Long time Nvidia fan thinking of going AMD

[mikeymikec]

Flash content crashes on me no matter what GPU I used, GTX470, HD6950, HD7970, FireFox, Chrome, same story. I hope they get rid of Flash online asap. It's also a huge memory hog. My friend with 8800GT complains about same issues.

If I've had the Flash plugin crash 10 times in 10 years I would be surprised - when I say this, I don't mean "you're wrong / something you're doing is wrong", necessarily, but my wife's machine had a problem with Flash (painting issues, graphical corruptions in animation, crashing), which were fixed by downgrading Flash on her machine. Not an ideal solution, but a damn sight better than browsers crashing left, right and centre. Combine that with the Flashblock add-on for Firefox so you just enable Flash clips when you want them, and that should make things a bit more manageable. Her problem was with Firefox on Vista 64 and Flash. Keeping the latest FF version but downgrading Flash to 11.2 (IIRC) fixed it.

 

[Nintendesert]

If I've had the Flash plugin crash 10 times in 10 years I would be surprised - when I say this, I don't mean "you're wrong / something you're doing is wrong", necessarily, but my wife's machine had a problem with Flash (painting issues, graphical corruptions in animation, crashing), which were fixed by downgrading Flash on her machine. Not an ideal solution, but a damn sight better than browsers crashing left, right and centre. Combine that with the Flashblock add-on for Firefox so you just enable Flash clips when you want them, and that should make things a bit more manageable. Her problem was with Firefox on Vista 64 and Flash. Keeping the latest FF version but downgrading Flash to 11.2 (IIRC) fixed it.

I had to turn off hardware acceleration years ago due to how it crashed all the time. Flash is such a turd.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I've never had problems with flash TDR /\

 

[RussianSensation]

If I've had the Flash plugin crash 10 times in 10 years I would be surprised - when I say this, I don't mean "you're wrong / something you're doing is wrong", necessarily, but my wife's machine had a problem with Flash (painting issues, graphical corruptions in animation, crashing), which were fixed by downgrading Flash on her machine. Not an ideal solution, but a damn sight better than browsers crashing left, right and centre. Combine that with the Flashblock add-on for Firefox so you just enable Flash clips when you want them, and that should make things a bit more manageable. Her problem was with Firefox on Vista 64 and Flash. Keeping the latest FF version but downgrading Flash to 11.2 (IIRC) fixed it.

Ya, I am not saying everyone has Flash issues but it has a history of giving problems regardless what GPU you use. Flash crapping out on Chrome is a common problem, regardless of GPU vendor. Chrome is my preferred browser at the moment which is why I notice it.

I can't wait until Flash disappears from this world. It's one thing Steve Jobs was right on about.

Adobe stops mobile Flash development, will focus on HTML5
http://www.techspot.com/news/46192-adobe-stops-mobile-flash-development-will-focus-on-html5.html

Adobe confirms it won't support Flash on Android 4.1, stops new Flash installs from Google Play on August 15th, 2012
http://www.engadget.com/2012/06/28/adobe-confirms-it-wont-support-flash-on-android-4-1/

1. Flash is proprietary. You have to buy tools and compiler to develop.
2. Flash is terribly optimized as in the compiled code is very inefficient.

 

[nitromullet]

So is the 8000 series coming out in the second quarter as rumored?

I have no idea. I just couldn't get excited about spending ~$800 on two cards that launched a year ago.

 

[Will Robinson]

Balla said "

It should also be noted that current the 690, a dual gpu is the best card of it's type on the market.

How about this bad boy...kinda demoralizing if you have a 690...
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/01/28/asus_rog_ares_ii_video_card_review/1#.URcN62chQ-V

 

[chimaxi83]

Balla said "How about this bad boy...kinda demoralizing if you have a 690...
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/01/28/asus_rog_ares_ii_video_card_review/1#.URcN62chQ-V

The 690 is about $500 cheaper though, so price/performance makes 690 better

 

[Will Robinson]

Blimey,I'll say!
Ugh $1500 is wicked expensive...still...if you note Balla's quote...it owns the dual GPU market.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Balla said "How about this bad boy...kinda demoralizing if you have a 690...
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/01/28/asus_rog_ares_ii_video_card_review/1#.URcN62chQ-V

lolz that card... I laugh every time I see it's puny little 120 rad.

You should have linked 7950 quad fire for $1100, or put it in a bundle for $1700 you'd have quad fire 7950's with EK custom water cooling :hmm: (But I guess that wouldn't be part of the dual gpu market)

Blimey,I'll say!
Ugh $1500 is wicked expensive...still...if you note Balla's quote...it owns the dual GPU market.

lol yeah all 100 of them for the states, but hardware was never AMD's problem >.<

 

[Tsaar]

I would look at the games you play. I use a gtx 560 ti 448 and for the games I play (WoW, Skyrim, GTA, etc, etc) it actually performs very well even on my 2560x1440 monitor.

