Looks like Mt. Gox is dead...

[randay]

oh no, a bunch of fake money is gone. boo-fucking-hoo.

 

[ultimatebob]

The sad thing is that the Mt Gox crash is that some US Senators are now publicly talking about banning it, saying that the currency is "unsafe" due to it's lack of regulation.

That threat will likely have a bigger long term impact to Bitcoin's future than the loss of some poorly managed currency site would.

 

[ImpulsE69]

The sad thing is that the Mt Gox crash is that some US Senators are now publicly talking about banning it, saying that the currency is "unsafe" due to it's lack of regulation.

That threat will likely have a bigger long term impact to Bitcoin's future than the loss of some poorly managed currency site would.

True, because our government loves to go after things in the name of "safety" when they could be doing more important things.

We can add funding the War On Bitcoin to the War on Drugs, The War on Terrorism, The War on Freedom...etc.etc

 

[JumBie]

This is the biggest scam to ever exist.

A guy literally created a currency out of thin air, and everyone is mining something that never existed. Now hes rich, because him and early adopters, took this fake currency, sold it to people who wanted to purchase it thinking that it was worth something.

Owner Creates Bitcoins - Holds on to his own fake currency
Person A Mines and gets a bitcoin
Person B buys person A's coin for real money.
Person A has cash.
Owner sells his coins for cash
Person B stuck with a fake currency unless he can offload it to Person C

All this is, is a stupid economy of people buying and selling something that is essentially worthless, but has been given a value by its community.

Only way this would or could succeed is if the wealthy bankers found a way to monetize this. If they don't they can shut this down in no time, there is literally nothing the people can do to stop this coin from vanishing, this is all up to those who hold the power.

 

[JumBie]

All currencies are supported by the economies that use them for trade. Exchange of goods and services. If the US didn't produce anything, the USD would be worthless no matter how big or army was. People have to want your currency ultimately for what they buy with it.

Bitcoin was rarely talked about as a way to buy things. Anytime I saw people talking about Bitcoin, they weren't talking about the things they'd spend it on. They'd talk about how much it was worth in a currency that people actually wanted, USD. If there was subset of society that actually produced desired goods and services, being able to buy food, clothing, and other things with bitcoin and relatively stable pricing, that's all that's required to make it a viable currency. But it had none of that.

The US technically doesn't produce anything. Their economy is faker than bitcoins. The only reason the US dollar exist is to trade oil, thats it.

 

[LegendKiller]

While you're right about bitcoin, how can you turn this into one of your idiotic cookie-cutter libertopian rants? There's zero connection here.

Ohh come on, you know the correlation coefficient between Bitcoin users and their libertopian views is like 0.99. I'll give you the 0.01 for drug dealers.

The whole thing is a "free market" bullshit libertopians lovers wet dream. Even Ron Paul came out in favor of it saying it could destroy the dollar. They love the thought of some non-governmental currency killing the dollar since the Fed is evil and anything that smacks of the government is horrible.

You can't possibly see no connection unless you are as stupid as they are.

Now the bitches are crying for the FBI to investigate. The FBI should tell them to fuck off and resolve it the way they bought it, through the internet. Let them enforce their "personal property rights" that way. After all, it's why they want to get rid of the government and say they don't need things like the FDA and EPA, because they can enforce "personal property rights".

The whole thing is a massive joke and I am laughing my ass off.

 

[LegendKiller]

The US technically doesn't produce anything. Their economy is faker than bitcoins. The only reason the US dollar exist is to trade oil, thats it.

Yeah, OK.

 

[Newbian]

Yeah, OK.

And the sad thing is our money is made out of 40% oil. :biggrin:

 

[Imp]

And the sad thing is our money is made out of 40% oil. :biggrin:

Pussies... Newer Canadian money is 99% since it's plastic.

 

[JumBie]

Yeah, OK.

You must be new.

Remember when gold stopped backing the US dollar? And their dollar was at risk of falling under. Well that's when the US came up with the smart idea to go to the Saudis and make them agree to selling all oil in US currency and receive weapons and protection in exchange. Remember OPEC? the guys who export oil and started the embargo on western countries. Well the US made those guys sign the deal too.

The American dollar was founded on oil, and is based on oil prices. They are able to accumulate copious amounts of debt and still remain safe because they have the petrodollar, and because all nations need to maintain US currency, in order to trade. Take a look at the recent issues in the middle east to find more evidence as to how your dollar works.

