Llano A75MA-G55 Overclocking Bios Update...

Oct 14, 2011
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So there are some interesting reports that have shown up on some Chinese websites regarding a new bios for the MSI A75MA-G55 board for Llano.

Apparently by enabling something called 'Lab Burst Mode,' reviewers were able to pull Llanos above 170mhz base clock speed on normal multipliers to achieve 4.4 and 4.9 ghz. Can anyone confirm this?

http://cpu.it168.com/a2011/0927/1252/000001252333_all.shtml (Athlon || X4 631 with bench @ stock! voltage)

http://itbbs.pconline.com.cn/diy/14043491.html (A8)

It would be pretty epic if it were readily feasible. Maybe it would have been better to launch 32nm Athlons and Phenoms on FM1?
 
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podspi

Golden Member
Jan 11, 2011
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So there are some interesting reports that have shown up on some Chinese websites regarding a new bios for the MSI A75MA-G55 board for Llano.

Apparently by enabling something called 'Lab Burst Mode,' reviewers were able to pull Llanos above 170mhz base clock speed on normal multipliers to achieve 4.4 and 4.9 ghz. Can anyone confirm this?

http://cpu.it168.com/a2011/0927/1252/000001252333_all.shtml (Athlon || X4 631 with bench @ stock! voltage)

http://itbbs.pconline.com.cn/diy/14043491.html (A8)

It would be pretty epic if it were readily feasible. Maybe it would have been better to launch 32nm Athlons and Phenoms on FM1?

*sigh* maybe there is still time? Also, I wonder what power usage looks like? Given all this talk about poor yields, I am having trouble believing they could hit such high OCs and not suck down stupid amounts of power.
 
Feb 19, 2009
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CPU voltage 1.47, nearly 5ghz A8, holy shit that is an awesome APU.

Dirt cheap, better IPC than Phenom II, going at 5ghz is nothing to sneeze at.

Edit: Default voltage, it OC to 4.7ghz.
 

jvroig

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
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*sigh* maybe there is still time? Also, I wonder what power usage looks like? Given all this talk about poor yields, I am having trouble believing they could hit such high OCs and not suck down stupid amounts of power.

It's an entirely different arch, and one that is very mature already, so it won't be a direct comparison to BD. Only the process node is similar.

That said, the real problem with Llano overclocking is what it has always been - there is a built-in TDP that you can't exceed. It scales the CPU and GPU power as necessary, within the confines of this TDP limit (100W only in the highest-end Fusion parts). This became the main limiting factor. In comparison, when we OC our good-old chips (Phenoms, Core ix), the resulting TDPs can go over 200W (overvolted Thubans and Nehalems make this real easy).

Unless this "Lab Burst" removes this TDP cap, it is a non-starter.

But if it is a BIOS option that finally allows users to remove the TDP cap, then it's about time. We can finally see how a mature arch does in a new process - exactly the way it should be (not new arch + new process).
 

ShadowVVL

Senior member
May 1, 2010
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I wonder what power usage looks like? Given all this talk about poor yields, I am having trouble believing they could hit such high OCs and not suck down stupid amounts of power.

Indeed I bet the power consumption is huge.
 

dawp

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
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power consumption can't be much worse than my 950 @ 4.3 with a vcore of 1.4v (not sure exact setting as I'm at work).
 
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Blitzvogel

Platinum Member
Oct 17, 2010
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I've entertained myself to the tune of building an A4 based machine, trying to unlock the disabled cores or OCing the hoo-haw out of it.
 
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ItsAlive

Golden Member
Oct 7, 2005
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From the article in OP said:
Not only that, the default voltage of the processor, the motherboard can be overclocked to 4748MHz, FSB 163MH in, the multiplier for the default 29x, is also relying on improved FSB to achieve, which once again proved A75MA-G55 powerful motherboard overclocking performance.

Am I reading this part of the article correctly? They got 4.7GHz with default voltage? Default voltage is 1.424v does anyone know what the max safe range is on these?