I upgraded to a 7950 on a great sale, and my FPS performance improvements were very small (even with a clean OS install). I am not saying the 7950 is bad, just for the games I am playing the AMD line is not quite as strong.

I actually returned that card and I am waiting for the 670 to drop below $300 with a custom cooler. Honestly the game that runs the worst for me is MOP. If I max it out I get around 30-40 FPS in the MOP zones, and I feel every frame.

The other games I am playing right now (Sleeping Dogs, Skyrim, Dishonored, etc) all feel buttery smooth still. I don't max out AA, but at my resolution it doesn't seem to make a huge difference anyway.

 

[Carfax83]

Sage advice all around guys. I'll consider everything you've said..

For now, I think I'll take RussianSensation's advice and wait until Crysis 3 and the Titan launches, so I can see how the various GPUs perform in the final version at max settings..

If the Titan retails for $899 as rumored, then the only way I'd buy it is if it came within striking distance of the 7970 CF; something which I think is unlikely, but we'll see..

 

[Will Robinson]

lolz that card... I laugh every time I see it's puny little 120 rad.

You should have linked 7950 quad fire for $1100, or put it in a bundle for $1700 you'd have quad fire 7950's with EK custom water cooling :hmm: (But I guess that wouldn't be part of the dual gpu market)



lol yeah all 100 of them for the states, but hardware was never AMD's problem >.<

And yet its benchmark scores for both temps and FPS are very solid so lol at the little radiator all you wish...you noted of course how it trounces GTX 680 SLI etc...:whiste:

 

[raghu78]

Sage advice all around guys. I'll consider everything you've said..

For now, I think I'll take RussianSensation's advice and wait until Crysis 3 and the Titan launches, so I can see how the various GPUs perform in the final version at max settings..

If the Titan retails for $899 as rumored, then the only way I'd buy it is if it came within striking distance of the 7970 CF; something which I think is unlikely, but we'll see..

good decision. wait for titan and crysis 3. Titan should be around 85% performance of GTX 690. but given its a single GPU and can be overclocked to match GTX 690 it might be the best option. HD 7970 Ghz CF will have more raw power but multi GPU issues like microstuttering make the Titan a more appealing choice.

 

[Fx1]

I would look at the games you play. I use a gtx 560 ti 448 and for the games I play (WoW, Skyrim, GTA, etc, etc) it actually performs very well even on my 2560x1440 monitor.

I upgraded to a 7950 on a great sale, and my FPS performance improvements were very small (even with a clean OS install). I am not saying the 7950 is bad, just for the games I am playing the AMD line is not quite as strong.

I actually returned that card and I am waiting for the 670 to drop below $300 with a custom cooler. Honestly the game that runs the worst for me is MOP. If I max it out I get around 30-40 FPS in the MOP zones, and I feel every frame.

The other games I am playing right now (Sleeping Dogs, Skyrim, Dishonored, etc) all feel buttery smooth still. I don't max out AA, but at my resolution it doesn't seem to make a huge difference anyway.

Im pretty sure if your getting "not much improvement" with a 7950 vs a 560 Ti then its something your doing or the rest of your rig since the 7950 smashes the 560 in every game

 

[Eureka]

Im pretty sure if your getting "not much improvement" with a 7950 vs a 560 Ti then its something your doing or the rest of your rig since the 7950 smashes the 560 in every game

Or that these qualifier words means nothing, such as "improvement" or "smashes". Depending on what settings you were on before, or what framerate you were pulling before, going from a 560 Ti to a 7950 might not be noticeable in actual usage. If you can already pull 50+ frames, you won't see a difference. He could also be CPU limited, which is another thing to look at.

But that being said, even with the 12.11 drivers in TPU's review, the 560Ti works out to around 65%-75% performance of a stock 7950 in terms of average framerates. There's a lot of talk about upgrades on this forum but less talk of what a worthwhile upgrade would be. The jump to a 670 is going to be roughly the same, with game differences coming in a factor in choosing a 670 vs a 7950.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

And yet its benchmark scores for both temps and FPS are very solid so lol at the little radiator all you wish...you noted of course how it trounces GTX 680 SLI etc...:whiste:

Pity you can't just toss hardware at a software problem.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-7990-devil13-7970-x2,3329-9.html

 

[chimaxi83]

Pity you can't just toss hardware at a software problem.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-7990-devil13-7970-x2,3329-9.html

Lol nice cherry puck of a launch review. Son, I am disappoint. I'm sure you've seen the stutter/latency issue has been massively improved. [H], who routinely call out either vendor on crappy game play experience, gave the Ares II a gold award. What a software problem, eh?

