LS1 S2000, heh kinda silly.

[Demon-Xanth]

S2000 isn't a mid-engined car.

I believe it's in the "FMR" range, where the engine is behind the front wheels but in front of the driver. I could be wrong though.

2800lbs is porky? Compared to a Lotus Elise or a motorcycle maybe.

Porky enough that you're not going to totally ruin a car with 150LBs.

 

[JulesMaximus]

I believe it's in the "FMR" range, where the engine is behind the front wheels but in front of the driver. I could be wrong though.



Porky enough that you're not going to totally ruin a car with 150LBs.

The term "mid-engine" has usually been applied to cars having the engine located between the driver and the rear drive axles. Honda even calls the S2000 a front engined, RWD layout as do all the press releases and magazine articles I've seen written about the car.

 

[ponyo]

S2000 isn't a mid-engined car.

Only by definition.

 

[speedy2]

Yep F20c is about 350lbs fully dressed: http://www.sandsmuseum.com/cars/elise/thecar/engine/kingk.html

But you listed the dry weight of the LS1. Fully dressed it weighs nearly 500lbs.

Auto. - 457.6 lbs. (208 kg) (Flexplate)
Manual - 497.2 lbs (226 kg) (Pressure Plate and Fly Wheel)

http://www.funco-motorsports.com/v8_comparison.htm

Still pretty light, but no where near as light as the F20c.

Most V8 conversions gain 150-300lbs. Supporting hardware such as axles, diffs, subframes all add weight. The S2000 will still retain the handling balance since it will still be mid engined with the V8. I reckon some good suspension tuning will make a v8 S2000 feel similar to a 4cyl.

Hmm I've seen other weights by owners. Maybe they didn't have the stock cast iron exhaust manifolds? Who knows. Even still, if I was swapping to an S2000 I'd take those off anyway.

 

[alkemyst]

the 5.3L is a much better deal for most today...it can take most of the LSx parts line up and is much cheaper now everyone wants LS1 and LS2's.

HP is usually within 30hp of the 5.7.

I have been debating this for my 98 240SX.

 

[jlee]

..

 

[exar333]

2800lbs is porky? Compared to a Lotus Elise or a motorcycle maybe.

I agree. Porky these days is 3500+...

Not too many cars <3000lbs due to safety regulations and cost factors.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

I agree. Porky these days is 3500+...

Not too many cars <3000lbs due to safety regulations and cost factors.

People used to call the Gen 3 F-bodies big and heavy when they weighed in at 3500LBs. A 1970 Chevelle only weighs 3500LBs and people consider them massive.

...so yes, 2800LBs for a two seater compact sports car is porky.

 

[LordMorpheus]

The term "mid-engine" has usually been applied to cars having the engine located between the driver and the rear drive axles. Honda even calls the S2000 a front engined, RWD layout as do all the press releases and magazine articles I've seen written about the car.

I've seen the term front-mid thrown around quite a bit. Things like the Daytona Coupe are front engined, but the engine is actually pretty car behind the front wheels.

It's harder to pull off for a commercial car than rear-mid because you wind up with tiny little footwells that get ridiculously hot. You can make a rear-mid car as comfortable as an old caddy if you wanted to, not so much with front mid.

 

[jlee]

I've seen the term front-mid thrown around quite a bit. Things like the Daytona Coupe are front engined, but the engine is actually pretty car behind the front wheels.

It's harder to pull off for a commercial car than rear-mid because you wind up with tiny little footwells that get ridiculously hot. You can make a rear-mid car as comfortable as an old caddy if you wanted to, not so much with front mid.

Yeah that was news to me today, too...apparently a mid engined car is something with the engine located between the front and rear axles.

It makes sense, but it's also dumb. On the mid engined cars I've had, there's been a front and rear trunk...with an engine in the middle. Toyota had to screw that up and make the Spyder, which has no trunk..but oh well.

 

[alkemyst]

People used to call the Gen 3 F-bodies big and heavy when they weighed in at 3500LBs. A 1970 Chevelle only weighs 3500LBs and people consider them massive.

