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Mexico interfering in our business again

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Mexico asserts that U.S. authorities have violated the Vienna Convention by not informing its citizens that they have the right to contact their consulate when arrested in the United States.

These convicts' lawyers (court-appointed or otherwise) should have told them about this alleged right, and should have informed the Mexican consulate anyway.

When you enter a foreign country, you subject yourself to their laws. Don't like it? Don't go. It's a tough world out there. Nobody forced these A-holes to come here and kill someone.


 
How exactly is this different from this case? Why can USA whine about rulings made in other countries, but no-one must question the rulings made in USA?
 
Originally posted by: SlowSS
Anybody remember the movie "Midnight Express"?

The movie was based on William Hayes's autobiography of
incredibly harrowing story of a young American tourist arrested and
sentenced to 30 years in prison by Turkish authorities for
trying to smuggle two kilos of hashish out of the country.

Now granted what he did was illegal and he deserved certain
amount of prison time, but the physical and emotional brutalities
beyond anyone could take.

As for mexico, they have many internal social problems
themselves, especially with government/law enforment corruption.
They need to clean up their own house before critizing other countries
legal system.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, definately deserved some prison time. That hasish man, it's nasty stuff.
rolleye.gif


:frown:

Anyway, on topic.. lol... He killed someone. He was tried, and conviced. He was put to death. Any questions? Shouldn't be....
 
I personally think this is a VERY big deal. Mexico should STEP DOWN.
 
Originally posted by: tk149
Mexico asserts that U.S. authorities have violated the Vienna Convention by not informing its citizens that they have the right to contact their consulate when arrested in the United States.

These convicts' lawyers (court-appointed or otherwise) should have told them about this alleged right, and should have informed the Mexican consulate anyway.

When you enter a foreign country, you subject yourself to their laws. Don't like it? Don't go. It's a tough world out there. Nobody forced these A-holes to come here and kill someone.
Click to expand...

It is common knowledge that the US denies foreigners their legal rights. Our government has been trying to convince the US to respect the rights of foreigners and follow the agreements they have signed for years - so far nothing changed, some germans where still executed even though those rights where denied to them...
 
Originally posted by: da loser
remember when that guy spray painted the cars in singapore? we didn't save his ass.
Click to expand...

read the link I posted. You did whine alot and demanded that the sentence must be changed. And it was: whipping was dropped from 6 to 4 because of US whining. But now that Mexico does the same thing to US, it's a big no-no
rolleye.gif
?
 
The complain was more about the cases where someone was locked up without trial, not given legal aid, and no Mexican official was warned. If you think that is still a right of the US, the US shouldn't be interfering in Iraqi and North-Korean matters. No matter what reason you lock them up for, they still have rights according to the US and international laws.
 
Originally posted by: luvly
"Maybe if they don't want their citizens exposed to the death penalty, they should try to keep these scumbags at home."

Oh Lord! The way you guys talk at this forum. I keep praying the real world never becomes that way. No matter your opinion about the death penalty, making statements like this is beyond disdainful. Do you ever wonder how decisions affect Americans overseas accused of crimes and what process they get there? I would hope for due process anywhere. And in spite of how much we each perceive our countries of origin as having the best justice system, someone else from elsewhere may feel more secure being tried at his or her home country.

My whole point is not an objection to the death penalty or to the guilt of the accused. My source of contention is the process of justice. I think they too should be well represented as afforded by the US law and international law. Only after this should the government proceed to enforce the given penalty.
Click to expand...

Excuse me? What world are you living in? A mexican on trial in the united states is afforded much better representation than an american on trial in mexico. I don't think you realise some of the concessions made on their behalf in our courts, concessions that would never be made in a mexican court on an american's behalf. Beyond disdainful? You need to get a clue.

And in spite of how much we each perceive our countries of origin as having the best justice system, someone else from elsewhere may feel more secure being tried at his or her home country.
Click to expand...

I'm sure they would. So let's send them back to be mexico to be tried. I'm sure with the level of corruption in the mexican legal system they would get a really fair trial.

You really need to wake up.
 
