Mayor Palin Left Town Saddled With Huge Debt

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pstylesss

Platinum Member
Mar 21, 2007
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Originally posted by: cliftonite
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
Waiting for a denial here davepeyton
Thanks for the bump!

Got to keep this near the top.
Dave, just go ahead & admit it, there are too many similarities...
I believe mod call outs are against the rules? Hes not the one that had to be reinstated from a ban now is he?
edit: nvm, didn't see Fern used the rod of correction.
 

jpeyton

Moderator in SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones
Moderator
Aug 23, 2003
25,375
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When the smoke cleared after Gov. Sarah Palin's big cuts to the capital budget in June, one survivor that stood out was a $630,000 appropriation to the Wasilla Sports Complex.

Palin cut funds for 40 sports-related projects around Alaska, saying sports was not an essential government service. Gone was money for baseball and soccer fields, turf improvements for Dimond and Service high schools, roof repairs to the Sullivan Arena and planning for a long-sought University of Alaska Anchorage sports arena.

So why was there still money for a kitchen for the Wasilla Sports Complex -- not to mention funds for several other Mat-Su sports projects, including new lights at the Houston High School field and new bleachers at Palmer High?


Critics were quick to recall the former Wasilla mayor's campaign pledge to the Wasilla Chamber of Commerce last year that she would be "biased toward the Valley" as governor.

The comment was brushed off at the time as a lighthearted defense of her hometown. But it was recalled again this summer when Palin overhauled the state's agricultural bureaucracy in an attempt to save the state-owned Matanuska Maid, the only market for a handful of Mat-Su area dairy farmers.

Coupled with Palin's decision to leave the Juneau governor's residence once the Legislature adjourned -- wags dubbed her lakeside Wasilla home "the summer palace" -- and enroll her kids in Valley schools this fall, the former Miss Wasilla's actions have some critics asking whether her down-home style includes a sentimental streak capable of clouding her judgment.

To be sure, the complaints -- heard on talk radio and in letters columns -- have amounted more to a light drizzle than a deluge.

"I don't think there's any way you can get around the cronyism and favoritism," says Andrew Halcro, a former independent candidate for governor who has been harsher than most. "It begs the question about other issues down the road."

In an interview Friday, Palin denied showing any bias toward the Mat-Su area.

When her cuts to the capital budget were complete, she said, Mat-Su got 8.5 percent of the spending, while Anchorage got 22.8 percent. Those are proper proportions, she said. She added that the cuts -- more than $230 million in all -- were based on statewide criteria, not election districts.

"If the criticism is that I cheer for my hometown team too often, I'm going to be cheering for my kids' teams," Palin said Friday. "The numbers speak for themselves in the budget. People can take me at my word or not, that I am not biased towards or against any region in Alaska."

HIGH-PRIORITY ITEMS

As to the specific Mat-Su sports projects, Palin said local legislators and municipal governments had made them high-priority items. The sports items cut elsewhere did not rank so high on local lists, she said.

The Wasilla arena, in particular, was primarily a safety issue, she said, because the new kitchen would make the facility usable as an emergency shelter. The old Palmer bleachers were also a safety concern, she added.

Local officials defended the $630,000 for Wasilla's big hockey and indoor-turf arena. While schools often serve as emergency shelters in other parts of the state, said arena manager Bruce Urban, where would people go if a major earthquake or forest fire occurred in Wasilla while schools were in session?

But city officials conceded the new kitchen will also allow them to attract conventions and other business to help reduce operating subsidies to the sports arena.

That was, in fact, part of the plan when voters first approved the complex in 2002, after a sales-tax-increase campaign that was pushed vigorously by Wasilla's mayor at the time, Sarah Palin.

Despite the ongoing subsidies, the $15 million sports arena has been popular in the area and a feather in the cap locally for Palin, who broke with her usual anti-tax stance to get the facility approved.

But the project comes with an embarrassing legal legacy, for which the bill is only now coming due. Efforts to obtain the land where the complex was eventually built began under Palin, who served as chief administrator under Wasilla's form of government. Those efforts resulted in a long losing court battle and a controversial decision to condemn the land for recreational purposes.

