Maglite finally going LED

[Viper GTS]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

What are good brands of D cell lights though?

Why do you care? You want to beat someone with a pipe full of them? Why would you insist on an inferior power source?

Good lights use CR123's. They're smaller, higher voltage, and have a MUCH longer shelf life. If you're looking for a weapon by all means buy the Mag. To get anywhere near that in melee ability you'd have to spend 10x the money on something like an M6.

If you're really, truly set on D cell lights then buy a Mag & put an InReTech head on it.

Viper GTS

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

What are good brands of D cell lights though?

Why do you care? You want to beat someone with a pipe full of them? Why would you insist on an inferior power source?

Good lights use CR123's. They're smaller, higher voltage, and have a MUCH longer shelf life. If you're looking for a weapon by all means buy the Mag. To get anywhere near that in melee ability you'd have to spend 10x the money on something like an M6.

If you're really, truly set on D cell lights then buy a Mag & put an InReTech head on it.

Viper GTS

CR123s are expensive and don't pack much power.. I'd rather carry a big flashlight with hours of light than a small thing that uses those damn CR123s. Even better would be NIMH D cells. Up to 10,000mah. I'd also rather have effective incandescent light than gee-whiz LED.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Zim Hosein

Originally posted by: Flatscan

Originally posted by: Shawn
Do LEDs burn out like regular bulbs do?

Nope, not in normal use. LEDs can be popped with significant over-voltage/current, but they're practically impervious to impact.

White LEDs dim over time in use due to phosphor degradation, IIRC, the quoted 100,000 hours of runtime is to 50% of initial brightness. This degradation can be accelerated by driving the LED above spec and/or insufficient thermal relief.

So the answer to Shawn's quesion, in a nutshell is yes!

No, the answer in a nutshell is for all practical purposes no. 100,000 hours is 11 years of continuous use.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
It doesn't take a $400 light to make a Mag look like complete & utter crap.

A $35 Surefire G2 Nitrolon (approximately the size of a MiniMag) puts out 60 lumens of perfectly smooth light. For <$10 on Ebay you can get an extra lamp assembly & now you can switch between the stock 60 lumen & the 120 lumen HO lamp.

You'll pay to feed it of course, with the 120 lumen bulb a $2.50 pair of CR123's will last about 20 minutes. But for that 20 minutes all the maglite owners will be scraping their jaw on the ground.

The point to all this is that it only takes a few $$ more than the maglites you all love to get FAR more light, & better quality light. All in a package the size of a MiniMag.

BTW the SureFire G2 is entry level as far as good lights go. It's only marginally more expensive than a Mag, but FAR better. You can spend far more of course, but it only takes $35 to shame a Mag.

Well some of us actually USE a flashlight, and when we need it, we need it for more than 20mins. If you like to pretend your Jack Bauer now and then, yeah, you can probably afford the costs for 20mins of light.

 

Well some of us actually USE a flashlight, and when we need it, we need it for more than 20mins. If you like to pretend your Jack Bauer now and then, yeah, you can probably afford the costs for 20mins of light.

Yea, what good is a flashlight that only lasts 20 minutes?

 

[merlocka]

I dunno about all dat, but I picked up a Dorcy 1W 3xAAA from Target and it's teh bomb yo. Then I ordered a 3W from www.ledbeam.com and I've been blinding all my friends ever since. $50 for both with batteries.

The Dorcy feels tougher than a minimag, but the ledbeam isn't quite as solid as a good-ole 2D Mag. It's amazing how much brighter they are.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: SampSon

Well some of us actually USE a flashlight, and when we need it, we need it for more than 20mins. If you like to pretend your Jack Bauer now and then, yeah, you can probably afford the costs for 20mins of light.

Yea, what good is a flashlight that only lasts 20 minutes?

I guess if you're a flashlight dork, you carry one of these: http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/prrfnbr/251/sesent/00

 

[Viper GTS]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

CR123s are expensive and don't pack much power.. I'd rather carry a big flashlight with hours of light than a small thing that uses those damn CR123s. Even better would be NIMH D cells. Up to 10,000mah.

Do the math:


D Cell NiMH (11000 MAH)
Diameter: 32.5mm
Height: 60.5mm
Volume: 50cc

CR123 (1400 MAH)
Diameter: 16mm
Height: 32mm
Volume: 6.4cc

The CR123 is essentially identical in energy density to the highest capacity NIMH D Cell I could find (11K MAH), & quite a bit more dense than the merely "average" HIMH D's (that don't cost $32 a pair like the 11K's).