...so yes, 2800LBs for a two seater compact sports car is porky.

porky?...my 240SX is pretty lightweight fully loaded at 2750lbs.

Which cars did you have in mind that would fit the light weight bill?

 

[KDKPSJ]

Yeah that was news to me today, too...apparently a mid engined car is something with the engine located between the front and rear axles.

It makes sense, but it's also dumb. On the mid engined cars I've had, there's been a front and rear trunk...with an engine in the middle. Toyota had to screw that up and make the Spyder, which has no trunk..but oh well.

Well, that's why mid-engines are now classified more specifically than before: FMR, RMR, etc. It's all about the center of the mass, not actual location of the engine anymore. As we all know, we only used the term midship/mid-engine to RMR/RM4 before.

From S2000, Nissan Z/GT-R, RX-8 to Viper, Aston Martin's, SLR McLaren, they are all classified as FMR/FM4, which is midship/mid-engine.

 

[JulesMaximus]

People used to call the Gen 3 F-bodies big and heavy when they weighed in at 3500LBs. A 1970 Chevelle only weighs 3500LBs and people consider them massive.

...so yes, 2800LBs for a two seater compact sports car is porky.

It depends on how much bondo is in it.

 

[punjabiplaya]

http://www.motortrend.com/features/performance/1010_2011_iconic_ac_roadster/index.html

~2400 lbs

 

[zerocool84]

An S2K is 2800lbs??? Damn that's a lot for such a small car.

 

[alkemyst]

An S2K is 2800lbs??? Damn that's a lot for such a small car.

A Neon SRT-4 is right under 2900lbs.

What is a light car to you? Not weight-wise, but which model?

 

[alkemyst]

http://www.motortrend.com/features/performance/1010_2011_iconic_ac_roadster/index.html

~2400 lbs

No top is offered.

 

[zerocool84]

A Neon SRT-4 is right under 2900lbs.

What is a light car to you? Not weight-wise, but which model?

Well a Neon is 4dr with a ton more room and a larger iron block engine. It's a small roadster. Doesn't seem like it should weight that much cus it's so tiny.

 

[Throckmorton]

An S2K is 2800lbs??? Damn that's a lot for such a small car.

It's not that small a car. A Miata weighs 2400lb.

 

[alkemyst]

It's not that small a car. A Miata weighs 2400lb.

First gens and the super lights were closer to 2000lbs even.

still it's a fucking miata. May as well wear a clown suit or shiner's garb driving one of those.

 

[exdeath]

As for being overly obsessive about weight, to quote a comment someone made eons ago on this forum, not everybody want's a motorcycle disguised as a car. I don't care that your 2,000 lb car only needs 150 HP to do 0-60 in 4 seconds, I'll take my 3,600 lb pig that can spank your 2,000 lb 150 HP ultra light at the stop light, and then raise you AC, power everything, stereo system, comfy seats, windows, a top, a rear seat, and all the rest of the things you had to take out to "increase" your performance. Have you ever seen those gutted out N/A Hondas? It's pretty ridiculous for a street car, pretty much destroy the car and are being baked in the summer with their head next to the bare metal roof all so they can run 12s.

I'll preempt the argument that "well you can also put 600 HP in that 2,000 lb car and it will be faster than 600 HP in your 3600 lb car" with "I can also put twin turbos on my car and with 1200 HP without much weight increase because it already has the iron block and drive line to handle it" and "I can put a top fuel engine in a shopping cart and be faster than both combined".

It's one thing to fight obesity, but it's equally repulsive to be anorexic and bulimic. There is a happy medium in a street car. Yes a STREET CAR not a STREET LEGAL race car. I'd say 3000-3600 is acceptable for a normally equipped daily driven street car. 2800 lbs is light in my book. If you think that's heavy, you need to be driving a motorcycle and just give up on cars.

People who dream of daily driving a race car on the street have never actually driven any kind of high performance car in their life. It gets old fast. Just ask Jules if he would take a Elise as his only car and drive it every single day. I doubt it.