Two months ago, Wasilla was told it would have to pay more than $1.7 million, including interest and legal fees, to clear the title. That compares to $146,000 that the city thought it would spend when it set out under Palin to buy the land in 1998.

Meanwhile, the state has been helping Wasilla turn the sports arena into more of a "multi-use" facility. The latest capital budget item brings to $1.5 million the total state aid for expansion since the facility was finished. Palin defended the expense -- but said she wants to reduce such state spending next year and increase municipal aid, so that local governments decide such priorities for themselves.

"They make the decision on whether they're going to get Astroturf on their field or whether their museum is going to be expanded," she said "I don't think it should be the state administration's prerogative to be picking and choosing which projects get funded."

MATANUSKA MAID

Agriculture issues in Palin's first year as governor have focused on the Mat-Su region. She said it was natural to look to the state's main agricultural area for expertise.

When a state panel announced plans to shut down money-losing Matanuska Maid, Palin responded to an outcry from Valley dairy farmers and fired the state Board of Agriculture and Conservation, which oversees the panel. The seven new members she appointed were all from the Mat-Su area. That group has now been charged with finding an exit strategy for the state.

In August, Palin appointed another Mat-Su resident, Franci Havemeister, as the state director of agriculture. A former real estate agent, Havemeister did not have a professional background like some applicants for the post, but she was the daughter-in-law of Bob Havemeister, one of the four surviving Mat-Su dairy farmers. She had organized a pro-Matanuska Maid demonstration in June where protestors waved "Save the Cows" signs.

Palin said Havemeister was energetic, nonpolitical and sensitive to the need to revitalize agriculture. Several previous directors were Mat-Su farmers themselves, she said. Palin praised the unpaid and selfless work of her agricultural board, particularly chairwoman Kristan Cole, another Valley real estate agent. She said the board was working to find a way to get the state-owned dairy into private hands by the end of the year.

"They're doing all this for the right reasons. It's not doing favors for anybody in the Mat-Su Valley," Palin said.
Cronyism? Funding her bankrupt hometown sports arena while cutting sports funding everywhere else in the state?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
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Originally posted by: jpeyton
"More of the same."
Should be edited for accuracy to "More of the same by JPeyton"

I know Democrats were chanting that slogan alongside McCain's name last week, but it seems Palin fits right in as well. This "fiscal conservative" left her former small town of Wasilla with $20 million in debt to fund her hockey-mom pet project: an ice arena. Scarier still is that she used eminent domain to grab the land for the project from a private contractor, and the city later lost their eminent domain case in court.
Is she benefiting from this personally?

If not, sounds like a pretty run-of-the-mill civic project to me. I suppose things must be far different in whatever place you live. Here, where I live we have city/county projects such as parks with tennis courts, soccor and baseball fields etc for the local residents. These are capital projects, not *one year* expenditures, thus we carry debt for their financing.

Moreover, a little googling would have revealed to you that the voters approved of it, and many seem quite happy to have it. Link

Oh, this info from an AK newspapers reveals that the "ice arena" you refer will help in returning the start of the Iditarod back to Wasilla, a big revenue source for them with about 17K people attending etc. LINK


Vetoing wind farms and clean coal? Tsk tsk.
"Wind Farms" in AK?

I need a link before commenting. From what I've seen on TV, many of the small (and aren't they all small) towns use very small gas powered generators for electrical power. Nor, from I've seen, does AK have much in the way of electrical transnmission lines. I really need a link to see what you're talking about.


We all know she's got a major ethics investigation underway because she abused her power to push her safety commissioner out of office.
We'll see what the details are, and what the outcome is, but labeling this as a MAJOR ethics investigation is clearly partisan over-hype.

The disputed firing (and which ones aren't?) of ONE individual now counts as "MAJOR". I suppose you believe it is up there with Watergate/Plame/Iran-Contra/White Water etc.?

I see the article you link cites that a whole $100K is devoted to this so-called major investigation. I thought the others took many millions. no?


