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Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez
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jjzelinski
Diamond Member
Because something other than plain facts and common sense is going to prevail in the future, at least one as see fit by the PNAC and their idiot fan base.
heyheybooboo
Diamond Member
General Sanchez had to retire to speak his mind - before he got ** Shinseki-ed **
Did not believe the Bush Crime Cabal then - don't believe the Bush Crime Cabal now
Army secretary Thomas White was fired in April 2003 after expressing his agreement with Shinseki's assessment of needed troop levels in Iraq.
White said that senior Defense officials "are unwilling to come to grips" with the scale of the postwar U.S. obligation in Iraq, adding, "It's almost a question of people not wanting to 'fess up to the notion that we will be there a long time and they might have to set up a rotation and sustain it for the long term."
Did not believe the Bush Crime Cabal then - don't believe the Bush Crime Cabal now
Rumsfeld let it be known in April, 2003 that he had decided to name Gen. John Keane, the Army's vice chief of staff, as its next chief, 15 months before its current chief, Gen. Eric Shinseki, was scheduled to retire. This immediately made Shinseki a lame duck
Army secretary Thomas White was fired in April 2003 after expressing his agreement with Shinseki's assessment of needed troop levels in Iraq.
White said that senior Defense officials "are unwilling to come to grips" with the scale of the postwar U.S. obligation in Iraq, adding, "It's almost a question of people not wanting to 'fess up to the notion that we will be there a long time and they might have to set up a rotation and sustain it for the long term."
CaptnKirk
Lifer
and also - too many right wing extremists are insisting that these actions will lead them to their promised Armageddon, as led by Bush the Magnificent.
Funny how those who never were actually in the Military know just how to totally screw things up by forcing their controls over the Military.
Guess that this will be another 'Phony Soldier' for the Oxycotin Eater to attack.
How many more distinguished Military Carer Officers will have to be destroyed to appease Bush and the GOP's egos?
It's so easy to predict which clueless individuals will jump on the bandwagon of personal attacks and character assassination
to keep those in check who actually know whats happening.
Just like the discussions with a couple of local 'Military Posters' (Who to me don't come across as believable)
Instead of staying on topic and contributing to the content of the discussion, they believe that a personal attack is appropriate.
Well guys, it's not the job of the Marines or the Army to attack American Citizens, no matter what they think they can get away with.
You might be able to indescribably fire away at locals in a war zone and pass it off as 'collateral damage'
but that doesn't really work well back in the colonies does it?
TastesLikeChicken
Lifer
Or they'll revise it if they don't like the way it ends up being written.
Notice also - something the media has commented very, very little on - that Sanchez spent the entire first half of his speech absolutely lambasting the press on their biased coverage of Iraq. He's pointing a finger of blame at the Dems as well for puting politics ahead of fighting a war we were already in. So why the lefties would like to pretend Sanchez is only complaining about the adminstration, he is passing blame all around. No single group is at fault here. They all are.
TastesLikeChicken
Lifer
You mean the blame goes to the 60%+ of the population that initially supported the invasion of Iraq?
If we ever have to tuck tail and run then you can place some blame. That blame will be on people like me that initially supported the invasion and people like you who squawked and squawked to interfere with the execution of this war and occupation. But right now it doesn't appear that we'll be tucking tail so when we are finally successful in the years to come you can thank people like me that had the fortitude and foresight to see it through to the end and I'll still be blaming you for trying to interfere with that process.
jjzelinski
Diamond Member
Thank people like you for your "FORESIGHT"? You morons didn't even know what you went to Iraq for until two years into it! Hell, that's assuming you have a reason why we're there now! And just what is the excuse today? WMDs? Democracy? National Defense? Manifest Destiny?
Good christ, the last thing you should be commending yourself for is "foresight". I can't believe how deluded you'd have to be to even say that.
jjzelinski
Diamond Member
Oh yeah, and jesus DID come in the "YEAR 2000" for the judgment of all mankind! The liberal merely "glossed over" Armageddon. So don't feel bad for stocking pilling up on all those cans of Chunky Soup, fundies! You really were one of the 120,000 elites that were raptured and don't let those silly libs tell you different!
TastesLikeChicken
Lifer
This is how Sanchez describes the media:
Boy that sure is accurate. The pigs do feed from the trough as so many of the lefties in here demonstrate. Lap it up and wallow in the mud, boys, because the trough is running dry on you and the mud is drying up. Pretty soon you'll just be dirty, hungry little pigs.
BMW540I6speed
Golden Member
Regarding the media, the truth is not their thing.
For Beltway pundits, the primetime talkingheads and the Republican party of today there is no truth. Its relevance faded in the waves of self pity and pious outrage they revelled in throughout the eighties and nineties, any doubts expiring in the ashes of the World Trade Center. 9-11 proved: if one doesn?t care to look too carefully, that these misguided-winged angels and prophets were always right, and truth was a waste of time.