Leave it to AT Garage to not be satisfied with and find fault in a 400+ HP V8 fully optioned and equipped full interior and aesthetically pleasing full street trim S2000 that only weighs 2800 lbs.

Nothing wrong with *some* basics and modern conveniences on a street car like power door locks, driver and passenger side air bags, maybe even a power driver seat. It's when you start adding 5 TV screens, back up cameras, home theaters, heated seats, spas, and then adding side, above, under, behind, inside, and outside triple air bags, etc, and 26" wheels from the factory that you start going overboard with obesity.

 

[speedy2]

Have you ever seen those gutted out N/A Hondas? It's pretty ridiculous for a street car, pretty much destroy the car and are being baked in the summer with their head next to the bare metal roof all so they can run 15s.

Fixed. lol. When I lived in San Diego I used to go to the track that they have in Qualcomm parking lot. It was an eighth mile though. I had a '98 Seville STS. Full weight.(3972lbs) Not one thing taken out of the car. BONE STOCK With a wet starting line from ricers doing burnouts with street tires, I could run a 9.9 consistently, 9.6 best. Most of the cars there were imports. Mostly stock or pointless mods. Gutted, and they were either keeping up with me, or beating me off the line....and then I would still reel them in...IN THE 1/8 MILE! lol So hilarious.

 

[alkemyst]

meanwhile you dudes never get on it on the street.

lolz.

 

[exdeath]

meanwhile you dudes never get on it on the street.

lolz.

I don't? That's news to me.

 

[punjabiplaya]

As for being overly obsessive about weight, to quote a comment someone made eons ago on this forum, not everybody want's a motorcycle disguised as a car. I don't care that your 2,000 lb car only needs 150 HP to do 0-60 in 4 seconds, I'll take my 3,600 lb pig that can spank your 2,000 lb 150 HP ultra light at the stop light, and then raise you AC, power everything, stereo system, comfy seats, windows, a top, a rear seat, and all the rest of the things you had to take out to "increase" your performance. Have you ever seen those gutted out N/A Hondas? It's pretty ridiculous for a street car, pretty much destroy the car and are being baked in the summer with their head next to the bare metal roof all so they can run 12s.

I'll preempt the argument that "well you can also put 600 HP in that 2,000 lb car and it will be faster than 600 HP in your 3600 lb car" with "I can also put twin turbos on my car and with 1200 HP without much weight increase because it already has the iron block and drive line to handle it" and "I can put a top fuel engine in a shopping cart and be faster than both combined".

It's one thing to fight obesity, but it's equally repulsive to be anorexic and bulimic. There is a happy medium in a street car. Yes a STREET CAR not a STREET LEGAL race car. I'd say 3000-3600 is acceptable for a normally equipped daily driven street car. 2800 lbs is light in my book. If you think that's heavy, you need to be driving a motorcycle and just give up on cars.

People who dream of daily driving a race car on the street have never actually driven any kind of high performance car in their life. It gets old fast. Just ask Jules if he would take a Elise as his only car and drive it every single day. I doubt it.

Leave it to AT Garage to not be satisfied with and find fault in a 400+ HP V8 fully optioned and equipped full interior and aesthetically pleasing full street trim S2000 that only weighs 2800 lbs.

Nothing wrong with *some* basics and modern conveniences on a street car like power door locks, driver and passenger side air bags, maybe even a power driver seat. It's when you start adding 5 TV screens, back up cameras, home theaters, heated seats, spas, and then adding side, above, under, behind, inside, and outside triple air bags, etc, and 26" wheels from the factory that you start going overboard with obesity.

Most of those people want a car that's 2200 lbs but then complain that the ride is too harsh when their bones are turned to dust. I do feel modern cars are too heavy, but I'm not expecting a Camaro SS to be 2600 lbs, more like 3500-ish. 3800-3900 is just too damn much.

I don't know if anyone every played (iirc) Interstate '76 where you could do all sorts of crazy shit like drop a McLaren F1's engine in a Miata. Hilarity ensued.