What people didn't know is that she's done it before, firing Wasilla's police chief and library director when she was mayor because they didn't support her re-election.
Now, I really am curious where you live. This is completely normal and I see it done all the time. Where I live, if the Asst. Sheriff runs against his boss for the job he knows he won't have a job if he loses. The Police Chief usually serves at the pleasure of the Mayor, oppose him/her for re-election and, yeah, if they win re-election you're looking for another job. Afterall, the citizens obviously VOTED on it and found the Police Chief's objections unfounded. I won't mention the seemingly improper intrusion into politics by the PC. (S)He wants to play in politics and then gets burned? That's how it works here in the USA.

Even on simple things like "Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance, Palin proves herself to be an airhead:

Q: Are you offended by the phrase ?Under God? in the Pledge of Allegiance? Why or why not?

SP: Not on your life. If it was good enough for the founding fathers, its good enough for me and I?ll fight in defense of our Pledge of Allegiance.
Unfortunately Sarah, the founding fathers died almost two generations before Francis Bellamy wrote the Pledge in 1892, and "Under God" wasn't introduced until 1954. It's a grade school level response that illustrates her lack of knowledge of basic facts about our own country's history, but I think it just scratches the surface of how ignorant she is.
Well, I guess you won't be voting for Obama either due to his "57 states" comment?

Otherwise, I'm not sure what this discussion about the Pledge of Allegiance has to do with presidential elections?

Let's see what Obama would say about. I bet he will say he is NOT for removing the "under God" part? I suppose you would then be unable to support him either, amirite?


Corruption? She was heavily endorsed by Ted Stevens and Don Young, and she did support the bridge to nowhere before it became a political liability. But her corruption extends beyond that, blocking environmental protections for polar bears and salmon because it would endanger drilling and mining operations.
So because she is endorsed by another AK state politician accused of corruption, she is also guilty of it? And this inspite of her factual record of going against corruption, even within her own party? I'd advise you not to *play* in any Obama/Rezko threads, or any Obama/Ayers threads.

The polar bear population is increasing, not decreasing. All info indicates putting polar bears on an endangered list was politically motivated, and highly unpopular in AK.


We still haven't seen where the ticket stands on drilling in ANWR, since McCain opposes it but Palin supports it.
Hopefully, she'll get McCain to change his mind and support drilling there. As we've learned form such drilling sites, the caribou etc will thank us.

One nice thing about a delayed/shortened convention is less praise/celebration of Palin's coronation while the press gets more time to vet her.
Speaking of "time to vet her", IMO you'd be better served to wait a little bit and see what she's like etc instead of scrambling to prematurely spout such partisan silliness as you've done here.
See bolded

Fern
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
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Originally posted by: jpeyton
When the smoke cleared after Gov. Sarah Palin's big cuts to the capital budget in June, one survivor that stood out was a $630,000 appropriation to the Wasilla Sports Complex.
-snip-
Cronyism? Funding her bankrupt hometown sports arena while cutting sports funding everywhere else in the state?
All of that ink spilt over $630K? Hahaha. Is this just arguing over one freaking kitchen in one building? Jeebus!

And no, not every community all over AK gets everything it asks for. The usual game in submitting requests during a gov budget process is pad the request and make as many as possible.

If anybody wants to show some irregularites, they need to come up with something far less silly. How about how the funds were doled out percentage-wise based on different areas. And there should be a pattern without reasonable explaination etc to support such claims.

This clearly looks like a great example of throwing everything (including the kitchen sink, no pun intended( against the wall and seeing what sticks.

Seriously, why don't you guys keep your powder dry until you know what you've got against her? If you keep this up and later find something real nobody is pay you any attention after all these lame efforts.

Fern
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
Originally posted by: TechAZ
That's what the environmentalists portrayed, mountains, trees, polar bears. It's tundra, not some vacation or wildlife watching area.
I think this statement is so close to the truth of how the republicans view the land. Thank you for posting it. I love it when republicans offer arguments that have nothing to do with why we do what we do, sublime. Why do wilderness lands have to be places for us to vacation or watch the wildlife? Can't wilderness lands be just that? Wilderness with no human contact?
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,069
499
126
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
Small towns have bonds for projects like the ice hockey arena or roads... projects that need to be done for the community and such that they can't afford but will pay for itself over time.

