Looks like you don't get to own your games anymore.

[wanderer27]

I guess it was only a matter time:

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/09/first-sale-doctrine/

No more re-sale rights.

Seems you buy it you own - doesn't really matter if you accept the EULA or not.


Do we have a terrific Legal system or what ?

 

[Arkaign]

It's inevitable but regrettable. Physical media is doomed. I don't even like Steam, and am at a crossroads of sorts as it seems that Fallout New Vegas is a Steam thing. Bleh.

 

[Dankk]

It's inevitable but regrettable. Physical media is doomed. I don't even like Steam, and am at a crossroads of sorts as it seems that Fallout New Vegas is a Steam thing. Bleh.

With all of the Steam games I own that are unfinished, I take comfort in the fact that they are mine *forever* and I'll never have to worry about losing a disc to revisit them. Instead, I can just log in from any computer, download, and play.

Just a thought. This is just for video games though, with music and movies I might feel different.

 

[Terzo]

This is only for the 9th circuit though, right? I'm not clear on our laws; does this mean people in those states can (if there is no successful appeal) not legally sell their used media? Does it mean anything for the rest of us living outside the jurisdiction of the 9th circuit? I'm assuming this will only apply in cases where the user agreement states resale is forbidden?

As for the issue itself; if this becomes a standard practice then I'll stop buying games. I don't spend much on them to begin with so I doubt I'll be missed, but I can easily get my entertainment elsewhere.

 

[mundane]

..

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

This seems kind of dumb; other industries, like automobile, clothing, etc have to deal with people reselling their products; indeed, for Toyota it's even a marketing point, that their products are so good that people can still resell them a decade after purchase for a reasonable price. Obviously the deal is different with games, since they don't really depreciate and degrade to the same extent, but still, forbidding the resale of licenses is dumb.

If it were music or movies, or whatever other digital entertainment, I could kind of understand, since they can be easily copied and sold on, but games...?

 

[wanderer27]

With all of the Steam games I own that are unfinished, I take comfort in the fact that they are mine *forever* and I'll never have to worry about losing a disc to revisit them. Instead, I can just log in from any computer, download, and play.

Just a thought. This is just for video games though, with music and movies I might feel different.

It's actually worse than you realize:

“The terms of the software license in the case are not very different from the terms of most software licensing. So I think it’s safe to say that most people don’t own their software,” said Greg Beck, the defense attorney in the case who represented an eBay seller sued by Autodesk. “The other ramification, there is no reason a similar license could not be put into the cover of a book. It wouldn’t be difficult for everybody to implement this.”

and this:

The American Library Association and eBay argued against the outcome. The library association said it feared that the software industry’s licensing practices could be adopted by other copyright owners, including book publishers, record labels and movie studios.

I saw somewhere that the ruling was urged by several large Software companies, the RIAA, and the MPAA - so you know what's coming.

 

[Bill Brasky]

Lets say I buy a Dell laptop, use it for a year and then decide to sell it. If I wipe the hard drive and re-install the original OS, it would be illegal to sell due to this ruling?

 

[wanderer27]

Lets say I buy a Dell laptop, use it for a year and then decide to sell it. If I wipe the hard drive and re-install the original OS, it would be illegal to sell due to this ruling?

Good question - seems to be a common point.

As far as jurisdiction, I'm not a Lawyer, but since this Federal Court has set a precedent, I imagine it would be adopted by the others across the country.

 

[mmntech]

Copyright needs severe reforms to curb the anti-consumer and anti-competitive practises going on. There's two kinds of piracy going on here, and both are as bad as each other. We also need to ban corporations and organizations from donating to political campaigns. That would put the breaks on this BS PDQ.

 

[Ross Ridge]

With all of the Steam games I own that are unfinished, I take comfort in the fact that they are mine *forever* and I'll never have to worry about losing a disc to revisit them. Instead, I can just log in from any computer, download, and play.

Except that they aren't yours forever. According Steam's terms, they can cancel your subscriptions at any time and for any reason. This ruling means that it's that much more likely that legally they can get away with it.

 

[Jumpem]

Fine by me. Most all software is sold by license.

 

[Ross Ridge]

Lets say I buy a Dell laptop, use it for a year and then decide to sell it. If I wipe the hard drive and re-install the original OS, it would be illegal to sell due to this ruling?

Yes, the Windows EULA allows this. If it didn't, or maybe if Dell imposed additional terms, then it would be illegal (at least in the 9th Circuit). What you can't do, and what you couldn't do even before this ruling, would be to unbundle the OEM copy of Windows and sell it seperately from the laptop.

 

[shortylickens]

No longer matters to me.
I just got fucked over with Wings of Prey. And Starcraft 2 was fun but its not really a new game and sure as hell wasnt worth 60 bucks.

I dont think I'll be buying games ever again. Which means I really dont need Windows. So from now on its Linux and open source software for me. Good luck to everyone else in this mad world of customer butt-fucking. Maybe one day many years from now, things will turn around and be good again.