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Lol nice cherry puck of a launch review.

Do you have any others for 7990 or CF with frame latency testing? 10 months after the release of the base product isn't a "launch" review either :|

Son, I am disappoint.

It's ok.

I'm sure you've seen the stutter/latency issue has been massively improved.

For some games, in some titles, yes we've seen some improvements. For single cards, not dual gpu. Correct me if I'm wrong there, I'm just happy we can see the fixing of something that was never an issue as a positive, +1 AMD.

[H], who routinely call out either vendor on crappy game play experience, gave the Ares II a gold award. What a software problem, eh?

Yes but this is a special case. You don't burn bridges when ASUS provides you with a limited run, $1500 *special* graphics card. You simply run it through it's paces, no mention at all of smoothness in the review. A lack of omission isn't an indirect removal of it. Considering it's been in everyone one of his CF vs SLI reviews, you'd think something so amazing as the first 7xxx CF setup he ever tested that was as smooth, or smoother than SLI would have been given, you know, a sentence, a six letter word couldn't have been all that hard to fit in his conclusion... :hmm:

 

[chimaxi83]

Oh, so it's a "special" case because it's a "special" card, so they don't mention gaming smoothness in this one particular instance, even though it's in EVERY OTHER REVIEW of theirs? Oh ok.

Why don't they worry about "burning bridges" when they point smoothness out every other time?

Gotta love people making crap up out of thin air to prove their point and try to reinforce their stance. Par for this course though

 

[Fx1]

Or that these qualifier words means nothing, such as "improvement" or "smashes". Depending on what settings you were on before, or what framerate you were pulling before, going from a 560 Ti to a 7950 might not be noticeable in actual usage. If you can already pull 50+ frames, you won't see a difference. He could also be CPU limited, which is another thing to look at.

But that being said, even with the 12.11 drivers in TPU's review, the 560Ti works out to around 65%-75% performance of a stock 7950 in terms of average framerates. There's a lot of talk about upgrades on this forum but less talk of what a worthwhile upgrade would be. The jump to a 670 is going to be roughly the same, with game differences coming in a factor in choosing a 670 vs a 7950.

If you are GPU limited then there is no comparison between a 560 ti and a 7950. This is the only real point to be made.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I'm sorry, I thought you wanted my thoughts since you offered none of your own, nor any proof outside of what isn't there. Please, go ahead and link your frametime graphs with the ARES II or any recent CF frame time tests that directly counter the Tom's one I linked.

I'm sorry I said the 690 was the best dual gpu, but this has gone way off track. So unless you have proof that Nvidia doesn't produce a smoother experience in MGPU, I think we're done here.

 

[RussianSensation]

I had to turn off hardware acceleration years ago due to how it crashed all the time. Flash is such a turd.

Adobe warns of critical Flash vulnerability
Published on 8th February 2013 by Gareth Halfacree
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/bits/2013/02/08/adobe-flash-vuln/1

"A similar emergency patch was released in August last year, itself following multiple emergency patches dating back to the launch of the software. Those who have Flash Player installed as a plug-in in their browser are advised to download and install the update as soon as possible, while users of Google Chrome and Microsoft Internet Explorer 10 will need to sit tight and wait for the companies to patch the built-in Flash Player code."

Flash needs to disappear ASAP. :thumbsdown:

 

[tweakboy]

I keep trying to think of an excuse to upgrade my 560ti 448, but I can't find any . I don't play the most graphically demanding games (highest is like SC2 / D3??).

I might just splurge on the titan if it somehow hits the market under $700.

Not worth 700 dollars over the difference youll see compared to 680 or 690 .

Stick with what you have it does the job very well along with your rig, Maybe you should stick another 560 in there, that is a nice SLI OCed , you can play Crysis 3 60fps ,,,,,,,,,gl

 

[mikeymikec]

As much as I dislike Flash (and I very much appreciate that the number of "entirely Flash" websites has dropped sharply over the years), I think people need to be more aware of the fact that most big-name Internet-connecting software products have an awful lot of serious vulnerabilities that are being patched all the time. I doubt that Adobe Flash has a much different share of the vulnerability market (though admittedly they get targetted more because its cross-platform nature makes it a juicy target).

Admittedly I detest Adobe's lack of care and attention towards vulnerability patching, there have been in the past vulnerabilities that have gone unpatched for quite a few years.

However I think that certain companies' denial of the truth that there isn't yet a completely valid replacement for Flash makes getting rid of it a premature decision that hurts users. I think that the companies in question are more interested in their own reputation ("we've got a safe platform, honest!") rather than usability and feature parity in this situation.