It looks like they were hitting 170ish mhz on the FSB with 1.49v and locked 29 multiplier. I wonder what they could do with a black edition with an unlocked multi.
 
Oct 14, 2011
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It's an entirely different arch, and one that is very mature already, so it won't be a direct comparison to BD. Only the process node is similar.

That said, the real problem with Llano overclocking is what it has always been - there is a built-in TDP that you can't exceed. It scales the CPU and GPU power as necessary, within the confines of this TDP limit (100W only in the highest-end Fusion parts). This became the main limiting factor. In comparison, when we OC our good-old chips (Phenoms, Core ix), the resulting TDPs can go over 200W (overvolted Thubans and Nehalems make this real easy).

Unless this "Lab Burst" removes this TDP cap, it is a non-starter.

But if it is a BIOS option that finally allows users to remove the TDP cap, then it's about time. We can finally see how a mature arch does in a new process - exactly the way it should be (not new arch + new process).

Actually, the official TDP for the Athlon II X4 631 part is the SAME AS THE A6 PART WITH A WORKING RADEON CHIP YET IT HAS THAT PART DISABLED. So in reality is probably much lower 100 Watts...:p

So you're going to be bound by the board clock and not the TDP of the processor.
 

jvroig

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
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Actually, the official TDP for the Athlon II X4 631 part is the SAME AS THE A6 PART WITH A WORKING RADEON CHIP YET IT HAS THAT PART DISABLED. So in reality is probably much lower 100 Watts...

So you're going to be bound by the board clock and not the TDP of the processor.
I'm not sure I am understanding your point, so apologies in advance if I have misinterpreted you.

I don't know why you think the TDP of the processor won't be a problem. When you overclock significantly, it is assumed you will be exceeding the rated TDP of that processor. A 1055T, for example, is rated at 125W, similar to its bigger brothers (1090T and 100T). At stock, its "real" TDP is probably lower. It doesn't really matter, because what's important is the TDP sets the minimum required cooling that will be packaged with the chip, or, in an OEM build, packaged with the computer unit. So as long as the 1055T is rated at 125W, it will be packaged with the stock AMD heat-piped cooler (not the Athlon / Athlon II coolers that look like a bare aluminum block with fins and a fan).

This also helps the company bin more products successfully into the target model. If they made the TDP ratings much less loose, then it will affect their binning, because suddenly each 1055T (for example) will have to be "more perfect" (less leaky) so that it fits comfortably into the supposed 1055T TDP rating (let's say, 100W). You can see why this would give little benefit to the company, so they stick (wisely) to just sticking with similar TDPs to bigger groups or families of processors. This also lessens the validation process that OEMs need to do.

As for the Athlon X4 631, yes, it is rated at 100W TDP only to simplify the OEM validation (for their cooling - so that they need no other special validation for the 631 as opposed to the rest of Llano), so it would not be surprising to learn if it is true that most 631 chips have a far less demanding "real" TDP. And as already stated, this will also allow AMD lots of room to bin chips to this model - even the leakiest ones that cannot possibly be binned to any Fusion model can simply be binned as a 631, even if this particular leaky chip's TDP was measured to be 50% more than most chips binned as a 631, as long as it fits into the target 100W TDP.

Having said that, it makes no sense to assume that just because the "real" TDP of something is not approaching the rating, then the TDP will not be a problem when overclocking. We have no data on the power and thermal scaling that extra volts and/or significantly more clocks produce for these chips. It can also be variable, given that just because two chips come from the same model (or, to be more exact, "got binned" as the same model) doesn't mean they will end up having exactly the same characteristics (such as OC potential, "leakiness", specific tolerance to voltage, or even just plain lifespan).

So there is simply no guarantee that the TDP cap will not be a problem, as far as I can see. As long as we are applying more voltages and higher clocks, chips will routinely go over their rated TDP, which is why we end up having to use 3rd party coolers designed to handle much greater resulting TDP (and the highest-end air coolers are rated as high as 200W+)

TL;DR: Just because the 631 should have far lower TDP than most Fusion chips doesn't guarantee us that all we will ever need is a 100W TDP cap. I maintain that unless the Llano TDP cap becomes a setting in the BIOS that can be overridden by overclockers, Llano (although maybe not the 631 specifically, but the A8 is part of your links) will not be an overclocker's joy due to the hard TDP cap limiting your OC and making the GPU next to useless as the AnandTech OC attempt showed.
 