The discernment and propagation of truth only matters if friends and enemies are hard to spot, and worthy goals difficult to ascertain. What difference does it make if the American public is goaded into war by falsehoods, given that American wars are always good and profitable, and a constant vexation to evil? Whatever gets the populace there fastest is necessarily good?and that probably isn?t going to be the truth.
The mainstream press and its token rock stars, meanwhile found the perfect postmodern balance. All is relative, including truth and falsehood. These two must be bound together and forced to dance in each other?s arms until it?s impossible to clearly see which is which. For every truth reported, there is a lie offered up by its enemies. And since truth is relative anyway, don?t be shy about it; for every truth, report two lies, or ten, just so long as balance is maintained.
There is such power in simple, righteous lies. The floundering masses are all grey and whimpering over what is true, but the true believers & corporate journalists, are like a dark and vengeful God, slaying without restraint or pity those who resist his juggernaut. In fact, for ambitious members of the fifth estate, ten lies are better than two; the talking heads butters everyone?s bread, and anyway, at least the truth is in there somewhere. There?s no need for second-guessing or regrets. Give service like a whore, and wealth, power and access are yours. Do not trouble your customers with too many impertinent questions lest they complain to the madam. Be satisfied to service power and receive your just reward.
And yet something is going wrong. Truth keeps surfacing despite the wealth and power of its enemies. It?s as if it isn't about us?as if it doesn't matter what we prefer to think. It?s as if surges can fail independently of our wishes and commands, and cakewalks don?t happen just because we?d like them too. What?s a poor reporter to do? When power comes calling, lay back and act gratified. Don?t get too uppity. The customer is always right.
As for the Great Decider himself, well, someone has always got him out of trouble, so why should this time be any different?. The entire Beltway system is paralyzed with fear - fear of failure, fear of admitting failure, fear of acting. They know the free flow of information they initially shunned, then accommodated, and now need to back for their own survival will also enable an accurate rendition of history.
For Beltway pundits, the primetime talkingheads and the Republican party of today there is no truth. Its relevance faded in the waves of self pity and pious outrage they revelled in throughout the eighties and nineties, any doubts expiring in the ashes of the World Trade Center. 9-11 proved: if one doesn?t care to look too carefully, that these misguided-winged angels and prophets were always right, and truth was a waste of time.
The discernment and propagation of truth only matters if friends and enemies are hard to spot, and worthy goals difficult to ascertain. What difference does it make if the American public is goaded into war by falsehoods, given that American wars are always good and profitable, and a constant vexation to evil? Whatever gets the populace there fastest is necessarily good?and that probably isn?t going to be the truth.
The mainstream press and its token rock stars, meanwhile found the perfect postmodern balance. All is relative, including truth and falsehood. These two must be bound together and forced to dance in each other?s arms until it?s impossible to clearly see which is which. For every truth reported, there is a lie offered up by its enemies. And since truth is relative anyway, don?t be shy about it; for every truth, report two lies, or ten, just so long as balance is maintained.
There is such power in simple, righteous lies. The floundering masses are all grey and whimpering over what is true, but the true believers & corporate journalists, are like a dark and vengeful God, slaying without restraint or pity those who resist his juggernaut. In fact, for ambitious members of the fifth estate, ten lies are better than two; the talking heads butters everyone?s bread, and anyway, at least the truth is in there somewhere. There?s no need for second-guessing or regrets. Give service like a whore, and wealth, power and access are yours. Do not trouble your customers with too many impertinent questions lest they complain to the madam. Be satisfied to service power and receive your just reward.
And yet something is going wrong. Truth keeps surfacing despite the wealth and power of its enemies. It?s as if it isn't about us?as if it doesn't matter what we prefer to think. It?s as if surges can fail independently of our wishes and commands, and cakewalks don?t happen just because we?d like them too. What?s a poor reporter to do? When power comes calling, lay back and act gratified. Don?t get too uppity. The customer is always right.
As for the Great Decider himself, well, someone has always got him out of trouble, so why should this time be any different?. The entire Beltway system is paralyzed with fear - fear of failure, fear of admitting failure, fear of acting. They know the free flow of information they initially shunned, then accommodated, and now need to back for their own survival will also enable an accurate rendition of history.
Lemon law
Lifer
Its quite odd that Sanchez blames the press for being less than perfect. When in fact Sanchez ran a media outlet on the side that could give a biased or non biased viewpoint on
whats was really going on in Iraq. Because Sanchez ran his media sideshow in a biased manner, the press developed other sources.
Sanchez was also on the ground floor of the US occupation. He bears a disproportionate share of the blame for not seeing the negative trend lines and not being a strong enough advocate for changing the negative things he did see. And then blames the press when the press bias has only a tiny impact on public support.