Remember that war on terror? Why did the US invade Iraq when it was Afghanistan they were after? Oh! Because Saddam was colluding with Gaddafi to create the Dinar, a petro-currency that was going to overthrow the US dollar and become the main currency to trading oil. Well that explains why they killed Saddam and Gaddafi and put a pro-US government in place.

Oh and this "nuclear" problem they got with Tehran...you guessed it, a false flag for them to start a war and put a pro-US government in place. Why? Because Iran created the Iran Oil Bourse where they trade oil in Euros. Guess what America doesn't like that, because when people stop trading in US dollars their economy goes to 0.

Sorry, but even the mainstream news spills the beans for you no need to delve in conspiracy theories.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Now the bitches are crying for the FBI to investigate. The FBI should tell them to fuck off and resolve it the way they bought it, through the internet. Let them enforce their "personal property rights" that way. After all, it's why they want to get rid of the government and say they don't need things like the FDA and EPA, because they can enforce "personal property rights".

I actually agree with this.

 

[Printer Bandit]

You must be new.

Remember when gold stopped backing the US dollar? And their dollar was at risk of falling under. Well that's when the US came up with the smart idea to go to the Saudis and make them agree to selling all oil in US currency and receive weapons and protection in exchange. Remember OPEC? the guys who export oil and started the embargo on western countries. Well the US made those guys sign the deal too.

The American dollar was founded on oil, and is based on oil prices. They are able to accumulate copious amounts of debt and still remain safe because they have the petrodollar, and because all nations need to maintain US currency, in order to trade. Take a look at the recent issues in the middle east to find more evidence as to how your dollar works.

Remember that war on terror? Why did the US invade Iraq when it was Afghanistan they were after? Oh! Because Saddam was colluding with Gaddafi to create the Dinar, a petro-currency that was going to overthrow the US dollar and become the main currency to trading oil. Well that explains why they killed Saddam and Gaddafi and put a pro-US government in place.

Oh and this "nuclear" problem they got with Tehran...you guessed it, a false flag for them to start a war and put a pro-US government in place. Why? Because Iran created the Iran Oil Bourse where they trade oil in Euros. Guess what America doesn't like that, because when people stop trading in US dollars their economy goes to 0.

Sorry, but even the mainstream news spills the beans for you no need to delve in conspiracy theories.

 

[mizzou]

The US technically doesn't produce anything. Their economy is faker than bitcoins. The only reason the US dollar exist is to trade oil, thats it.

wow...... hahahah.

Dude, you been drinkin the juice!

America produces all kinds of shit. The ONLY reason US dollar exists is to trade fucking oil? How delusional are you!

Or possibly I didn't catch the sarcasm

Honestly, I think the western world needs their own currency. The Euro seems to have stayed very consistent vs. the dollar. With all the doom & gloom they thought that was going to create, it probably made the situation better.

 

[LegendKiller]

You must be new.

Spew of utter trash mixed with conspiracy theories backed by BitCoins (aka, nothing)

You do realize that oil is bought and sold in Euros, Rubles, Yuan and all other currencies and that the USD is only a quoting price?

The demand for the dollar is not set by the demand for oil, people mistake that for the fact that petrodollars exist because we imported oil for dollars, we bought a good for dollars and exported those dollars out. They haven't come back, which is why they are called petrodollars, and are typically held as foreign currency reserves. This is the same as goods we buy from China, we just haven't come up with a catchy name for them. The currency will have to come back at some point, which will either suppress the dollar or raise asset values in this country through investments. Right now they are held in treasuries, mainly because the biggest GoodsDollars holders don't want to sink their own economies by hurting the dollar too much.

You must be new to the macro-economics area. If you don't believe me, you can read Mish.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/02/us-dollar-about-to-lose-reserve.html

But of course, continue on your conspiracy laden psychotic foolishness. Ignore logic and cling to your currency that doesn't have a single thing backing it. Personally, I'll stick to the currency that has 11 supercarriers, a massive nuclear arsenal, the biggest portfolio of IP, tech companies, manufacturing companies, airplane producers, drug companies...etc.

But you guys have...GEEKS. FUCK YEAH, GEEKS WHO POP AS MANY PIMPLES AS THEY DO HOT POCKETS AND HATE THE GOVERNMENT. WAKE UP AND RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE! ARGGHGHGHHGHGH! Mom, I need more hotpockets!

