Limit to the length of CAT5 cable? Please help

[Indolent]

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: Marshallj

Originally posted by: robotcholi
Thanks for all the help so far guys, i really appreciated but it doesn't really help me figure out the problem yet. I did get a link between the router and computer because the ethernet card LED lid up when i plugged in also windows xp also confirmed that cuzz it will say unplug as soon as i unplugged the cable,

Are you sure you wired the ends up right? There's an "A" and a "B" way to wire the cables. Which one did you pick?

What do you mean "A" and "B" way Marshallj? I tried one way with 2 short ones and it worked so i assumed if I made them longer but same way then it should work too but they didn't

A and B wouldn't matter as long as it is consistent throughtout he whole network.

Are those light fixtures florescent by any chance? That Could definitely do it.

 

[N8Magic]

Originally posted by: Marshallj

Originally posted by: narzy
the pro you know goes out of standard and voids his clients warrenty's, not a pro I want working on my stuff.

He's a veteran in the field, has tons of experience and knows what works and what doesn't... unlike 17 year old kids who post on Anandtech and claim to be be know-it-alls (hint hint)

Regardless of his experience, it's not to standard and his customer will NOT get support from the vendor of his networking equipment if they find out. If I put the wrong oil in my car it will work (for now), but my warranty will be void.

 

[d33pt]

Originally posted by: N8Magic

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: N8Magic
Yup, check the quality of the cable and also look to see if their is any obvious electrical interference around the cable as that will shorten the effective length as well.

Do you even get a link light?

yeah I think i got a link N8Magic . The LED on the ethernet card lid up when i plugged in and blinking too and windows xp also seemed to confirmed that because when i unplugged, it said so. Thanks for your help. Too bad I don't have the box here to see its quality but it is quite decent i think because it costed me 60 bux for 500 ft. box

Hmmm.

Theoretically, if you get a link light then it should work. Perhaps all of the wires are not crimped down into the connector properly then. The only other thing I can think of right now is to reterminate the ends of cable with new connectors. If all else fails you could cut the cable in the middle and throw a cheap hub in there to repeat the signal.

That is incorrect. With incorrect pairs, you'll probably get enough signal to get a link, but not be able to transfer actual data with any integrity

 

[robotcholi]

Thanks for the link d33p; it's really helpful

 

[d33pt]

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: d33pt
i bet what you did was make the pairs 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8, when 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 should be the correct pairs. For short runs, the first way would work, but when you go longer, you'll get dropped connections and lost packets.... surprised no one mentioned that. alot of newbs make that mistake when making cables.

d33pt, I think 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8 or 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 makes no different in term of order I think. There are 8 matching wires(colors coded) within the CAT5 cable that they twisted into 4 pairs. The colors are 4 pairs of BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, and ORANGE. It will work just fine as long as you match them at both ends. Let's say you do BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, ORANGE at one end, you'll have to do the same order at the other end and it'll work just fine. It worked with my two short ones i made but all 8 long ones around 70-80 feet each didn't work. Still scratching my head... Thanks for your input.

Now i know EXACTLY why you got it wrong. you HAVE to make it in the right pairs. stop scratching your head, crimp the cables in the right pairs (doesn't matter what colors you use for the pairs, but just follow the standard to make it easier). i'll put $10 on it that it will work if you crimp it right

 

[Indolent]

Originally posted by: d33pt

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: d33pt
i bet what you did was make the pairs 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8, when 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 should be the correct pairs. For short runs, the first way would work, but when you go longer, you'll get dropped connections and lost packets.... surprised no one mentioned that. alot of newbs make that mistake when making cables.

d33pt, I think 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8 or 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 makes no different in term of order I think. There are 8 matching wires(colors coded) within the CAT5 cable that they twisted into 4 pairs. The colors are 4 pairs of BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, and ORANGE. It will work just fine as long as you match them at both ends. Let's say you do BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, ORANGE at one end, you'll have to do the same order at the other end and it'll work just fine. It worked with my two short ones i made but all 8 long ones around 70-80 feet each didn't work. Still scratching my head... Thanks for your input.

Now i know EXACTLY why you got it wrong. you HAVE to make it in the right pairs. stop scratching your head, crimp the cables in the right pairs (doesn't matter what colors you use for the pairs, but just follow the standard to make it easier). i'll put $10 on it that it will work if you crimp it right

If they weren't in the right pairs, the short ones wouldn't work either would they? I doubt he would have all 8 long ones not wired correctly.

 

[N8Magic]

Originally posted by: d33pt

Originally posted by: N8Magic

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: N8Magic
Yup, check the quality of the cable and also look to see if their is any obvious electrical interference around the cable as that will shorten the effective length as well.

Do you even get a link light?

yeah I think i got a link N8Magic . The LED on the ethernet card lid up when i plugged in and blinking too and windows xp also seemed to confirmed that because when i unplugged, it said so. Thanks for your help. Too bad I don't have the box here to see its quality but it is quite decent i think because it costed me 60 bux for 500 ft. box

Hmmm.

