- Sep 30, 2006
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Linux64 on all computers for last 4 days.
- Thread starter Rudy Toody
- Start date
- Sep 30, 2006
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I've been playing with Ubuntu this week on my laptop. So far it has been decidedly bad. I'm still fighting problems ranging from 4 minute boot times to no wireless net connectivity.
I'm trying to hammer through these problems, but I might just try another distribution to see if it's any better. I'm downloading the Fedora ISO now and may see if that gives me fewer problems.
I'm trying to hammer through these problems, but I might just try another distribution to see if it's any better. I'm downloading the Fedora ISO now and may see if that gives me fewer problems.
Admittedly (through no fault of LINUX, blame apathetic hardware OEMs) there's less good wireless support in LINUX than XP for now.
It is getting a lot better from year to year in LINUX, though, and by now most major distributions support at least most of the major wireless NICs to a modest level. Polishing up the NetworkManager or whatever for reliability and ease of use is something that may take a few more months AFAICT.
Anyway if you're having wireless problems, I suggest you pick up a wireless router (the typical kind with a wired ethernet switch on one side, a WAN port, and WLAN link). Get one of the few that supports 'client mode' and you're all set. Or alternatively (maybe less likely) or one which will work in WPA2 secured 'WDS bridge' mode with your existing router assuming your existing router can even do that at all.
That way you just hook wired ethernet up to the LINUX PC and other networked devices in its area and let the wireless router worry about managing the wireless link with your main router. Same idea if you got a wireless 'gaming adapter' too.
You'll have no wireless drivers / configuration to ever worry about under LINUX, Windows, or anything else that way. Just set up for dhcp or static IP over wired ethernet and you're set.
I have a full time LINUX x64 box, and a dual boot LINUX X64/Vista X64 box, and Vista does seem like kind of a sad toy when doing 'real work' compared to the LINUX box. Though for basic stuff like media player, games, etc. Vista is an ok temporary dual boot crutch.
LINUX is usually much less annoying like the OP said, except in a few areas like wireless NIC support, exotic USB printer support, and such like.
It is getting a lot better from year to year in LINUX, though, and by now most major distributions support at least most of the major wireless NICs to a modest level. Polishing up the NetworkManager or whatever for reliability and ease of use is something that may take a few more months AFAICT.
Anyway if you're having wireless problems, I suggest you pick up a wireless router (the typical kind with a wired ethernet switch on one side, a WAN port, and WLAN link). Get one of the few that supports 'client mode' and you're all set. Or alternatively (maybe less likely) or one which will work in WPA2 secured 'WDS bridge' mode with your existing router assuming your existing router can even do that at all.
That way you just hook wired ethernet up to the LINUX PC and other networked devices in its area and let the wireless router worry about managing the wireless link with your main router. Same idea if you got a wireless 'gaming adapter' too.
You'll have no wireless drivers / configuration to ever worry about under LINUX, Windows, or anything else that way. Just set up for dhcp or static IP over wired ethernet and you're set.
I have a full time LINUX x64 box, and a dual boot LINUX X64/Vista X64 box, and Vista does seem like kind of a sad toy when doing 'real work' compared to the LINUX box. Though for basic stuff like media player, games, etc. Vista is an ok temporary dual boot crutch.
LINUX is usually much less annoying like the OP said, except in a few areas like wireless NIC support, exotic USB printer support, and such like.
I'm not expecting everything to work perfectly. I'm trying a few things to get the wireless running. But, in the end it is a must have. I'm not out to switch or anything, I periodically try a linux distribution. This time my only available Pc I can do it on is my laptop which I'm planning to reinstall stuff on later anyway. I'm just wanting to give it a try for a while.
Not an option even if I had a spare router laying around. It's a laptop so I don't want it to be tethered to anything It kind of defeats the purpose of having a laptop.