 

[mizzou]

This is the biggest scam to ever exist.

A guy literally created a currency out of thin air, and everyone is mining something that never existed. Now hes rich, because him and early adopters, took this fake currency, sold it to people who wanted to purchase it thinking that it was worth something.

Owner Creates Bitcoins - Holds on to his own fake currency
Person A Mines and gets a bitcoin
Person B buys person A's coin for real money.
Person A has cash.
Owner sells his coins for cash
Person B stuck with a fake currency unless he can offload it to Person C

All this is, is a stupid economy of people buying and selling something that is essentially worthless, but has been given a value by its community.

Only way this would or could succeed is if the wealthy bankers found a way to monetize this. If they don't they can shut this down in no time, there is literally nothing the people can do to stop this coin from vanishing, this is all up to those who hold the power.

Yup, very valid points.

You seem to have two kinds of bitcoin people.

#1 was on board a long time ago, they like the concept and theory of cryptocurrency. When their holdings jacked up in price 1000%, they were happy for the ride.

#2 wants to make a quick buck, and they tote the success of cryptocurrency and attempt to show you how it is a "valid" currency.

 

[BoberFett]

Ohh come on, you know the correlation coefficient between Bitcoin users and their libertopian views is like 0.99. I'll give you the 0.01 for drug dealers.

The whole thing is a "free market" bullshit libertopians lovers wet dream. Even Ron Paul came out in favor of it saying it could destroy the dollar. They love the thought of some non-governmental currency killing the dollar since the Fed is evil and anything that smacks of the government is horrible.

You can't possibly see no connection unless you are as stupid as they are.

Now the bitches are crying for the FBI to investigate. The FBI should tell them to fuck off and resolve it the way they bought it, through the internet. Let them enforce their "personal property rights" that way. After all, it's why they want to get rid of the government and say they don't need things like the FDA and EPA, because they can enforce "personal property rights".

The whole thing is a massive joke and I am laughing my ass off.

I had a longer response, but I deleted it because I tire of your red-faced ratns. As you are someone who works in an industry that bends the American taxpayer over and fucks them sans lube as you simultaneously empty their wallets as your industry cries for deregulation while also begging for bailouts, I simply say: Get bent, asshole. You and your cohorts make libertarians look like saints.

 

[KlokWyze]

Yup, very valid points.

You seem to have two kinds of bitcoin people.

#1 was on board a long time ago, they like the concept and theory of cryptocurrency. When their holdings jacked up in price 1000%, they were happy for the ride.

#2 wants to make a quick buck, and they tote the success of cryptocurrency and attempt to show you how it is a "valid" currency.

Yup. I have enjoyed the ride and understand BTC and all it's off shoots for what they are. I don't want to prematurely write them off as "not currency", which they mostly are NOT. BTC is the closest thing actually to a currenct because it IS actually used by quite a few outlets, but it's value is determined purely by speculation/gambling. All the off shoots (scrypt & the newer coins) are valued purely by speculation against the value of BTC.

Now, it's funny, because a coin like DOGE would actually make a much better currency than BTC. A lot of properties built into these coins are exclusive to the crpyto world (like protecting the coin against ASICs), but they are quite interesting and will likely turn out to influence future world currencies to a heavy degree. I'm not saying it's certain and I am no zealot, but a lot of the ideas and functions of some of these coins are likely going to be used well into the future even IF BTC dies in 2014. Which it won't.

The thing that gets me is the outright hate and disgust with it. It screams bitterness. It's like a crybaby crotchety old man who bitches, whines and moans because he doesn't get CHANGE. Get over it you sad boring fucks. Or not. I'm having a good time mining and trading and making money off it. Also, this is a TECH forum. Even if you hate the economic philosophy side of it, the crypto world is like wild west of tech. How the fuck can you not like that and call yourself a geek? GTFO of here noobs.

:biggrin:

 

[OVerLoRDI]

Guys,

I'm finally feeling better.

Thanks

 

[JumBie]

You do realize that oil is bought and sold in Euros, Rubles, Yuan and all other currencies and that the USD is only a quoting price?

