close, very close, thank you; and nice stuff, too. alas, these are the type that have cables which run out the back of the computer, then plug in externally; hence they 'use up' needed rear connections. there is a type which plugs directly into the front header on the mobo, so all connections are internal. i saw one at bb.com, but it said 'can't be ordered at this time' (?), no in store pick-up either. i think the one that had to be shipped from taiwan was made by J D Research; however they don't show it on their website. thanks again for the reply, i appreciate it.