Most people, and probably you, did not know about the "under God" quote on the money and who was responsible for it until you read that in one of your left wing blogs. You're really digging with that one. I love your partial news clip.

Attacking her for wanting to open ANWR will not be a good political move for you guys, about 50% of the country is for it. Also, I don't think it's going to be healthy to attack McCain for not picking someone that agrees with him 100% on every issue, considering how many issue Obama and Biden clash on.

jpeyton - shutup, you're annoying as hell.
Opening ANWR would be the dumbest thing we could do. There isn't enough oil there to make a substantial difference in our prices and we'd be destroying another American national treasure. I'm no tree-hugger, but I also recognize that we're slowing destroying some of the most beautiful parts of this country and ANWR would be a crime against future generations of Americans.
Let me guess. You think erecting thousands of windmills to produce a small % of our power, consuming tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of acres is ok. But drilling on 2000 acres out of nealry 3 million is terrible.

We didnt drill in ANWR in 1995 thanks to that progressive forward thinking mind Bill Clinton. If we had, there would be 1.5 million barrels more a day to work with in the market. But lets close up and see how much more dependent on foreign oil we can become. It has done wonders for us so far. Two wars in under 15 years.
 

pstylesss

Platinum Member
Mar 21, 2007
2,914
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Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: TechAZ
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
Small towns have bonds for projects like the ice hockey arena or roads... projects that need to be done for the community and such that they can't afford but will pay for itself over time.

Most people, and probably you, did not know about the "under God" quote on the money and who was responsible for it until you read that in one of your left wing blogs. You're really digging with that one. I love your partial news clip.

Attacking her for wanting to open ANWR will not be a good political move for you guys, about 50% of the country is for it. Also, I don't think it's going to be healthy to attack McCain for not picking someone that agrees with him 100% on every issue, considering how many issue Obama and Biden clash on.

jpeyton - shutup, you're annoying as hell.
Opening ANWR would be the dumbest thing we could do. There isn't enough oil there to make a substantial difference in our prices and we'd be destroying another American national treasure. I'm no tree-hugger, but I also recognize that we're slowing destroying some of the most beautiful parts of this country and ANWR would be a crime against future generations of Americans.
:confused:

http://www.anwr.org/flash.htm

And who says there isn't enough oil there to make a difference? Democrats? Environmental Lobbyists? A handful of "experts"?
Estimates peg it at less than 1.5 % of consumption in 2030, when it would come online. That wouldn't impact prices much and, like I said, I'd rather leave ANWR untouched and pay 15 cents more per gallon of gas.
That wasn't my point at all. Palin is an alaskan and is open to drilling in ANWR. Attacking that position is not smart considering at least half of America wants it open. The Dems should either ignore it or pander. Ignoring it would be smarter without pandering and looking unethical.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,830
2
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: BeauJangles
Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
Small towns have bonds for projects like the ice hockey arena or roads... projects that need to be done for the community and such that they can't afford but will pay for itself over time.

Most people, and probably you, did not know about the "under God" quote on the money and who was responsible for it until you read that in one of your left wing blogs. You're really digging with that one. I love your partial news clip.

Attacking her for wanting to open ANWR will not be a good political move for you guys, about 50% of the country is for it. Also, I don't think it's going to be healthy to attack McCain for not picking someone that agrees with him 100% on every issue, considering how many issue Obama and Biden clash on.

jpeyton - shutup, you're annoying as hell.
Opening ANWR would be the dumbest thing we could do. There isn't enough oil there to make a substantial difference in our prices and we'd be destroying another American national treasure. I'm no tree-hugger, but I also recognize that we're slowing destroying some of the most beautiful parts of this country and ANWR would be a crime against future generations of Americans.
Let me guess. You think erecting thousands of windmills to produce a small % of our power, consuming tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of acres is ok. But drilling on 2000 acres out of nealry 3 million is terrible.