The demand for the dollar is not set by the demand for oil, people mistake that for the fact that petrodollars exist because we imported oil for dollars, we bought a good for dollars and exported those dollars out. They haven't come back, which is why they are called petrodollars, and are typically held as foreign currency reserves. This is the same as goods we buy from China, we just haven't come up with a catchy name for them. The currency will have to come back at some point, which will either suppress the dollar or raise asset values in this country through investments. Right now they are held in treasuries, mainly because the biggest GoodsDollars holders don't want to sink their own economies by hurting the dollar too much.

You must be new to the macro-economics area. If you don't believe me, you can read Mish.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/02/us-dollar-about-to-lose-reserve.html

But of course, continue on your conspiracy laden psychotic foolishness. Ignore logic and cling to your currency that doesn't have a single thing backing it. Personally, I'll stick to the currency that has 11 supercarriers, a massive nuclear arsenal, the biggest portfolio of IP, tech companies, manufacturing companies, airplane producers, drug companies...etc.

But you guys have...GEEKS. FUCK YEAH, GEEKS WHO POP AS MANY PIMPLES AS THEY DO HOT POCKETS AND HATE THE GOVERNMENT. WAKE UP AND RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE! ARGGHGHGHHGHGH! Mom, I need more hotpockets!

Sorry but for someone who claims to know so much you know so little.

All members of OPEC were trading in USD, hence the reason all countries who wanted to purchase oil needed to have a Reserve of USD. The only country that broke away from that agreement was IRAQ, who in 2000 announced they were going to be trading in EUROS.

Since then Iran announced that it was opening the Iranian Oil Bourse, this is where your information of different currency trading came from. If you had read what I said and done some research you might not have looked so foolish. Once this opened countries started buying oil in their own currencies.

Recently, China has opened its self up to allow other countries to hold a reserve of Yuan to use for trade. Russia signed an agreement with China to supply them with oil. Russia also signed a deal with Iran to provide them with goods in exchange for oil. Do you see where this is going?

The US is now struggling because other nations don't have to have as big of a reserve of USD as they did before, because now they can trade with Iran in different currencies.

Your understanding of economics, and world news in general is completely lacking. Sorry, but I even wrote it out in simple English, a child in elementary school could understand this.

EDIT: I forgot to address how the petrodollar does in fact return to the US. (got caught up)

Those oil countries who receive all the money from sales have too big of a reserve so they invest it back into the US economy through banks, who loan out the money to other countries. A loan! So they make interest back on the dollar.

 

[LegendKiller]

Sorry but for someone who claims to know so much you know so little.

All members of OPEC were trading in USD, hence the reason all countries who wanted to purchase oil needed to have a Reserve of USD. The only country that broke away from that agreement was IRAQ, who in 2000 announced they were going to be trading in EUROS.

Since then Iran announced that it was opening the Iranian Oil Bourse, this is where your information of different currency trading came from. If you had read what I said and done some research you might not have looked so foolish. Once this opened countries started buying oil in their own currencies.

Recently, China has opened its self up to allow other countries to hold a reserve of Yuan to use for trade. Russia signed an agreement with China to supply them with oil. Russia also signed a deal with Iran to provide them with goods in exchange for oil. Do you see where this is going?

The US is now struggling because other nations don't have to have as big of a reserve of USD as they did before, because now they can trade with Iran in different currencies.

Your understanding of economics, and world news in general is completely lacking. Sorry, but I even wrote it out in simple English, a child in elementary school could understand this.

EDIT: I forgot to address how the petrodollar does in fact return to the US. (got caught up)

Those oil countries who receive all the money from sales have too big of a reserve so they invest it back into the US economy through banks, who loan out the money to other countries. A loan! So they make interest back on the dollar.

LOL, you may say I know less but you are nothing more than a parrot of doom and gloom petrodollar demise websites and articles. Mish, who isn't that huge of a fan of the USD anyway, has written numerous articles on this and I happen to agree with him.

Again, it doesn't matter where/how oil is traded since it has always been traded in something other than dollars. *EVERYBODY* has accepted something other than dollars for oil forever, as Mish explained, and for which is reality. BTW, I never disagreed that the US made an agreement.

Other nations have massive dollar reserves which are pretty much ever increasing, mostly in the form of US Treasuries. The cause of those is not oil, but goods, which I explained.

The fact remains is that the USD will remain the world reserve currency for the foreseeable future. Why? Because there is no other replacement currency available and we are still the biggest economy. Unless the Yuan fully floats it will never be a reserve currency, no matter how much oil it buys, and it cannot float now because it would crush China's economy. The Euro is too fractured.

