred for smoking just because people want to get high. If money will not do it, then nothing can.

Why not? In a Democracy (or Democratic Republic, in our case), is it not the fundamental role of government to serve the will of it's citizens (as a whole)?

 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,002
115
106
It is about time, but I expect that this time it will fall flat on its face due to US pressure... :(
 

InflatableBuddha

Diamond Member
Jul 5, 2007
7,416
1
0
Originally posted by: ebaycj
Originally posted by: cubby1223
To fix the problems with drug crimes, you'd have to along with pot, legalize cocaine, heroine, meth, etc. and that just ain't gonna happen.

No.

Most "drug" users do not do cocaine, heroin, meth, etc... Most "drug" users only smoke pot. If you were told differently, you were lied to.

I would estimate that something on the order of 85% of drug crime in the USA is marijuana related (and ONLY marijuana related, no other "drugs" involved). Hell, let's reduce it to 50% just so nobody bitches about my estimate being too high/low/whatever.

You're telling me that:
Reducing drug crime by 50% is not a positive thing?
Saving imprisonment costs (approx $50k per year per inmate) on 50% of drug-related prisoners is not a positive thing?
Taxing the living hell out of it ($20 tax on a $5 pack of 20 marijuana cigarettes) and then using that money for something useful (UHC comes to mind) is not a positive thing?

Give me a break.

I think he means that if MJ is legalized but other drugs are still illegal, dealers and traffickers will simply push those other drugs more to compensate (and probably branch into other avenues like prostitution/human trafficking, extortion, etc.)

I agree, the "gateway theory" is propaganda. The rest of your post is spot on. :thumbsup:
 

Fear No Evil

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2008
5,922
0
0
I'd favor the legalization of pot if Obama resigns and appoints a Republican to replace him. That sounds like a fair trade to me. You all can be so high you won't be able to complain about the Republican, and us Republicans will be happy because we can push our agenda through.