We didnt drill in ANWR in 1995 thanks to that progressive forward thinking mind Bill Clinton. If we had, there would be 1.5 million barrels more a day to work with in the market. But lets close up and see how much more dependent on foreign oil we can become. It has done wonders for us so far. Two wars in under 15 years.
Windmills have a small footprint.. You can put them in agriculture fields
 

misle

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2000
3,371
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Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Windmills have a small footprint.. You can put them in agriculture fields
What about all the transmission lines to transport the energy? That's not a very small footprint, nor is it cheap and easy.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Administrator
Mar 5, 2001
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www.slatebrookfarm.com
Originally posted by: misle
Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Windmills have a small footprint.. You can put them in agriculture fields
What about all the transmission lines to transport the energy? That's not a very small footprint, nor is it cheap and easy.
I love taking rides about 25 miles north of my house to see the windmills. Including the transmission lines, they have a very small footprint.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Administrator
Mar 5, 2001
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www.slatebrookfarm.com
Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
Small towns have bonds for projects like the ice hockey arena or roads... projects that need to be done for the community and such that they can't afford but will pay for itself over time.

Most people, and probably you, did not know about the "under God" quote on the money and who was responsible for it until you read that in one of your left wing blogs. You're really digging with that one. I love your partial news clip.

Attacking her for wanting to open ANWR will not be a good political move for you guys, about 50% of the country is for it. Also, I don't think it's going to be healthy to attack McCain for not picking someone that agrees with him 100% on every issue, considering how many issue Obama and Biden clash on.

jpeyton - shutup, you're annoying as hell.
Usually small towns with 6000 residents aren't happy for long when they start to realize that their project is costing them $150,000 per year (in addition to bond payments). Sure, big projects like that are great for towns, but be realistic - $20 million for an ice skating rink for a town of 6000 people? Can you name any other towns that throw around money like that?
 

cliftonite

Diamond Member
Jul 15, 2001
6,884
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Originally posted by: Fern
Originally posted by: jpeyton
"More of the same."
Should be edited for accuracy to "More of the same by JPeyton"

I know Democrats were chanting that slogan alongside McCain's name last week, but it seems Palin fits right in as well. This "fiscal conservative" left her former small town of Wasilla with $20 million in debt to fund her hockey-mom pet project: an ice arena. Scarier still is that she used eminent domain to grab the land for the project from a private contractor, and the city later lost their eminent domain case in court.
Is she benefiting from this personally?

If not, sounds like a pretty run-of-the-mill civic project to me. I suppose things must be far different in whatever place you live. Here, where I live we have city/county projects such as parks with tennis courts, soccor and baseball fields etc for the local residents. These are capital projects, not *one year* expenditures, thus we carry debt for their financing.

Moreover, a little googling would have revealed to you that the voters approved of it, and many seem quite happy to have it. Link

Oh, this info from an AK newspapers reveals that the "ice arena" you refer will help in returning the start of the Iditarod back to Wasilla, a big revenue source for them with about 17K people attending etc. LINK


Vetoing wind farms and clean coal? Tsk tsk.
"Wind Farms" in AK?

I need a link before commenting. From what I've seen on TV, many of the small (and aren't they all small) towns use very small gas powered generators for electrical power. Nor, from I've seen, does AK have much in the way of electrical transnmission lines. I really need a link to see what you're talking about.


We all know she's got a major ethics investigation underway because she abused her power to push her safety commissioner out of office.
We'll see what the details are, and what the outcome is, but labeling this as a MAJOR ethics investigation is clearly partisan over-hype.

The disputed firing (and which ones aren't?) of ONE individual now counts as "MAJOR". I suppose you believe it is up there with Watergate/Plame/Iran-Contra/White Water etc.?

I see the article you link cites that a whole $100K is devoted to this so-called major investigation. I thought the others took many millions. no?


