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Libya

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wuliheron said:
It's a "police action", not a war. You kill a few people, contain the situation, and maybe help restore a little order. War is pretty much no-holds-barred-winner-takes-all. With those stakes its also much more expensive.
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Sounds like Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Korea. Those were all police actions. We have muddled enough in the worlds affairs. Let them figure it out for themselves.
 
OCGuy said:
Let Europe deal with it.

Why do you feel it is the USA's job to be the world's big brother and risk lives and $$$ for any conflict?
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I don't. I feel we should support democracy in general. Libya is a special case due to the scale of their conflict and the aims of each side.
 
Genx87 said:
Sounds like Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Korea. Those were all police actions. We have muddled enough in the worlds affairs. Let them figure it out for themselves.
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As nice as that sentiment might be when oil prices go through the roof the last thing on Americans' minds will be the meddlesome nature of US foreign policy or the cost of wars. If the situation is allowed to persist for any length of time other superpowers will insist that either the US take action or they be allowed to do so. Then we might have multiple superpowers occupying the region and vying for position.

Make no mistake about it, Rome has suffered a major setback and chaos is now breaking out in the conquered provinces. If the supply of oil is disrupted enough for other superpowers it could lead to another world war. Although the history books don't like to mention it, the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor shortly after the US imposed an oil embargo on them. Desperate people resort to desperate acts.
 
wuliheron said:
As nice as that sentiment might be when oil prices go through the roof the last thing on Americans' minds will be the meddlesome nature of US foreign policy or the cost of wars. If the situation is allowed to persist for any length of time other superpowers will insist that either the US take action or they be allowed to do so. Then we might have multiple superpowers occupying the region and vying for position.

Make no mistake about it, Rome has suffered a major setback and chaos is now breaking out in the conquered provinces. If the supply of oil is disrupted enough for other superpowers it could lead to another world war. Although the history books don't like to mention it, the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor shortly after the US imposed an oil embargo on them. Desperate people resort to desperate acts.
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What are you trying to say here? China is going to invade Libya if we dont? Let them go for it.
 
irishScott said:
Like I said, it's in our interest to promote democracy. Would you rather Libya continue to be a brutal dictatorship for the at least the next few decades or a democracy?
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That is no reason to intervene using our military....
Let say Gadhafi eventually falls. Then lets pretend there are elections.
Then lets pretend the PEOPLE elect themselves another Gadhafi.
What do we do? The people have spoken like it or not!

Sort of like those people who call themselves Palestinian`s electing Hamas as their government knowing full well that Hamas would do nothing to promote a lasting peace...
 
Genx87 said:
What are you trying to say here? China is going to invade Libya if we dont? Let them go for it.
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Sorry, its not my call. Nor do I even believe it is in the hands of the American people right now. That responsibility now rests with Obama who has not proven to share your sentiments.
 
irishScott said:
I think Iraq began by Bush ordering a land invasion...
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LOL, no. The problems with Iraq started before GWB. Were you alive when his dad was president? When Clinton was president?


irishScott said:
I was talking Iraq 2.0. Last I checked Saddam wasn't invading Kuwait in 2003...
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Then you aren't looking at the whole story.

It's like trying to understand how WW2 began without understanding the results of WW1.
 
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bamacre said:
LOL, no. The problems with Iraq started before GWB. Were you alive when his dad was president? When Clinton was president?




Then you aren't looking at the whole story.

It's like trying to understand how WW2 began without understanding the results of WW1.
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I'm well aware of the history thank you, pardon me for staying on topic.

Libya has nothing to do with the history of the Wars in Iraq, and if properly managed it wouldn't turn out the same way. And IMO it would be properly managed, as Obama knows a land invasion of Libya would screw any chance he has for reelection.
 
bamacre said:
LOL, no. The problems with Iraq started before GWB. Were you alive when his dad was president? When Clinton was president?


Then you aren't looking at the whole story.

It's like trying to understand how WW2 began without understanding the results of WW1.
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LOL, how quickly some of these morons forget. Apparently they're not familiar with the No Fly Zones that Iraq ignored between the two Iraq wars.

But don't worry, No Fly Zones have nothing to do with war...
 
irishScott said:
I'm well aware of the history thank you, pardon me for staying on topic.

Libya has nothing to do with the history of the Wars in Iraq, and if properly managed it wouldn't turn out the same way. And IMO it would be properly managed, as Obama knows a land invasion of Libya would screw any chance he has for reelection.
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Clinton didn't invade Iraq either, but his policies regarding Iraq, I would argue, made it easier for Bush to invade.

You simply are not looking at the potential unintended consequences.
 
wuliheron said:
As nice as that sentiment might be when oil prices go through the roof the last thing on Americans' minds will be the meddlesome nature of US foreign policy or the cost of wars. If the situation is allowed to persist for any length of time other superpowers will insist that either the US take action or they be allowed to do so. Then we might have multiple superpowers occupying the region and vying for position.

Make no mistake about it, Rome has suffered a major setback and chaos is now breaking out in the conquered provinces. If the supply of oil is disrupted enough for other superpowers it could lead to another world war. Although the history books don't like to mention it, the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor shortly after the US imposed an oil embargo on them. Desperate people resort to desperate acts.
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The spice will flow regardless.

For now, they, like most of these oil states, are without a developed economy and without selling oil they starve.
 
wuliheron said:
Sorry, its not my call. Nor do I even believe it is in the hands of the American people right now. That responsibility now rests with Obama who has not proven to share your sentiments.
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Uhh.....Jets started bombing civilians last week, and we haven't done anything about it. I would say Obama is taking the smart route so far.

Not our problem.
 
irishScott said:
Like I said, it's in our interest to promote democracy. Would you rather Libya continue to be a brutal dictatorship for the at least the next few decades or a democracy?
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Huh? No, no it isn't. The job of our military is to protect us, not "spread democracy" around the world.

Where would you even get an idea like that?
 
irishScott said:
Like I said, it's in our interest to promote democracy. Would you rather Libya continue to be a brutal dictatorship for the at least the next few decades or a democracy?
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So everywhere people decide to revolt against their dictator it is our mission to help them with the U.S. military?
 
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