The ONLY drawback to CR123's is cost. They outperform traditional alkaline or NIMH batteries in EVERY way. What kind of voltage do you thing a normal alkaline cell is putting out at the end of its life? I found a spec sheet for one, 0.8V! CR123's are MUCH flatter, you'll get nearly 100% out of them until they drop sharply.

BTW for those bitching about the 20 minute run time of a G2 w/HO keep in mind this light is the size of a mini mag & putting out 120 lumens. If you want to carry a bigger light (thus holding more batteries) you can have much more runtime. It was just an example of what $50 will get you in good flashlights. Also 120 lumens is serious overkill for most flashlight uses. Ever tried reading a map with 120 lumens? It's nearly impossible the hotspot is so huge & so much light is thrown back at you that it's quite painful. 60 lumens is MUCH more reasonable for normal use, & it will last much longer than 20 minutes.

120 lumens is a tactical light, it's not something you use to walk your dog.

Viper GTS

 

You flashlight nerds are so vain. It's really getting out of hand with the LED flashlight enthusiasm. The people who care about these LED flashlights the most are the ones that use them the least. Seriously, there have been some lame trends, but this LED flashlight thing is nearing the top.

I use a flashlight everyday for my job and I really don't care if it's LED or not. I did buy the little LED upgrade kit for my older MiniMag lites, it works, though I could still do the job just as well without it. I also get heavy useage out of my little keychain maglite and this little columbia LED keychain thing I got for my birthday one year.

 

[Dessert Tears]

Viper GTS, thanks for posting that direct comparison to the G2 Nitrolon.

mercanucaribe, good point about the D-cell form factor. The trend has seemed to be more towards Every Day Carry with reasonable brightness and battery life, and I can't think of any off-the-shelf D lights. Modifying those larger Mags is fairly common.

Originally posted by: Looney
Well some of us actually USE a flashlight, and when we need it, we need it for more than 20mins. If you like to pretend your Jack Bauer now and then, yeah, you can probably afford the costs for 20mins of light.

20min is for the 120-lumen P61 HO lamp. The 60-lumen P60 stock lamp gets roughly 60min. IIRC, the stock lamp is significantly brighter than a 2C/D Mag and noticeably brighter than a 3C/D Mag.

If you regularly need 20min of constant-on runtime, you should be looking at LEDs dimmed appropriately or rechargeables.

As a piece of trivia, Bauer uses a Surefire M6 (linked earlier by Googer) in Season 1 when searching through the field with Mason. I've read that the M6 is popular with production crews because it's bright enough to look like a flashlight even with the brighter ambient light required for filming.

Originally posted by: SampSon
You flashlight nerds are so vain. It's really getting out of hand with the LED flashlight enthusiasm. The people who care about these LED flashlights the most are the ones that use them the least. Seriously, there have been some lame trends, but this LED flashlight thing is nearing the top.

Oddly enough, much of this thread has not mentioned LEDs at all, despite the OP. I personally like LED flashlights, but I dislike fanboism that overstates their capabilities. I haven't really seen that in this thread.

 

[Minjin]

If you want a D-cell light to beat someone over the head with and to have a long runtime, I recommend this:

Text

Folks, its a tool. You can spend a dollar on a chinese made adjustable wrench and you can spend fifty dollars on a Snap-On wrench. Quality tools are not a fad. Are you going to get 50x the performance? Of course not. But you pay more for better performance and better reliability. Is it worth it? Well thats something only you can decide for YOU. I don't get whats so difficult to understand. People with the same mentality as yours laugh at you for spending so much on computers. Or MP3 players. Or even food.

Mark

 

Oddly enough, much of this thread has not mentioned LEDs at all, despite the OP. I personally like LED flashlights, but I dislike fanboism that overstates their capabilities. I haven't really seen that in this thread.

No offence, but did you actually read the thread?
The whole thread is a discussion about LED flashlights compared to the old maglites. There isn't much mindless fanboism in here though, which is good. Though, how fanboish can you get with flashlights?

 

[aceO07]

Originally posted by: her34

Originally posted by: aceO07

Originally posted by: KK
light is light, I couldn't give 2 dumps if it came from a candle, led, bulb, firefly, moon. Just so I can see what i'm doing. I don't see how people can spend so much for a single flashlight.

They have their uses. I use it for hiking and camping. A dim maglite 2AA is useless and a maglite 4D is too big to lug around.

Ask an avid camper/backpacker how much their sleeping bag, tent and other equipment cost. A sleeping bag and tent probably only cost $20-30 each at Target/Walmart.

what do you use?