What people didn't know is that she's done it before, firing Wasilla's police chief and library director when she was mayor because they didn't support her re-election.
Now, I really am curious where you live. This is completely normal and I see it done all the time. Where I live, if the Asst. Sheriff runs against his boss for the job he knows he won't have a job if he loses. The Police Chief usually serves at the pleasure of the Mayor, oppose him/her for re-election and, yeah, if they win re-election you're looking for another job. Afterall, the citizens obviously VOTED on it and found the Police Chief's objections unfounded. I won't mention the seemingly improper intrusion into politics by the PC. (S)He wants to play in politics and then gets burned? That's how it works here in the USA.

Even on simple things like "Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance, Palin proves herself to be an airhead:

Q: Are you offended by the phrase ?Under God? in the Pledge of Allegiance? Why or why not?

SP: Not on your life. If it was good enough for the founding fathers, its good enough for me and I?ll fight in defense of our Pledge of Allegiance.
Unfortunately Sarah, the founding fathers died almost two generations before Francis Bellamy wrote the Pledge in 1892, and "Under God" wasn't introduced until 1954. It's a grade school level response that illustrates her lack of knowledge of basic facts about our own country's history, but I think it just scratches the surface of how ignorant she is.
Well, I guess you won't be voting for Obama either due to his "57 states" comment?

Otherwise, I'm not sure what this discussion about the Pledge of Allegiance has to do with presidential elections?

Let's see what Obama would say about. I bet he will say he is NOT for removing the "under God" part? I suppose you would then be unable to support him either, amirite?


Corruption? She was heavily endorsed by Ted Stevens and Don Young, and she did support the bridge to nowhere before it became a political liability. But her corruption extends beyond that, blocking environmental protections for polar bears and salmon because it would endanger drilling and mining operations.
So because she is endorsed by another AK state politician accused of corruption, she is also guilty of it? And this inspite of her factual record of going against corruption, even within her own party? I'd advise you not to *play* in any Obama/Rezko threads, or any Obama/Ayers threads.

The polar bear population is increasing, not decreasing. All info indicates putting polar bears on an endangered list was politically motivated, and highly unpopular in AK.


We still haven't seen where the ticket stands on drilling in ANWR, since McCain opposes it but Palin supports it.
Hopefully, she'll get McCain to change his mind and support drilling there. As we've learned form such drilling sites, the caribou etc will thank us.

One nice thing about a delayed/shortened convention is less praise/celebration of Palin's coronation while the press gets more time to vet her.
Speaking of "time to vet her", IMO you'd be better served to wait a little bit and see what she's like etc instead of scrambling to prematurely spout such partisan silliness as you've done here.
See bolded

Fern
Seems like most of your response is just partisan, apologist drivel to me. Which isnt really suprising considering who is posting it I suppose.

 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,381
1,315
126
Originally posted by: cliftonite

Seems like most of your response is just partisan, apologist drivel to me. Which isnt really suprising considering who is posting it I suppose.
You do realize who he was responding to right?
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
Let me guess. You think erecting thousands of windmills to produce a small % of our power, consuming tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of acres is ok. But drilling on 2000 acres out of nealry 3 million is terrible.

We didnt drill in ANWR in 1995 thanks to that progressive forward thinking mind Bill Clinton. If we had, there would be 1.5 million barrels more a day to work with in the market. But lets close up and see how much more dependent on foreign oil we can become. It has done wonders for us so far. Two wars in under 15 years

Oh christ, at least use your brain. We use 25% of the worlds oil, we have 3% of the worlds oil reserves. We cannot drill our way to oil independence. If this war didn't happen in 2003, it would have happened in 2013. War over oil until we achieve energy independence is completely unavoidable. You want to criticize someone? Criticize the Bush Administration for sitting on its ass for the last 8 years when it comes to developing alternative energies.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Where does the figure of 1.5 billion barrels a day from ANWR come from? Twenty years ago all of the North Slope of Alaska was not producing that much, and now somewhat depleted, The entire North Slope now produces well under a million barrels of oil per day.

