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little question about buying

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lloose1 said:
Hello Anandtech. This is LLoose from Hardforum. Since this thread was made about me, I thought I should come and give my side of the story.

I put up an ATI HD 4870 for sale on Hardforum. I had qtnguyen87 send me a pm asking me for my paypal address. I was out to lunch at the time so I didn't bother to look at his profile. I sent him my email address and he sent payment. When I got back to my office, I checked him profile. He is 5 days old with 0 posts. I don't know the rules here on Anandtech, but on Hardfourms, you have to have at least 50 posts to participate in the ForSale forum. On top of that, I didn't feel comfortable selling my card to somebody who has such a weak account. I have been scammed before and it took me months to get refunded and things to get worked out. With 0 posts on the forum, I couldn't even get support from the admins on hardforum because I would be bypassing a security measure put in place by the admins to protect sellers like me from bad buyers.

I gave Qtnguyen87 a FULL refund and an apology message explaining the situation and he flew off the handle. Unlike him thuogh, I consider PRIVATE MESSAGES to be private, so I will be just sharing them with the admins instead of posting them here like Qtnguyen does, although I wish I could so you could see how rude and belligerent he has been.


As for the feedback, it says..

http://www.heatware.com/support_faq.php


Qtnguyen87 went ahead anyways and left a negative remark even though no transaction was made (I issues a full refund immediately, there was no "exchange" of anything). This is a shame because if you read my previous feedback, you will see that I go WAY out of my way to make sure that the buyer is happy. I have already emailed a complaint to heatware, hopefully it doesn't take too long before its removed.


Thanks for reading Anandtech users. Hopefully this will help clear my name from the crap this guy is trying to pull.
Click to expand...

Sorry but, your definition of "no exchange" is not we use on these forums or, [H] for that matter. He paid your paypal account. That is an exchange of money Not, when you have greenbacks in your hand.
 
lloose1 said:
Hello Anandtech. This is LLoose from Hardforum. Since this thread was made about me, I thought I should come and give my side of the story.

I put up an ATI HD 4870 for sale on Hardforum. I had qtnguyen87 send me a pm asking me for my paypal address. I was out to lunch at the time so I didn't bother to look at his profile. I sent him my email address and he sent payment. When I got back to my office, I checked him profile. He is 5 days old with 0 posts. I don't know the rules here on Anandtech, but on Hardfourms, you have to have at least 50 posts to participate in the ForSale forum. On top of that, I didn't feel comfortable selling my card to somebody who has such a weak account. I have been scammed before and it took me months to get refunded and things to get worked out. With 0 posts on the forum, I couldn't even get support from the admins on hardforum because I would be bypassing a security measure put in place by the admins to protect sellers like me from bad buyers.

I gave Qtnguyen87 a FULL refund and an apology message explaining the situation and he flew off the handle. Unlike him thuogh, I consider PRIVATE MESSAGES to be private, so I will be just sharing them with the admins instead of posting them here like Qtnguyen does, although I wish I could so you could see how rude and belligerent he has been.


As for the feedback, it says..

http://www.heatware.com/support_faq.php


Qtnguyen87 went ahead anyways and left a negative remark even though no transaction was made (I issues a full refund immediately, there was no "exchange" of anything). This is a shame because if you read my previous feedback, you will see that I go WAY out of my way to make sure that the buyer is happy. I have already emailed a complaint to heatware, hopefully it doesn't take too long before its removed.


Thanks for reading Anandtech users. Hopefully this will help clear my name from the crap this guy is trying to pull.
Click to expand...


Every storey has 2 sides is true I guess and to a large extent I agree with you on this but being a long time ebay seller and myself the subject of scammers you do have to accept that if you sell online then you get a better price but at a greater risk imo. So you need to accept the risk and send it if you didnt stipulate your pre contract conditions.

One thing is for sure though - Paypal is far to heavily weighted in favour of the buyer
 
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It looks like a simple misunderstanding/mistake to me. The guy (LLoose) refunded your money and cited the trading terms on Hardforum, which he inadvertently overlooked when the sale was initially completed. When I sell on eBay, I explicitly have a line in my sale which says I reserve the right to sell to people with 1) recent negative feedback or 2) lack of feedbacks.

Judging by how you're flying off the handle so easily, I think LLoose made the right decision.
 
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MagnusTheBrewer said:
Sorry but, your definition of "no exchange" is not we use on these forums or, [H] for that matter. He paid your paypal account. That is an exchange of money Not, when you have greenbacks in your hand.
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Except, that's not what the heatware rule state at all. Refunded paypal = no feedback. Period.
 
To me, once he sent you paypal, there was some money changing hands.