Originally posted by: Rio Rebel
Only in America can we laugh at other countries as being corrupt, backwards, and ignorant and ignore things like rampant shootings in our schools.

The ignorance is remarkable.

I guess it makes us feel better to watch Midnight Express and try to forget about the Trenchcoat Mafia.
Click to expand...

From the fine folks over at Rotten dot com: trenchcoat.org
 
Originally posted by: B00ne
Originally posted by: tk149
Mexico asserts that U.S. authorities have violated the Vienna Convention by not informing its citizens that they have the right to contact their consulate when arrested in the United States.

These convicts' lawyers (court-appointed or otherwise) should have told them about this alleged right, and should have informed the Mexican consulate anyway.

When you enter a foreign country, you subject yourself to their laws. Don't like it? Don't go. It's a tough world out there. Nobody forced these A-holes to come here and kill someone.
Click to expand...

It is common knowledge that the US denies foreigners their legal rights. Our government has been trying to convince the US to respect the rights of foreigners and follow the agreements they have signed for years - so far nothing changed, some germans where still executed even though those rights where denied to them...
Click to expand...

Lets say someone (person A) enters the USA from country X, and intentionally kills someone. Although there are obviously wide variances between countries in how crimes are defined and punished, you cant tell me person A, unless possessing an intellect so slow as to be legally considered retarded, thinks that in the USA killing someone is a legal act. They know what they are doing will, if they get caught, result in a long prison sentence at the minimum. Now, maybe they dont know that they will be imprisoned for life, or executed, but they still know they are breaking the law and that there are going to be serious legal consequences. Its not like getting a speeding ticket in a school zone. If I went to Germany and killed a policeman there, I would expect a minimum of life in prison. A German prison. After being sentenced by a German court. It'd be nice to have the American consulate informed of my case, but, it doesnt change the basic facts nor the consequences.

I am in favor of informing a foreigner's consulate if they are arrested. I do not believe that they should be exempt from the death penalty because their homeland doesnt allow it. If you dont want to be sentenced to death for murder, do it in a country that doesnt allow for it. If I commit a crime in Oregon, I am not going to be tried in my home state of Ohio, but rather I will be tried in Oregon. If I had committed a crime while on vacation in Ireland last summer, I would expect to be tried there (although, that might be a bad example, I hold dual citizen-ship 🙂 ).
 
Originally posted by: Nemesis77
Originally posted by: da loser
remember when that guy spray painted the cars in singapore? we didn't save his ass.
Click to expand...

read the link I posted. You did whine alot and demanded that the sentence must be changed. And it was: whipping was dropped from 6 to 4 because of US whining. But now that Mexico does the same thing to US, it's a big no-no
rolleye.gif
?
Click to expand...

Should have caned the brat ten lashes for whining and being a biyatch. The crappy actor who had 2 pounds of hashish and got popped in another country should be wasting away in their jail cells or beheaded...whatever the country law is.

You can not feign ignorance for doing something you know is illegal and you know the penalty for it.
 
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: SlowSS
Anybody remember the movie "Midnight Express"?

The movie was based on William Hayes's autobiography of
incredibly harrowing story of a young American tourist arrested and
sentenced to 30 years in prison by Turkish authorities for
trying to smuggle two kilos of hashish out of the country.

Now granted what he did was illegal and he deserved certain
amount of prison time, but the physical and emotional brutalities
beyond anyone could take.

As for mexico, they have many internal social problems
themselves, especially with government/law enforment corruption.
They need to clean up their own house before critizing other countries
legal system.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, definately deserved some prison time. That hasish man, it's nasty stuff.
rolleye.gif


:frown:
Click to expand...

He did break Turkish law regardless of how we feel about hashish.

 
Our legal system is a mess, period. Get rid of the lawyers arguing the meaning of "alone" (see: clinton) and we will be a lot better. Are you kidding with the "define alone" thing?? WTF!?!?!

How this is even tolerated is beyond me, alone is ALONE. That is how our legal system works, you can argue anything, even words. Pretty darn sad, if you kill somebody you should not be let go because the police didn't say "Please, may I arrest you".