Theoretically, if you get a link light then it should work. Perhaps all of the wires are not crimped down into the connector properly then. The only other thing I can think of right now is to reterminate the ends of cable with new connectors. If all else fails you could cut the cable in the middle and throw a cheap hub in there to repeat the signal.

That is incorrect. With incorrect pairs, you'll probably get enough signal to get a link, but not be able to transfer actual data with any integrity

You are correct, the link light only shows that you have a physical connection and nothing more.

I think he may have screwed himself by not using the conductors in the proper order, but I didn't want to be rude.

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: N8Magic

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: N8Magic
Yup, check the quality of the cable and also look to see if their is any obvious electrical interference around the cable as that will shorten the effective length as well.

Do you even get a link light?

yeah I think i got a link N8Magic . The LED on the ethernet card lid up when i plugged in and blinking too and windows xp also seemed to confirmed that because when i unplugged, it said so. Thanks for your help. Too bad I don't have the box here to see its quality but it is quite decent i think because it costed me 60 bux for 500 ft. box

Hmmm.

Theoretically, if you get a link light then it should work. Perhaps all of the wires are not crimped down into the connector properly then. The only other thing I can think of right now is to reterminate the ends of cable with new connectors. If all else fails you could cut the cable in the middle and throw a cheap hub in there to repeat the signal.

hehe, pretty good suggestion N8Magic
I did cut both ends of one long wire and re-crimped it really really carefully but no luck still and it couldn't be the connectors didn't crimp down properly for all the wires (maybe 1 or 2 but i doubt all) because i really really took my time. The two short ones went without a hitch.

 

[Soybomb]

Follow the wiring standard, don't wire it how you're describing:
http://www.siriuscomputers.com/rj45.htm

Be careful running your wires over flourescent lights.....

He's a veteran in the field, has tons of experience and knows what works and what doesn't... unlike 17 year old kids who post on Anandtech and claim to be be know-it-alls (hint hint)

Damn TIA, who do they think they are, with their research telling us how to do things. We should all do whatever we want because we know what works best. I'm so thankful when my car is put together the people on the assemble line don't get to decide when a grade three bolt will suffice instead of a grade 8. Its not a matter of age or experience, its following the rules just like a house meeting electrical code. I'd fire an electrician who wired my house against code, and that guy should have the same done from anyone he tries to do that to.

 

[Indolent]

robotcholi: are the light fixtures it is running along florescent? There's a good chance that could be causing interference.

 

[d33pt]

If they weren't in the right pairs, the short ones wouldn't work either would they? I doubt he would have all 8 long ones not wired correctly.

Short runs about 10' or under will still work even when the pairs aren't wired right. I did the same mistake when I started making wires a few years ago. Didn't realize i was doing it all wrong until i started making longer cables and they wouldn't work right or would work intermittently

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: Indolent

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: d33pt
i bet what you did was make the pairs 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8, when 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 should be the correct pairs. For short runs, the first way would work, but when you go longer, you'll get dropped connections and lost packets.... surprised no one mentioned that. alot of newbs make that mistake when making cables.

d33pt, I think 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8 or 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 makes no different in term of order I think. There are 8 matching wires(colors coded) within the CAT5 cable that they twisted into 4 pairs. The colors are 4 pairs of BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, and ORANGE. It will work just fine as long as you match them at both ends. Let's say you do BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, ORANGE at one end, you'll have to do the same order at the other end and it'll work just fine. It worked with my two short ones i made but all 8 long ones around 70-80 feet each didn't work. Still scratching my head... Thanks for your input.

What you need is a link tester to test each wire individually to make sure they match up correctly and there isn't any little cuts anywhere in the line. Not sure how else you can do it if this isn't available.

A link tester would be good to test each wire individually but too bad i don't have any
But i can't imagine all 8 other wires have cut in the middle, maybe 1 or 2
I think i made a boo-boo somewhere here and i don't know which one ... *scratching head*

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: Indolent

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: Marshallj

Originally posted by: robotcholi
Thanks for all the help so far guys, i really appreciated but it doesn't really help me figure out the problem yet. I did get a link between the router and computer because the ethernet card LED lid up when i plugged in also windows xp also confirmed that cuzz it will say unplug as soon as i unplugged the cable,

Are you sure you wired the ends up right? There's an "A" and a "B" way to wire the cables. Which one did you pick?

What do you mean "A" and "B" way Marshallj? I tried one way with 2 short ones and it worked so i assumed if I made them longer but same way then it should work too but they didn't

A and B wouldn't matter as long as it is consistent throughtout he whole network.

Are those light fixtures florescent by any chance? That Could definitely do it.

Office light fixures definitely flourescent! You are getting my hope up here Can anyone else confirm this?

