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Marines Killed Four Wounded Iraqi Prisoners: US Reporter

conjur

No Lifer
http://www.islamonline.org/Eng...-11/17/article01.shtml
BAGHDAD, November 17 (IslamOnline.net & News Agencies) ? The US pool reporter, who broke to the world the killing of a wounded, unarmed Iraqi prisoner by a marine, further revealed that more prisoners were shot dead though they did not appear threatening in any way.

NBC correspondent Kevin Sites was quoted by the Associated Press Wednesday, November 17, as saying that US Marines killed three more unarmed and wounded Iraqi prisoners in a Fallujah mosque Saturday, November 12.


He added the wounded had been left in the mosque for others to pick up and move to the rear for treatment. No reason was given why that had not happened.

The shooting in the Fallujah mosque became public Tuesday, November 16, with the airing of the footage taken Saturday by Sites.

In his report, Sites said the man who was killed didn't appear to be armed or threatening in any way, with no weapons visible in the mosque.

Sites said he saw the marine raise his rifle and fire point blank at the head of a man, who was slumped against a wall in a mosque.

US networks and television channels in other countries have widely shown Sites? footage, taken Saturday, but halted it in the second before the shot was fired.

The incident could cause major political problems for the government of Prime Minister Iyad Allawi and his US backers at a time when Iraqi authorities are seeking to contain a backlash among Sunnis to the Fallujah offensive.

Rumsfeld in the Dark

The US military promised a thorough investigation into the incident with the First Marine Division saying in a statement released in Iraq that the marine ?has been withdrawn from the battlefield pending the results of the investigation.?

The military said it wanted to determine whether the marine acted in self-defense, violated military law or failed to comply with the international Law of Armed Conflict.

?We follow the Law of Armed Conflict and hold ourselves to a high standard of accountability,? the marine commander in Fallujah, Lieutenant General John Sattler, said in a statement.

?The facts of this case will be thoroughly pursued to make an informed decision and to protect the rights of all persons involved,? he said.

Hawkish Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, in Ecuador for meetings with his Latin American counterparts, had little to say about the incident.

?I've not seen that,? said Rumsfeld. ?I've been told that an American general has addressed the subject and any discussion of what may or may not have taken place which I'm not knowledgeable about would clearly be handled by the military forces and the leadership there in Iraq.?

Some 10,000 US marines and army forces, alongside some 2,000 Iraqi national guard soldiers unleashed a long expected onslaught on the resistance hub on November 8, capping long nights of massive US raids.

The successive raids have caused massive damage in the city, with dead bodies still littering the streets.

The current offensive looked set to come at a heavy price for the US military as at least 39 American troops have been killed and up to 250 others evacuated to the US military hospital in the German city of Landstuhl so far, according to US military estimates.

The US military also said about 1,200 resistance fighters have been killed in the bloody incursion.

The killing of wounded Iraqi prisoners come as a grim reminder of the Abu Ghraib abuse scandal where US troops harassed, in all forms and types of the word, Iraqi detainees.

Washington also said it would investigate the horrible scenes, deemed by law experts as gross human rights violations, but only few soldiers were sentenced to jail terms and others are still on trial.

Maysoun Hirmiz, 36, a Christian Iraqi merchant in Baghdad, told the AP she was not satisfied by an announcement by the US military that it had removed the Marine from the battlefield and will investigate whether he acted in self defense.

?They will say or do the same thing they did with the soldiers who committed the abuses against Iraqis detainees in Abu Ghraib prison, and they are still free, enjoying their lives while they destroyed other peoples' lives,? Hirmiz said.
Yeah, this is going to go over just as great as did the Abu Ghraib situation.

Winning those hearts and minds by shooting bullets through them.


And the AP article:
http://www.lasvegassun.com/sun.../nov/17/111700342.html
Sites said three other insurgents wounded Friday in the mosque were also shot again Saturday by the Marines.
 
It's just more greedy journalists going for the Pulitzer Prize.


Poor Marines, we just need to quit interfering.


Bound to happen, war is hell.


They were booby-trapped terrorists, faking it.


and on and on it shall go.


 
They will be punished for their actions, but this is really bad news.

The worst thing is that EVERY action will be considered before carried out, this is not a good thing in a combat zone.

To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down.
 
Originally posted by: Klixxer
They will be punished for their actions, but this is really bad news.

The worst thing is that EVERY action will be considered before carried out, this is not a good thing in a combat zone.