Our constitution is a guideline, not a textbook to be picked apart. Sorry if you are a lawyer....really sorry.
 
Originally posted by: Mookow
Originally posted by: B00ne
Originally posted by: tk149
Mexico asserts that U.S. authorities have violated the Vienna Convention by not informing its citizens that they have the right to contact their consulate when arrested in the United States.

These convicts' lawyers (court-appointed or otherwise) should have told them about this alleged right, and should have informed the Mexican consulate anyway.

When you enter a foreign country, you subject yourself to their laws. Don't like it? Don't go. It's a tough world out there. Nobody forced these A-holes to come here and kill someone.
Click to expand...

It is common knowledge that the US denies foreigners their legal rights. Our government has been trying to convince the US to respect the rights of foreigners and follow the agreements they have signed for years - so far nothing changed, some germans where still executed even though those rights where denied to them...
Click to expand...

Lets say someone (person A) enters the USA from country X, and intentionally kills someone. Although there are obviously wide variances between countries in how crimes are defined and punished, you cant tell me person A, unless possessing an intellect so slow as to be legally considered retarded, thinks that in the USA killing someone is a legal act. They know what they are doing will, if they get caught, result in a long prison sentence at the minimum. Now, maybe they dont know that they will be imprisoned for life, or executed, but they still know they are breaking the law and that there are going to be serious legal consequences. Its not like getting a speeding ticket in a school zone. If I went to Germany and killed a policeman there, I would expect a minimum of life in prison. A German prison. After being sentenced by a German court. It'd be nice to have the American consulate informed of my case, but, it doesnt change the basic facts nor the consequences.

I am in favor of informing a foreigner's consulate if they are arrested. I do not believe that they should be exempt from the death penalty because their homeland doesnt allow it. If you dont want to be sentenced to death for murder, do it in a country that doesnt allow for it. If I commit a crime in Oregon, I am not going to be tried in my home state of Ohio, but rather I will be tried in Oregon. If I had committed a crime while on vacation in Ireland last summer, I would expect to be tried there (although, that might be a bad example, I hold dual citizen-ship 🙂 ).
Click to expand...

that was not my point, to exempt them from death penalty, but as far as I know, a trial has to be conducted properly, now when foreigners do not get their rights (like the embassy contact) it seems to me that such a person did not get a fair trial. And putting someone to death after not even getting a fair trial seems like a premature decision. And we all heard about the average quality of state appointed lawyers with all its implications....

So basically what I am saying is there is no reason to bash on Mexico for demanding the exercise of agreed upon rights when their citizen are having legal problems in the US (whatever the offense)

basically just like US vs. blabla that had the outcome that suspects have to be informed about their rights

 
rampant shootings in our schools.
Click to expand...

Where are these so called rampant shootings? Oh thats right it was media hype for ratings. Dead children = good ratings for cable news. In all actuallity, school violence, was down, and has been down throughout the '90s. The media just didnt cover this stuff before the mid '90s when they realised the could make money off of human tragedy.
 
Originally posted by: Skyclad1uhm1
The complain was more about the cases where someone was locked up without trial, not given legal aid, and no Mexican official was warned. If you think that is still a right of the US, the US shouldn't be interfering in Iraqi and North-Korean matters. No matter what reason you lock them up for, they still have rights according to the US and international laws.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
Originally posted by: Rio Rebel
Only in America can we laugh at other countries as being corrupt, backwards, and ignorant and ignore things like rampant shootings in our schools.

The ignorance is remarkable.

I guess it makes us feel better to watch Midnight Express and try to forget about the Trenchcoat Mafia.
Click to expand...

Good point.
 
Originally posted by: Zakath15
Originally posted by: Skyclad1uhm1
The complain was more about the cases where someone was locked up without trial, not given legal aid, and no Mexican official was warned. If you think that is still a right of the US, the US shouldn't be interfering in Iraqi and North-Korean matters. No matter what reason you lock them up for, they still have rights according to the US and international laws.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
Click to expand...

Please post a reputable link stating that the convicts were not given a fair trial, and were not given legal aid. The original Yahoo link makes no such assertion.
 
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