I use a $20 sleepingbag since I don't backpack. However, I used a friend's $200 sleepingbag last time and I can appreciate why they bought it. It weighs about a pound and compresses down to the size of a football.

 

[Dessert Tears]

Originally posted by: SampSon

Oddly enough, much of this thread has not mentioned LEDs at all, despite the OP. I personally like LED flashlights, but I dislike fanboism that overstates their capabilities. I haven't really seen that in this thread.

No offence, but did you actually read the thread?
The whole thread is a discussion about LED flashlights compared to the old maglites. There isn't much mindless fanboism in here though, which is good. Though, how fanboish can you get with flashlights?

I just did a quick scan through the thread to verify my earlier impressions. The first portion of the thread is roughly 50% "LED by Mag is interesting" interspersed with "Mags suck"/"Mags are good for the price"/"Mags rock" plus a good bit of "I have used this LED Mag substitute/replacement module". The more recent posts have been mainly "Mags suck/rock, here's why". The most recent posts about Surefire mention incandescent (not LED) lights that have both higher performance and higher price than Mags. I don't know if it's possible to pump 2x123 through a Luxeon LED in 20min (i.e. like the P61 HO lamp mentioned earlier) without frying it.

Perhaps you would be surprised by the fanboism possible in flashlights. However, it's easier to derail fanboish contentions with simple common sense reasoning.

 

[Rubycon]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

D Cell NiMH (11000 MAH)
Diameter: 32.5mm
Height: 60.5mm
Volume: 50cc

CR123 (1400 MAH)
Diameter: 16mm
Height: 32mm
Volume: 6.4cc

This is a flawed comparison. Capacity is measured in watt/hours not ampere-hours. Lithium Maganese Dioxide cells (CR123) have a fresh open voltage over three volts per cell whereas Nickel Metal Hydride is 1.2 volts per cell. Frequent users also use secondary (Lithium Ion Poly) cells which have 4.2 volts per cell (off charger) and 3.750 volts per cell (working). These have much higher energy densities than nimh cells. This is why all compact portable devices - everything from cell phones, pda, notebook pc, and mobile audio players - use li-ion cells.

A "D" sized Li Ion would have a huge capacity. (drool!) Also keep in mind that ampere hours does not mean n amperes for t hours! Many rates are 1/20C rates!

 

[Slickone]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS
It doesn't take a $400 light to make a Mag look like complete & utter crap.

A $35 Surefire G2 Nitrolon (approximately the size of a MiniMag) puts out 60 lumens of perfectly smooth light. For <$10 on Ebay you can get an extra lamp assembly & now you can switch between the stock 60 lumen & the 120 lumen HO lamp.

You'll pay to feed it of course, with the 120 lumen bulb a $2.50 pair of CR123's will last about 20 minutes. But for that 20 minutes all the maglite owners will be scraping their jaw on the ground.

The point to all this is that it only takes a few $$ more than the maglites you all love to get FAR more light, & better quality light. All in a package the size of a MiniMag.

BTW the SureFire G2 is entry level as far as good lights go. It's only marginally more expensive than a Mag, but FAR better. You can spend far more of course, but it only takes $35 to shame a Mag.

Viper GTS

Some people would rather have a light that maybe isn't as bright as the sun, but lasts longer than 20 or even 60 minutes. Ask a Spelunker which he'd take. What good is a uber bright flashlight when the batteries are dead?
Also wonder what size batteries they Mag will use? Some people would rather have one that uses regular sized batteries than CR123's.

 

[talyn00]

hrm are there any good flashlights with adjustable brightness, so you can conserve power when you don't need something super bright, yet have the ability to be as bright at the surefire flashlights mentioned?

 

[Rubycon]

Originally posted by: talyn00
hrm are there any good flashlights with adjustable brightness, so you can conserve power when you don't need something super bright, yet have the ability to be as bright at the surefire flashlights mentioned?

Surefire U2 and HDS Ultimate EDC series.

 

[talyn00]

Originally posted by: C6FT7

Originally posted by: talyn00
hrm are there any good flashlights with adjustable brightness, so you can conserve power when you don't need something super bright, yet have the ability to be as bright at the surefire flashlights mentioned?

Surefire U2 and HDS Ultimate EDC series.

cool, uhh is there anything that costs a bit less? Also know of any good retailers to buy from?

 

[jpeyton]

My favorite Mag-Killer is the Dorcy Luxeon 3D that you can buy from Target for ~$22. Machined aluminum, rubber grip, rubber anti-roll collar, knuckled base.