There are widely ranging estimates for the amount of oil in ANWR with low ball estimates depleting every drop of oil in ANWR in only 40 days, if we believes those wildly over optimistic daily yields.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
Originally posted by: DrPizza
Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
Small towns have bonds for projects like the ice hockey arena or roads... projects that need to be done for the community and such that they can't afford but will pay for itself over time.
-snip-
Usually small towns with 6000 residents aren't happy for long when they start to realize that their project is costing them $150,000 per year (in addition to bond payments). Sure, big projects like that are great for towns, but be realistic - $20 million for an ice skating rink for a town of 6000 people? Can you name any other towns that throw around money like that?
Its far more than an ice skating rink. To characterize it as such is completely misleading.

One objective is to get the Iditarod back. About 17,000 people show up for the start of the Iditarod. The money they spend will more than make up for the cost you quote; in fact just the sales tax from their purchases over a day or tow will cover the costs you cite. No doubt that's why it is to be funded by sales tax.

It's also a convention center, an emergency shelter and so on etc.

What people seem to wanna ignore here is that the citizens themselves voted for it, I see no evidence that Palin unilaterally created the thing by fiat as some here pretend.

I live in a small town and follow our (proposed) projects, a facility like this that can be used for so many purposes for only $20M is a pretty damn good deal. I'm pretty sure we would pass something like that here. We get a lot of proposals for $20M projects that are far more limited in use and far less likely to generate sufficiient revenue to pay for itself.

I don't where you guys live or even if you follow local politics, but $20M is standard fare. I'm just surprised they could do it for that in AK where prices are so high.

But do the math, $150K and 6K in residents is about $25 per head. That's freakin peanuts, boys. And that doesn't even include the additional sales tax revenue that can be put towards the project.

Fern
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
19
81
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Even on simple things like "Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance, Palin proves herself to be an airhead:

Q: Are you offended by the phrase ?Under God? in the Pledge of Allegiance? Why or why not?

SP: Not on your life. If it was good enough for the founding fathers, its good enough for me and I?ll fight in defense of our Pledge of Allegiance.
Ahem. lol. Pray that a staffer filled that out.
 

Pastore

Diamond Member
Feb 9, 2000
9,728
0
0
The "oil before all" link he posted, for me the scariest one of all, is from the Associated Press, not some wacko lefty blog.

This women is dirt and has her hands so far down the pants of big oil it's disgusting.
 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
0
0
Originally posted by: Fern
Originally posted by: DrPizza
Originally posted by: ZeroIQ
Small towns have bonds for projects like the ice hockey arena or roads... projects that need to be done for the community and such that they can't afford but will pay for itself over time.
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Usually small towns with 6000 residents aren't happy for long when they start to realize that their project is costing them $150,000 per year (in addition to bond payments). Sure, big projects like that are great for towns, but be realistic - $20 million for an ice skating rink for a town of 6000 people? Can you name any other towns that throw around money like that?
Its far more than an ice skating rink. To characterize it as such is completely misleading.

One objective is to get the Iditarod back. About 17,000 people show up for the start of the Iditarod. The money they spend will more than make up for the cost you quote; in fact just the sales tax from their purchases over a day or tow will cover the costs you cite. No doubt that's why it is to be funded by sales tax.

It's also a convention center, an emergency shelter and so on etc.

What people seem to wanna ignore here is that the citizens themselves voted for it, I see no evidence that Palin unilaterally created the thing by fiat as some here pretend.

I live in a small town and follow our (proposed) projects, a facility like this that can be used for so many purposes for only $20M is a pretty damn good deal. I'm pretty sure we would pass something like that here. We get a lot of proposals for $20M projects that are far more limited in use and far less likely to generate sufficiient revenue to pay for itself.

I don't where you guys live or even if you follow local politics, but $20M is standard fare. I'm just surprised they could do it for that in AK where prices are so high.

But do the math, $150K and 6K in residents is about $25 per head. That's freakin peanuts, boys. And that doesn't even include the additional sales tax revenue that can be put towards the project.

Fern
That would represent the 'operational' subsidy.

The capital costs are $1.9 mil/yr.
 

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