I'm not looking to start a Vista vs Linux debate in this thread, but frankly Linux simply won't fill my needs for my primary desktop and Vista64 feels nothing like a toy for me. But that's enough said on the topic. It will be interesting to see how it works out though. This laptop (A Pentium M 1.6Ghz w/ 2GB, 60GB HD and a 128MB Radeon Mobility X300) runs both XP and Vista extremely well.
I've never had many annoyances with Windows machines. They've always been reliable for me and have done exactly what I want of them. typically problems usually turned out to be hardware related. I'm hoping that I can get my laptop to do the same for me. It should have a shot since I have fewer requirements of it than I do my desktop.
VinDSL
Diamond Member
Let's see...
Linux began in, what, 1990, give or take? And, it was supposed to be the next big thing - and UNIX before that!
To my way of thinking, it's 17-18 years old already... am I wrong? Hello?!?!?!
Currently I'm running my personal servers on a Slackware box, which hasn't been booted in 3+ years (suffered an extended power outage - %$@# FSCK - but it came back up!).
I'm running my production server on CentOS, which was booted (let me look)...
4 ^%$@ days ago!!!
Hrm...
Seems like Linux is going backwards to me!
Personally, I love FreeBSD for servers, but who wants to pay the price, if you know what I'm talking about...
Linux, et al, is okay... but it's a kludge on the desktop - always has been, always will! That's because it's a cheap imitation of the real thing... so tell it to your GF!
I dunno, if I lived in a grass shack in Africa, with flies buzzing around my mouth, I suppose Linux would have to do, but why, you know, when I can run Vista?
Anyway, carry on...
Give Linux another 20 years, and it might be something, if the devs aren't all dead from worry!
Nothinman
Elite Member
- Sep 14, 2001
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And? NT 3.1 came out in 1993 so it's taken MS just as long to get even less software to a state where it works pretty well.
Then you're not paying very much attention.
Actually as long as the drivers are there it's a lot simpler than Windows. Hell I can never get the Windows wifi crap to do what I want but when I use 'iwconfig' on a Linux box it just work.
That's not been my experience so far. I have finally managed to get wireless running but it wasn't simple. Vista on the other hand is very simple to connect to a wireless network. And I'm not even taking into consideration the driver support.
Try going to Google. Type in connect vista to a wireless network and take follow the first few links listed. Then go back and swap out vista for fedora and check out the first few links. There is no way that linux wireless networking is easier. I'm sorry it's just not.
I'm continuing to hammer away at my laptop. As I mentioned, I did manage to get the built in wireless going. My SD card is now readable. For some odd reason it the OS doesn't see it if I reboot the system with the SD card inserted. I have to remove and insert it again for it to be seen.
Sound was working. It's not anymore. I made no attempts to changing anything in the sound. I simply tried to play a simple MP3 file, got no sound and now my laptop will no longer play sounds. Even when I go to the sound card detection utility in Fedora.
So far, I do not like Fedora's package updater at all. When I logged in it told me I had 97 updates, which is fine, but It's requiring me to insert the install DVD to run the updater, then it has involved about 10 subsequent clicks for it to continue the process telling it to confirm dependencies, install components, confirm more dependencies...
I'm thinking I might take what I learned from installing Fedora and go back to Ubuntu armed with that knowledge. I'm hoping it has more codec support built in.
edit:
What the.... The package updater has been running, then not one but two windows pop up telling me the system is going to reboot in 20 seconds because of a package update, while the updater is still updating software. The timers count down then the windows vanish and the updater continues to run... It's good that the updater didn't get stopped by the messages, but man that's just ugly.
Griffinhart:
If you don't mind KDE, you could always try Mepis. Mepis is based on Debian and is a really solid, almost complete distro. One of the strengths of Mepis is it's support for hardware and wireless.
If you don't mind KDE, you could always try Mepis. Mepis is based on Debian and is a really solid, almost complete distro. One of the strengths of Mepis is it's support for hardware and wireless.
Nothinman
Elite Member
- Sep 14, 2001
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Well I'm talking about XP since I've never used wifi in Vista, but if the SSID isn't being broadcast XP is a huge PITA. With Linux and OS X if you say "use this SSID" it connects and works just fine.