The US is struggling because it is a mature economy that has shipped most of its jobs overseas. Almost all mature economies are struggling. Hell, the world is struggling and China's only doing as well as it is because it is a Potemkin country.

 

[LegendKiller]

I had a longer response, but I deleted it because I tire of your red-faced ratns. As you are someone who works in an industry that bends the American taxpayer over and fucks them sans lube as you simultaneously empty their wallets as your industry cries for deregulation while also begging for bailouts, I simply say: Get bent, asshole. You and your cohorts make libertarians look like saints.

Sorry, but I ask for more regulation and don't like the bailouts, but they were a necessary evil at the time,.

Libertopians aren't saints, they are naive fools who want everything. They want "free markets" and "personal property rights" but they also want to be bailed out themselves. Why? Because they are selfish fucks who can't realize their own fallibility which is the entire reason why libertopianism can never succeed, because humans are greedy and fallible. Libertopianism ignores that and simply tries to slip past it by claiming "personal property rights". The hypocrisy is amusing.

You can try to get around it also but it doesn't work.

 

[BikeJunkie]

If I pour $100 into a bitcoin and it's suddenly worth $1000, where did that other $900 come from? There's zero assets supporting that. Meaning that I can't actually convert my new found wealth into cash, because that money doesn't actually exist anywhere. The exchange only has my original $100. Nor can a store convert my bitcoin into cash if I spend it. You can't create value out of thin air. That's not how money works.

That's not how money works, that's how stock works.

Though I've had a passing interest in bitcoin (I like to read about it while on the throne), I've stayed away from it financially. So my meanderings on the subject are just me trying to reconcile what I know about BTC with what I know about economics.

That said, I imagine the other $900 comes from some other party's desire to purchase your BTC (that you originally purchased for $100). In other words, it's not a currency, but a stock on a very narrowly defined exchange.

If I buy $100 worth of Facebook and it's suddenly worth $1000, where did the other $900 come from?

Demand for my stock, presumably.

So the question is, how accurate are the day-to-day quotes for BTC? Are they being propped up artificially, or is there legitimate demand causing the value (aka what someone is willing to pay) of your original BTC to increase 10 fold?

 

[BikeJunkie]

I'm finding the continued support of bitcoin by the zealots extremely pathetic and scary in a way. They really are like the MLM freaks.

Kinda like? That's precisely what they are. These virtual currencies are textbook examples of MLM hijinx. That's why we keep seeing so many copycats. People didn't get in at the ground floor for BTC, so they start a new one up and try to build their own pyramid from there.

So it's not surprising to see the same sort of brainwashed baffoonery that we see with Amway and the like.

 

[halik]

You must be new.

Remember when gold stopped backing the US dollar? And their dollar was at risk of falling under. Well that's when the US came up with the smart idea to go to the Saudis and make them agree to selling all oil in US currency and receive weapons and protection in exchange. Remember OPEC? the guys who export oil and started the embargo on western countries. Well the US made those guys sign the deal too.

The American dollar was founded on oil, and is based on oil prices. They are able to accumulate copious amounts of debt and still remain safe because they have the petrodollar, and because all nations need to maintain US currency, in order to trade. Take a look at the recent issues in the middle east to find more evidence as to how your dollar works.

Remember that war on terror? Why did the US invade Iraq when it was Afghanistan they were after? Oh! Because Saddam was colluding with Gaddafi to create the Dinar, a petro-currency that was going to overthrow the US dollar and become the main currency to trading oil. Well that explains why they killed Saddam and Gaddafi and put a pro-US government in place.

Oh and this "nuclear" problem they got with Tehran...you guessed it, a false flag for them to start a war and put a pro-US government in place. Why? Because Iran created the Iran Oil Bourse where they trade oil in Euros. Guess what America doesn't like that, because when people stop trading in US dollars their economy goes to 0.

Sorry, but even the mainstream news spills the beans for you no need to delve in conspiracy theories.

Tinfoilhattery is out in full force I see. I think you forgot a rant about the Rothchilds and illuminati.

I'm gonna venture a guess you do some sort of IT role and have a huge boner for bitcoins? Because of Ron Paul and freedom?

 

[surfsatwerk]

I don't know if I should side with the crazy ones or the false flag people?