To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down.
I would prefer the tours of duty to be cut back to 6 months. Some of these guys have been there for, what, 18 months straight? That's got to do some serious damage to the psyche.

Vietnam taught the asshats in this administration not one damn thing. :|
 
Originally posted by: Klixxer
They will be punished for their actions, but this is really bad news.

The worst thing is that EVERY action will be considered before carried out, this is not a good thing in a combat zone.

To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down.

"To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down."


I agree they shouldnt be there embedded as they were, but the problem now is if you take them off the lines and out of the action, it appears as if something is wished to be kept hidden

on the Bright side, we need to investigate the actions and or charges on any troops in situations such as this and keep the process pulblic and open to sow the world we do value the rights of humanity and do have moral fiber.

 
I have seen several versions of the shooting. I am not sure what to think.

Part o fme sides with the young Marine. He just wants to survive and come home. My heart does not go out to the Iraqi prisoner, his own so called freedom fighters left him behind, prior he was clearly involved in the fight. He should have listened to commands. I do not think we are the ones cutting heads off our captives, hanging them from bridges or shooting women in the head. The enemy has not fought within the rules of combat, so why shold we? I know, now we all want say in the matter. This really isn't a surprise to me. Things like this have gone on in every conflict, the only difference is now we have reporters with about every unit, live coverage.
 
Originally posted by: conjur
Originally posted by: Klixxer
They will be punished for their actions, but this is really bad news.

The worst thing is that EVERY action will be considered before carried out, this is not a good thing in a combat zone.

To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down.
I would prefer the tours of duty to be cut back to 6 months. Some of these guys have been there for, what, 18 months straight? That's got to do some serious damage to the psyche.

Vietnam taught the asshats in this administration not one damn thing. :|

Heh, i just hope i get home before Christmas, that would be a three month tour, more than enough.

6 months is good rotation standard, however, in the complex situation, experience is crucial and very few US troops actually have any real combat experience.

So i think there is a reason to keep the ones with combat experience in place.
 
Originally posted by: Grunt03
I have seen several versions of the shooting. I am not sure what to think.

Part o fme sides with the young Marine. He just wants to survive and come home. My heart does not go out to the Iraqi prisoner, his own so called freedom fighters left him behind, prior he was clearly involved in the fight. He should have listened to commands. I do not think we are the ones cutting heads off our captives, hanging them from bridges or shooting women in the head. The enemy has not fought within the rules of combat, so why shold we? I know, now we all want say in the matter. This really isn't a surprise to me. Things like this have gone on in every conflict, the only difference is now we have reporters with about every unit, live coverage.
the coalition should go by international laws, that is what defines them from the insurgents in Iraq, thats what is upposed to make the coalition better!

 
Shorter tours of duty would result in soldiers with less experience in combat. This would result in higher casualties. It is the experienced soldiers who teach the newbies how to survive too. I don't think a 6 month tour would be good at all.

These insurgents were not in custody, so they were not prisoners as far as I can tell. As more info comes out, it looks like the insurgents may have been booby-trapping their wounded or dead and the Marine in question may have been wounded by one of these traps.


Then of course there is the other little reported story of Fallujah.

http://powerlineblog.com/archives/008640.php
 
Originally posted by: smashp
Originally posted by: Klixxer
They will be punished for their actions, but this is really bad news.

The worst thing is that EVERY action will be considered before carried out, this is not a good thing in a combat zone.

To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down.

"To be honest i would prefer if the reporters were kept out until the major fighting dies down."


I agree they shouldnt be there embedded as they were, but the problem now is if you take them off the lines and out of the action, it appears as if something is wished to be kept hidden

on the Bright side, we need to investigate the actions and or charges on any troops in situations such as this and keep the process pulblic and open to sow the world we do value the rights of humanity and do have moral fiber.

As i am not very familiar with US military routines i will leave that to a man who is DonVito, you should ask him about his situation.

What i can say for me and my men is that our actions and inactions are heavily scrutinized and as a commanding officer i have to account for all actions and inactions directly after every mission.

I am not in Iraq though and our situation is probably not comparable to theirs as we are not fighting any heavy resistance, rather tracking down people (situations with foreigners involved=, i think i can say that much.
 
Hopefully this report will get to outlets such as Al-Jazzeer and promote uproar in the Muslim world that will make current insurrgents in Iraq look like toy figurines. Let the uproar dazzle Bush's Junta in horrid ways.
 