Packs as much light as a 3D Mag, but the Luxeon is whiter (small spot, great spill), and the output lasts about 6 times as long...the light lasts forever on a single set of D cells; most people won't replace the batteries more than once a year.

If you want reliability, it sure wouldn't be a incandecent flashlight with poor battery life and a bulb that can blow out any time you drop it.

And you can put me in the camp of people that likes their flashlights to have great output, but spectacular battery life. At least 3 hours of high output for a tactical light, and at least 20+ hours to 50% brightness for a everyday flashlight.

One more thing...never underestimate great battery life. If the power goes out for a couple days, you're better off having to replace the batteries once (or not at all) compared to every few hours with high-output lights.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
My favorite Mag-Killer is the Dorcy Luxeon 3D that you can buy from Target for ~$22. Machined aluminum, rubber grip, rubber anti-roll collar, knuckled base.

Packs as much light as a 3D Mag, but the Luxeon is whiter (small spot, great spill), and the output lasts about 6 times as long...the light lasts forever on a single set of D cells; most people won't replace the batteries more than once a year.

If you want reliability, it sure wouldn't be a incandecent flashlight with poor battery life and a bulb that can blow out any time you drop it.

And you can put me in the camp of people that likes their flashlights to have great output, but spectacular battery life. At least 3 hours of high output for a tactical light, and at least 20+ hours to 50% brightness for a everyday flashlight.

One more thing...never underestimate great battery life. If the power goes out for a couple days, you're better off having to replace the batteries once (or not at all) compared to every few hours with high-output lights.

$22 at Target? And it's actually a bright light? I got a Target giftcard for Xmas....

 

[drinkmorejava]

I took a blue LED out of a case fan a while ago and use it in the 2xAA kind. Not too bright, but what I need during play performances.

 

[Dessert Tears]

Originally posted by: talyn00

Originally posted by: C6FT7

Originally posted by: talyn00
hrm are there any good flashlights with adjustable brightness, so you can conserve power when you don't need something super bright, yet have the ability to be as bright at the surefire flashlights mentioned?

Surefire U2 and HDS Ultimate EDC series.

cool, uhh is there anything that costs a bit less? Also know of any good retailers to buy from?

Heh. Those are definitely pricey lights, though the LionHeart and the McLuxIII-PD are up there also.

talyn00, your two requirements are difficult to get in a single package. Adjustable brightness requires either >1 distinct light sources (e.g. Surefire A2 Aviator) or an LED primary source, since the incandescents used in flashlights don't do too well with dimming. An LED matching 60lumens (standard P60 lamp) is less likely to come in a cheaper off-the-shelf light, and matching 120lumens (High Output P61 lamp) requires a relatively rare LED and probably a custom build.

If you reduce your brightness requirements a little, I believe there are retail lights around $50 that have reasonable brightness and adjustability (2 brightness settings), but I don't know any specifics. $100 should get you a MagMod custom build (2C/D size) with a respectable emitter and dimming electronics. $150 should get you a Surefire A2, L1 or L2 (all 2-level) if you can find it slightly below retail.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
My favorite Mag-Killer is the Dorcy Luxeon 3D that you can buy from Target for ~$22. Machined aluminum, rubber grip, rubber anti-roll collar, knuckled base.

Packs as much light as a 3D Mag, but the Luxeon is whiter (small spot, great spill), and the output lasts about 6 times as long...the light lasts forever on a single set of D cells; most people won't replace the batteries more than once a year.

If you want reliability, it sure wouldn't be a incandecent flashlight with poor battery life and a bulb that can blow out any time you drop it.

And you can put me in the camp of people that likes their flashlights to have great output, but spectacular battery life. At least 3 hours of high output for a tactical light, and at least 20+ hours to 50% brightness for a everyday flashlight.

One more thing...never underestimate great battery life. If the power goes out for a couple days, you're better off having to replace the batteries once (or not at all) compared to every few hours with high-output lights.

http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/dorcy_luxeon3d.htm

Beats the Mag 3D hands down. I assume it's much better than my Garrity 3D, though it has served me well for midnight geocaching..

That light isn't on the Target website though.

 

[mercanucaribe]

I went to Target and bought the Dorcy 1W. It's as bright as my 3D Garrity even with batteries used a couple hours, and with a much more uniform beam. Throw is not as good though. Battery life should be several times longer though, with flatter output. $23.58 with tax.

Will have to see how well the high color temperature LED light works for geocaching and such.