The point being, the Iraq war started with damn near 90% public support. If there was any kind of apparent progress in Iraq, the press would be reporting it because they would have no choice. If anything the press was somewhat tardy in reporting the true picture in Iraq, and if anything, the press still is not as hard on this administration as they should be. The GWB administration is the entity that drives the news, if they come up with successes, it will be reported. If they come up with failures, it will be reported, and if they come up with nothing but pie in the sky political spin, pardon the press for labeling political spin for what it is.
We are now 4.5 years into an occupation, there has been every chance for GWB&co. to demonstrate progress, and today, at least in MHO, we are worse off than when we started. The Iraqi occupation has been spun every way imaginable by the press, politicians, and pundits. So there is bias, counter bias, and very little unspun truth. But when it comes to real progress, Sanchez had his chance to snatch continuing victory from the jaws of military victory, and instead lost the peace with his own ineptness. And the insurgency grew while Sanchez frittered the time away giving the Iraqi insurgencies the ability grow from an infant to a full grown entrenched monstrosity on his watch.
Let us try the following thought experiment. Suppose we had a 4.5 year total press blackout. And support at home for Iraq war was still that same 90%. And then tomorrow, we get a honest press assessment of what we have today. Would anything be changed in Iraq? Would the support for GWB be any different than the 30% it is now? I for one think not.
Basically all Sanchez is doing is blaming the press for his own failures. Yes, I will buy the contention that the press is less than perfect or fair. But Sanchez has no one but himself to blame for his failures in Iraq. He had the options to do the things that led to success and instead did not. When Sanchez started getting critical press reports, he could have focused on what they were saying, instead he went into denial and we all see where that got us.
whats was really going on in Iraq. Because Sanchez ran his media sideshow in a biased manner, the press developed other sources.
Sanchez was also on the ground floor of the US occupation. He bears a disproportionate share of the blame for not seeing the negative trend lines and not being a strong enough advocate for changing the negative things he did see. And then blames the press when the press bias has only a tiny impact on public support.
The point being, the Iraq war started with damn near 90% public support. If there was any kind of apparent progress in Iraq, the press would be reporting it because they would have no choice. If anything the press was somewhat tardy in reporting the true picture in Iraq, and if anything, the press still is not as hard on this administration as they should be. The GWB administration is the entity that drives the news, if they come up with successes, it will be reported. If they come up with failures, it will be reported, and if they come up with nothing but pie in the sky political spin, pardon the press for labeling political spin for what it is.
We are now 4.5 years into an occupation, there has been every chance for GWB&co. to demonstrate progress, and today, at least in MHO, we are worse off than when we started. The Iraqi occupation has been spun every way imaginable by the press, politicians, and pundits. So there is bias, counter bias, and very little unspun truth. But when it comes to real progress, Sanchez had his chance to snatch continuing victory from the jaws of military victory, and instead lost the peace with his own ineptness. And the insurgency grew while Sanchez frittered the time away giving the Iraqi insurgencies the ability grow from an infant to a full grown entrenched monstrosity on his watch.
Let us try the following thought experiment. Suppose we had a 4.5 year total press blackout. And support at home for Iraq war was still that same 90%. And then tomorrow, we get a honest press assessment of what we have today. Would anything be changed in Iraq? Would the support for GWB be any different than the 30% it is now? I for one think not.
Basically all Sanchez is doing is blaming the press for his own failures. Yes, I will buy the contention that the press is less than perfect or fair. But Sanchez has no one but himself to blame for his failures in Iraq. He had the options to do the things that led to success and instead did not. When Sanchez started getting critical press reports, he could have focused on what they were saying, instead he went into denial and we all see where that got us.
CaptnKirk
Lifer
'EVIDENCE' ? What the hell are you saying?
Do you doubt that there are not some 'Phony Soldiers' that are posing as 'Real Men' ?
Christ - read their crap, and their time-line, they couldn't have been where they said they were at the time.
In a 'tech-school' somewhere sure as hell isn't 'deployed' - as in boots on the ground in a war zone.
Sitting in an office somewhere in Washington, or at home on weekends as a Guardsman blogging isn't quite like deployment.
While my son was actually in the theatre - two times, the blow hards were blithering about what they were doing while still here stateside.
'I'll be there next month' rattled off for almost three years was bullshit - my son went, returned, went again, then returned again,
and has since left again - this time to Korea after two Iraq tours.
I don't perceive any 'evidence' that they ever really 'got there' yet.
Few have the luxury to spend endless hours on the internet making comments about their being in a war zone 'if' they really were there.
They should be way too busy to attend to something as trivial to their safety and mission as bloging.
It looks to me that maybe the Defense Department is wasting assets if they are stationing active personell in government offices
with the purpose of monitoring websites, and for their agents to stir up the pot and decry anyone who objects to how things are going.
Sanchez, who retired in 2006, said it was his duty to obey orders and not object publicly when he was on active duty.
Maybe they (our 'bloggers') should learn from their superiors.
TastesLikeChicken
Lifer
The majority who now believes we shouldn't have invaded Iraq and that we will fail there are wrong. It's true because I proclaim it so. So what's your point exactly?
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