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Hopefully this report will get to outlets such as Al-Jazzeer and promote uproar in the Muslim world that will make current insurrgents in Iraq look like toy figurines. Let the uproar dazzle Bush's Junta in horrid ways.

Comments like that makes me wish some women would be smart enough to have abortions, apparently your mother was not one of the smart ones.

You hope for war and pain? I hope you get it, but only for yourself.
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Then of course there is the other little reported story of Fallujah.

http://powerlineblog.com/archives/008640.php
Are you sure you want to bring that up? Why were the residents of Fallujah under control of, as they put it, the Mujahedeen?

Wouldn't be because the U.S. unjustly invaded Iraq, took out the existing command and security infrastructure, allowed insurgents against the U.S. occupying force to thrive, allowed foreign fighters to cross the borders into Iraq and generally plundering the cities into turmoil?
 
Originally posted by: Klixxer
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Hopefully this report will get to outlets such as Al-Jazzeer and promote uproar in the Muslim world that will make current insurrgents in Iraq look like toy figurines. Let the uproar dazzle Bush's Junta in horrid ways.

Comments like that makes me wish some women would be smart enough to have abortions, apparently your mother was not one of the smart ones.

You hope for war and pain? I hope you get it, but only for yourself.

Well, atleast he probably won't have kids.
 
Well these guys can all come back and begin protesting the war, consort with the enemy in Paris, and then run in a failed bid for President under the Democratic party ticket and they'd have so much in common with Kerry that the liberals would love them. After all, Kerry admittedly shot and killed a wounded VC himself.
 
What will the reporter's stories be when a insurgent is captured and exploded killing a couple of people with him?

Many a soldieer has been killed by a prisoner/enemy lying on an explosive device, waiting to take one with them when they die.

They did not need to initially shoot the people without being very careful in checking out the situation.

However, if you suspect that the enemy is dead and then they respond, the first instinct is to remove the potential threat ASAP.
 
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Hopefully this report will get to outlets such as Al-Jazzeer and promote uproar in the Muslim world that will make current insurrgents in Iraq look like toy figurines. Let the uproar dazzle Bush's Junta in horrid ways.

Die. In a fire.

- M4H
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Well these guys can all come back and begin protesting the war, consort with the enemy in Paris, and then run in a failed bid for President under the Democratic party ticket and they'd have so much in common with Kerry that the liberals would love them. After all, Kerry admittedly shot and killed a wounded VC himself.
Kerry may be a war criminal but he is not a liberal. He like alot of other garbage voted for the war.

 
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Well these guys can all come back and begin protesting the war, consort with the enemy in Paris, and then run in a failed bid for President under the Democratic party ticket and they'd have so much in common with Kerry that the liberals would love them. After all, Kerry admittedly shot and killed a wounded VC himself.
Kerry may be a war criminal but he is not a liberal. He like alot of other garbage voted for the war.
Liberals can be hawks just like conservatives can be doves. Pro-war or anti-war does not define a liberal position. Maybe that's what confuses people when I say I'm a liberal?

 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Well these guys can all come back and begin protesting the war, consort with the enemy in Paris, and then run in a failed bid for President under the Democratic party ticket and they'd have so much in common with Kerry that the liberals would love them. After all, Kerry admittedly shot and killed a wounded VC himself.

Sometimes i wonder if stupidity is really limited at all, it seems it isn't.

Is that he best you can do? How about the swell guy who was CIC at the time?

Reporting your experiences truthfully is wrong while lying through your teeth is right?
 
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Hopefully this report will get to outlets such as Al-Jazzeer and promote uproar in the Muslim world that will make current insurrgents in Iraq look like toy figurines. Let the uproar dazzle Bush's Junta in horrid ways.

Die. In a fire.

- M4H

Slowly, with a cherry on top.
 
Originally posted by: Klixxer
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Hopefully this report will get to outlets such as Al-Jazzeer and promote uproar in the Muslim world that will make current insurrgents in Iraq look like toy figurines. Let the uproar dazzle Bush's Junta in horrid ways.

Die. In a fire.

- M4H

Slowly, with a cherry on top.

And whipped cream? :heart:

- M4H
 
No Conjur, that's not why Falluja was like that. Iraq was like that under Saddam, you just never heard about it. When someone disappeared back then, no one was allowed to tell you about it.
 
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