 

[MrWizzard]

That's fine I never sell my software anyways I give it away.... however I do include a $50 paperclip.

 

[Dankk]

It's actually worse than you realize:

<snip>

I saw somewhere that the ruling was urged by several large Software companies, the RIAA, and the MPAA - so you know what's coming.

Right, and that's why I preemptively stated that I feel this way specifically about video games and not other forms of entertainment.

 

[PhatoseAlpha]

Well, if you own Gamestop stock, time to sell is now.

As for books....suspect they're still gonna be first sale. The passive nature of books doesn't make for a medium where they can require you to sign the contract, digitally or otherwise, for use. Music...harder, but doable.

Blu-rays will end up with boot EULAs, likely.

 

[Inspector Jihad]

Except that they aren't yours forever. According Steam's terms, they can cancel your subscriptions at any time and for any reason. This ruling means that it's that much more likely that legally they can get away with it.

they can, but will they and if so, why would they do it? i can come over and kick you in the dick, but will I and for what reason?

 

[lupi]

sounds stupid and something that would in no way not be overturned..why not simply extend this to being unable to resale something like, a car except to an authrozied dealer.

 

[Terzo]

they can, but will they and if so, why would they do it? i can come over and kick you in the dick, but will I and for what reason?

If you randomly kicked a person in the dick I bet they could press battery charges against you. Theoretically, Steam would have no legal repercussions for their action.

That being said, I agree that it is very unlikely for Steam to cancel someone's account without any reason.

 

[Terzo]

No longer matters to me.
I just got fucked over with Wings of Prey. And Starcraft 2 was fun but its not really a new game and sure as hell wasnt worth 60 bucks.

I dont think I'll be buying games ever again. Which means I really dont need Windows. So from now on its Linux and open source software for me. Good luck to everyone else in this mad world of customer butt-fucking. Maybe one day many years from now, things will turn around and be good again.

I used to run only linux but I got the urge to play some games again. Bought a copy of windows and an ssd, and have been running linux in a vmware session on windows ever since. I don't have to deal with WINE or dual booting, and I can use windows for flash (flash has never worked well for me in linux).

Still, I don't spend much on games. The newest pc game I've purchased is The Witcher, which I got a few months ago. I find it helps to stay a few years behind the times. My hardware runs games just fine, and I have the benefit of time to see which games were great (and worth buying) and which were crap. Not to mention that prices are much lower, so I don't need to spend more than $20 (on boxed copies mind you). Then again, I'm pretty sure you've been gaming longer than I so I'm not sure if there are many "great" games you haven't played.

 

[Ross Ridge]

they can, but will they and if so, why would they do it?

Because eventually Valve will decide that they don't want to support a bunch old crappy games that only a bunch of freeloaders are still playing. Or they'll decide that they can make more money renting out the games by the month, and that they can make even more by applying to games they've already sold. Maybe they'll lose the rights to some games and they'll be forced to cancel subscriptions. They could go bankrupt, or just decide to shutdown the Steam service because it's no longer profitable. There are lots of reasons why. Forever is a long time.

The Steam subscription model doesn't mitigate in any way the 9th US Circuit Court of Appeal deciding that you don't own the software you paid for.

 

[BlueWeasel]

If Steam were to do that (and it's highly unlikely), then I'd switch to perpetual offline mode, never update my Steam client, and play all my games, legal or not.

I'd never buy another game from them again and they could go to hell.

 

[shortylickens]

I used to run only linux but I got the urge to play some games again. Bought a copy of windows and an ssd, and have been running linux in a vmware session on windows ever since. I don't have to deal with WINE or dual booting, and I can use windows for flash (flash has never worked well for me in linux).

Still, I don't spend much on games. The newest pc game I've purchased is The Witcher, which I got a few months ago. I find it helps to stay a few years behind the times. My hardware runs games just fine, and I have the benefit of time to see which games were great (and worth buying) and which were crap. Not to mention that prices are much lower, so I don't need to spend more than $20 (on boxed copies mind you). Then again, I'm pretty sure you've been gaming longer than I so I'm not sure if there are many "great" games you haven't played.

I've been gaming since the DOS 4 days. Started with BASIC stuff, like gorillas and nibbles. First real game that I could get working was Elvira II. Played through all the classics like Doom and such. Am finding lately that the magic is gone and I'm just grinding through the same old crap. I need to move on. Probably means a wife and kids.

I sincerely hope other people can find entertainment and maybe even joy from PC gaming, but for me its been dead for a short while. And since Deus Ex 3 looks lame, there is nothing to keep me enthused.

 

[Bateluer]

I dont think I'll be buying games ever again. Which means I really dont need Windows. So from now on its Linux and open source software for me. Good luck to everyone else in this mad world of customer butt-fucking. Maybe one day many years from now, things will turn around and be good again.

Been heading that way for a while now.