On the other hand, I'm not too aware of H rules on whether the 50 post limit applied to posters or any participation at all. If it only applied to posting, then I still say you get a negative. If it is 50 posts to even participate, than I'd say you should have the negative removed.
 
lloose1 said:
Lots O'Stuff
Click to expand...

Hmm... While he made the purchase before official rules allow it, that's kind of a technicality. Since you had the money, there wasn't much way you could be scammed. I'd have sent the card to him, and then get the admins to fix their broken system. I imagine it's been up long enough now that it should already be fixed. The trade forum should be locked/hidden to people who don't have the qualifications to use it. That's an easy technical fix, and would eliminate problems like this.

Again, before giving your email, you should have checked his rating first. If it didn't meet standards, you handle it before money changes hands.
 
MagnusTheBrewer said:
Apparently, the OP wasn't getting enough appreciation for his righteous indignation at [H] so, he joined here to share.
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Yeah, because he can't even post in the appropriate place to show his righteous indignation, as he doesn't meet the requirements to participate in FS/T
Funny how that works 🙄
 
Paypal is far to heavily weighted in favour of the buyer
Click to expand...
This and the fact that if I did get scammed and tried to get help from the admins on Hardforum, they would probably just laugh at me for trusting an account that doesn't even have access to post in the ForSale forum due to lack of posts.

I'm just trying to protect myself here. Paypal is VERY weighted in favour of the buyer, I just need to have some assurance myself so I won't have to go through the headache of dealing with them again.
 
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lxskllr said:
Hmm... While he made the purchase before official rules allow it, that's kind of a technicality. Since you had the money, there wasn't much way you could be scammed. I'd have sent the card to him, and then get the admins to fix their broken system. I imagine it's been up long enough now that it should already be fixed. The trade forum should be locked/hidden to people who don't have the qualifications to use it. That's an easy technical fix, and would eliminate problems like this.

Again, before giving your email, you should have checked his rating first. If it didn't meet standards, you handle it before money changes hands.
Click to expand...

Spoken like someone who has never seen people trolled due to a stolen paypal accounts or a false claim of fraud.
 
lloose1 said:
This this and the fact that if I did get scammed and tried to get help from the admins on Hardforum, they would probably just laugh at me for trusting an account that doesn't even have access to post in the ForSale forum due to lack of posts.

I'm just trying to protect myself here. Paypal is VERY weighted in favour of the buyer, I just need to have some assurance myself so I won't have to go through the headache of dealing with them again.
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you didn't do anything wrong. The OP is obviously a douche who gets worked up very easy. If he neg's you, just link to this thread.

Or sign him up for sheep porn emails.
 
I think I'll agree that loose1 is the winner.

But something else fishy that the OP mentioned as a relisting at a higher price.
 
Anyone saying that Money changed hands when talkign about Paypal has no idea about selling with paypal. Paypal is a great system for buyers but a horrible and expensive option for sellers that almost always sides with the buyer in any dispute. This has nothing to do with this thread btw just a point to ppl saying money changed hands because in reality the buyer can simply say the item was not as described or not working and the seller will get bummed.
 
Agree that lloose1 is the "winner"

This "buyer" is clearly unstable and who knows what might set him off when he received the card. Imagine if he didn't like the color or something.
 
jamesmcuk said:
Anyone saying that Money changed hands when talkign about Paypal has no idea about selling with paypal. Paypal is a great system for buyers but a horrible and expensive option for sellers that almost always sides with the buyer in any dispute. This has nothing to do with this thread btw just a point to ppl saying money changed hands because in reality the buyer can simply say the item was not as described or not working and the seller will get bummed.
Click to expand...

This x 1000. You guys must not have dealt with PayPal much as a seller. There was plenty of room for lloose to get screwed if he shipped the card.
 
IndyColtsFan said:
This x 1000. You guys must not have dealt with PayPal much as a seller. There was plenty of room for lloose to get screwed if he shipped the card.
Click to expand...

Yep. I learned my lesson big time a while back. I sold a used mac laptop for $150. I shipped it with USPS signature delivery. The buyer said he never got it. I showed paypal all my documentation showing that he got it, and they STILL SIDED WITH THE BUYER. I was out my $150 and the laptop.

Hell, I could have put a running video camera in the package streaming to my PC showing him receiving the laptop and paypal still would have sided with him.

Money changed hands, lol. My ass...
 
Vertigo Acid said:
Spoken like someone who has never seen people trolled due to a stolen paypal accounts or a false claim of fraud.
Click to expand...

You always have that risk when dealing online. 50 minimum posts is nothing. Neckarb knocked that out in a couple hours when he joined here. If someone is intent on scamming, rules like that aren't going to help. I was scammed once by a seller I had dealt with previously, and had great feedback. Again, reputation should be checked before a transaction is made, not halfway through.
 
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