Strawman. I like and know how to use the cli tools like iwconfig so it is a lot easier for me.
Yea, I'm not a fan of yum and the tools Fedora wrote around it either.
Not really, The fact is, someone new to Linux that is having difficulty with getting wireless to work will probably turn to google to find some help. While it's not directly a problem with the actual OS the inability to easily get clear, easy to follow directions does make the entire processes difficult.
Eep, another distro... Maybe later, right now I'm just going to continue hammering on the two I currently have. As I type this, I am re-installing Ubuntu. I expect to have a little better luck this time.
This works a lot better in Vista, although not broadcasting the SSID is out of spec.
http://technet.microsoft.com/e.../library/bb726942.aspx
Nothinman
Elite Member
- Sep 14, 2001
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And the fact is that XP's wifi support isn't really any better because I and some of our Windows guys had a hell of a time getting it to connect to our wifi here. I'd rather fight with iwconfig, NetworkManager, etc than XP where you fill out the information only to have it connect to another network in range for no good reason and no way to force it to the correct one.
That has not been my personal experience with XP wireless support. Most wireless boards use their own software to manage it and they are pretty simplistic. Using the default wirelss stuff isn't straight forward though. But I'm not running XP anymore anyway. Vista is an entirely different experience and extremely simple to connect to a network with. And Vista is the current OS from MS.
Nothinman
Elite Member
- Sep 14, 2001
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Which is whole another issue because that means there's no consistent wifi management UI. But it doesn't fix the fact that XP's wifi software is horrible.
Which is the point, just about all the wifi software that I've used on Linux was easier to use.
And yet XP is still supported, sold and used by most people running Windows so it's beside the point.
To the OP: I have exactly the system you do. Lenny X64 (with KDE). Love it. Although there is that empty feeling of not having any virus checking, defragmenting and random maintenance to do. It's a tough adjustment.
In my experience, Linux has far better hardware support out of the box than XP. I've installed both on several modern laptops. With XP I've had to hunt down drivers for every single piece of hardware individually. Also installed Kubuntu and it "just worked". No post configuration whatsoever. Obviously mileage may vary. That said, I'm not sure why Windows fans have to throw in their derogatory and defensive remarks in Linux threads. They're getting worse than the Mac heads.
In my experience, Linux has far better hardware support out of the box than XP. I've installed both on several modern laptops. With XP I've had to hunt down drivers for every single piece of hardware individually. Also installed Kubuntu and it "just worked". No post configuration whatsoever. Obviously mileage may vary. That said, I'm not sure why Windows fans have to throw in their derogatory and defensive remarks in Linux threads. They're getting worse than the Mac heads.
ultimatebob
Lifer
- Jul 1, 2001
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More power to ya, man! As long as you're not a PC gamer, there is nothing wrong with running Linux on the desktop now.
I had a CentOS 4 server with an uptime of over 2 years until a power outage did it in last month
However, I will say that, Windows or Linux, the sysadmin has a lot to do with this. When I first started at this job, their servers (all Windows) were lucky if they made it a month without crashing and requiring a hard reset. The new servers I've put in (many just re-installs on the same hardware) I would be shocked if one ever crashed. The closest thing I can think of in the last several months is the MS SQL Server 2000 stopped responding, but a remote restart of the SQL Server service cleared that up. Unfortunately, I can't really get good uptime measurements though because they have to be restarted every month for their stupid little updates.
However, I will say that, Windows or Linux, the sysadmin has a lot to do with this. When I first started at this job, their servers (all Windows) were lucky if they made it a month without crashing and requiring a hard reset. The new servers I've put in (many just re-installs on the same hardware) I would be shocked if one ever crashed. The closest thing I can think of in the last several months is the MS SQL Server 2000 stopped responding, but a remote restart of the SQL Server service cleared that up. Unfortunately, I can't really get good uptime measurements though because they have to be restarted every month for their stupid little updates.
Linux could be a whole lot better if it were a little more unified. Of course, this is the advantage to Linux.
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