 

[d33pt]

nevermind, i give up on you. go BUY some wires. already told you what your problem was but you refuse to read

 

[Indolent]

Computers read signals transmitted over the wire pairs by measuring the difference between the value of the signal on each member of the pair. If one member of the pair is subjected to influence that the other member is not, this will affect the reading and distort the signal. For this same reason, CAT5 should not be laid directly on fluorescent lighting or parallel to power cables.

quoted from here

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: d33pt

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: d33pt
i bet what you did was make the pairs 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8, when 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 should be the correct pairs. For short runs, the first way would work, but when you go longer, you'll get dropped connections and lost packets.... surprised no one mentioned that. alot of newbs make that mistake when making cables.

d33pt, I think 1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8 or 1-2, 3-6, 4-5, 7-8 makes no different in term of order I think. There are 8 matching wires(colors coded) within the CAT5 cable that they twisted into 4 pairs. The colors are 4 pairs of BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, and ORANGE. It will work just fine as long as you match them at both ends. Let's say you do BLUE, BROWN, GREEN, ORANGE at one end, you'll have to do the same order at the other end and it'll work just fine. It worked with my two short ones i made but all 8 long ones around 70-80 feet each didn't work. Still scratching my head... Thanks for your input.

Now i know EXACTLY why you got it wrong. you HAVE to make it in the right pairs. stop scratching your head, crimp the cables in the right pairs (doesn't matter what colors you use for the pairs, but just follow the standard to make it easier). i'll put $10 on it that it will work if you crimp it right

d33pt, I will try re-crimp to the configuration you suggested the first thing tommorow. My hope is getting higher each minute here Thanks for your help.

Robot,

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: Mucman
Don't crimp your own cables... they won't be to spec.

WHAT?

I'm just going to pretend that they don't sell crimpers and people don't wire houses.

I can see that you have little to no experience.

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: robotcholi


What do you mean "A" and "B" way Marshallj? I tried one way with 2 short ones and it worked so i assumed if I made them longer but same way then it should work too but they didn't

There are two different wiring standards. One's called A and one's called B.

I just think your cable is mis-wired. Try wiring it again and keep an attention to detail.

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: d33pt

If they weren't in the right pairs, the short ones wouldn't work either would they? I doubt he would have all 8 long ones not wired correctly.

Short runs about 10' or under will still work even when the pairs aren't wired right. I did the same mistake when I started making wires a few years ago. Didn't realize i was doing it all wrong until i started making longer cables and they wouldn't work right or would work intermittently

FOR REAL d33pt ?!?! If this is true, then my problem solved!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh my gosh, i'm so happy. Thanks d33pt!!!!!! A million thanks. Ok, i hope all of you learn the lesson i've just learned! Follow the rules!!! Thanks to all those who have help.

Robot,

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: Indolent

A and B wouldn't matter as long as it is consistent throughtout he whole network.

But that's usually the whole problem. Most of the network will be wired one way, and a person without experience won't know any better and will start to install cables that have been installed the other way. Then they can't figure out why it's not working right.

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: d33pt
nevermind, i give up on you. go BUY some wires. already told you what your problem was but you refuse to read

Sorry d33p, it takes forever for me to read and post replies so by the time i get to this post, you have already posted

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: d33pt

If they weren't in the right pairs, the short ones wouldn't work either would they? I doubt he would have all 8 long ones not wired correctly.

Short runs about 10' or under will still work even when the pairs aren't wired right. I did the same mistake when I started making wires a few years ago. Didn't realize i was doing it all wrong until i started making longer cables and they wouldn't work right or would work intermittently

FOR REAL d33pt ?!?! If this is true, then my problem solved!!!!!!!!!!!!! ,

You should save your excitement until you have confirmed 100% that it works properly.

 

[robotcholi]

Originally posted by: Marshallj

Originally posted by: robotcholi

Originally posted by: d33pt

If they weren't in the right pairs, the short ones wouldn't work either would they? I doubt he would have all 8 long ones not wired correctly.

Short runs about 10' or under will still work even when the pairs aren't wired right. I did the same mistake when I started making wires a few years ago. Didn't realize i was doing it all wrong until i started making longer cables and they wouldn't work right or would work intermittently

FOR REAL d33pt ?!?! If this is true, then my problem solved!!!!!!!!!!!!! ,

You should save your excitement until you have confirmed 100% that it works properly.

hehe, that is true
we will see tommorow ...

 

[woowoo]

Also
Tell me that you ARE using SOLID wire for these long runs
and
Your NOT using STRANDED wire........

Are you?


Solid wire=In wall install
Stranded wire= Short jumpers

 

[Mucman]

Originally posted by: Marshallj

Originally posted by: Mucman
Don't crimp your own cables... they won't be to spec.

WHAT?

I'm just going to pretend that they don't sell crimpers and people don't wire houses.

I can see that you have little to no experience.

ROFL, that just made my day... try posting this question in the Networking forum and not in OT... then you won't
see the dingbat answers you are seeing here!

I don't know anyone who can properly crimp a stranded patch cable.