Oct 14, 2011
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Sorry about the random caps, they do look rather silly now that I've woken up.

Anyway, yeah exceeding the hard TDP cap on the Llano chips would be a problem but as of right now there isn't enough data. The overclocks that the Chinese guys were achieving are between 500 and 1000 more mhz than most of the English site reviews when they came out with their overclocking reviews months ago.

No one even knows what 'lab burst mode' does. Maybe it does remove TDP caps but no one knows. It would be good if someone with the MSI board and various Llano parts could see what's really going on or if MSI could elaborate. Either way, I think Llanos got a lot more interesting.
 

wonderbread57

Junior Member
Oct 4, 2011
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Looks like a fun OC but I don't think that clock will work with a discrete graphics card. There doesn't seem to be a way to up the base clock for the CPU without also upping the PCI-E bus. 2x PCI-E bus probably ain't gonna fly.
 

Rvenger

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator <br> Video Cards
Apr 6, 2004
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Looks like a fun OC but I don't think that clock will work with a discrete graphics card. There doesn't seem to be a way to up the base clock for the CPU without also upping the PCI-E bus. 2x PCI-E bus probably ain't gonna fly.


I bet that is dependant on the board for locking the PCI-E bus. My ASRock does not offer this option so I know overclocking is out of the equation for me. :(
 

wonderbread57

Junior Member
Oct 4, 2011
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Yep, you're right. Looks like from the MSI BIOS pic that it let's you have a separate multiplier for the NB which is set to Auto for the china testers. I'm sold, purchased a 631 and the MSI board from newegg for $180 shipped. Will see if I can replicate their results.
 
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sm625

Diamond Member
May 6, 2011
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hmmog.... so AMD could have taken two llano dies, stripped out the gpus, and given us a 300 sq mm beast that would score over 10.0 on cinebench. What a way to screw up AMD.
 

pantsaregood

Senior member
Feb 13, 2011
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hmmog.... so AMD could have taken two llano dies, stripped out the gpus, and given us a 300 sq mm beast that would score over 10.0 on cinebench. What a way to screw up AMD.

Yeah, pretty much.

Not to mention that a 125W Llano could probably hit some pretty decent clock speeds. If the jump from 45nm to 32nm yielded the same ability to increase clock speeds as 65nm to 45nm did, we could've seen 40% gains in clock speed.

That would put X4 CPUs around 5.0 GHz and X6 CPUs around 4.6 GHz, which would be pretty beastly. A 25% increase to clock speeds is probably more realistic, though. That's still 4.1 GHz on an X6 and 4.6 GHz on an X4. Either case would be far more competitive with Sandy Bridge than Bulldozer is.

Not to mention that AMD could throw on an additional 2 MB of L3 or so.

I also find it fairly ridiculous that, even though it was "designed" for high clocks, Bulldozer doesn't clock significantly higher than K10 did at this point.

K10 was very much the same architecture as K8, and K8 was never designed to clock high. I'd be willing to guess that Llano is more capable of high clocks than Zambezi is, actually.
 
Oct 14, 2011
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It is not as easy as that though I suppose you could make server parts that support Multi-CPU and just have the communication link painted on the chip. That would be the simplest way and you could market 2x6 12 core CPU like Intel marketed 2x2 quads.
 

richierich1212

Platinum Member
Jul 5, 2002
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It's the first BD chip. Look at how AMD refines the architecture with each revision. Phenom I 9600 2.3GHz > Phenom II C2 940 3.0GHz > Phenom II C3 965 3.4GHz > Thuban E0 1090T 3.2GHz X6
 

wonderbread57

Junior Member
Oct 4, 2011
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Will an after market cooler be necessary to OC the X4 631? Doesn't look like they did that in the china article.