Let's put an end to speculation about all the 'Foreign Terrorists' in Iraq . . .

[CaptnKirk]

I'm registered to the Times, & I get the error message.

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
I'm registered to the Times, & I get the error message.

ditto

 

[b0mbrman]

Corn posted the story in its entirety and it's a "Buy Full Text" story. Here's the link to buy it

http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/la...oalition+officials+say.

In every case, what does the presence of 1,000 foreign fighters mean?

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: b0mbrman
Corn posted the story in its entirety and it's a "Buy Full Text" story. Here's the link to buy it

http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/la...oalition+officials+say.

In every case, what does the presence of 1,000 foreign fighters mean?

In every case, it means that added to the up to 20,000 domestic insurgents that we can neither control nor eradicate without killing and further alienating more other Iragis, George Bush's decision to invade Iraq has been a disgraceful failure and he should be held accountable for diverting so many resources from the real war on terrorism only to open up an now uncontrollable second front at the cost of hunderds of billions of our dollars and more than 1,000 of our gallant young men's lives.

That's what it means.

In EVERY case.

 

[b0mbrman]

Yes. It seems like that's an opinion about the Iraq invasion.

Any idea what it means that there are 1000+ foreign fighters in Iraq? The number seems to be something at least a few people are passionate about

 

[Klixxer]

Originally posted by: b0mbrman
Yes. It seems like that's an opinion about the Iraq invasion.

Any idea what it means that there are 1000+ foreign fighters in Iraq? The number seems to be something at least a few people are passionate about

That people from neighbouring countries are coming to help fight off the invader?

If Canada was attacked, would the people fighting the invaders be called insurgents and would the US troops joinging them in battle be terrorists?

All we know is that they were not there before and that the US has no control over the situation whatsoever.

Unfortunantly this means one of two things will happen, the US will leave and there will be a civil war OR the US will stay and get picked off one by one until the masses at home demands their soldiers home safe, and a civil war will follow.

The "insurgents" are fighting for their country, the "terrorists" are helping them and the US is the occupying force.

 

[b0mbrman]

Finally

I don't see why that was so hard...

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Only blowing up what WE want - not what they want.

At 40,000 strong 'they' would represent 1 of every 675 Iraqis. Do you believe 'they' want what the other 674 want? Do you believe 'they' will be successful in their goal?

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Only blowing up what WE want - not what they want.

At 40,000 strong 'they' would represent 1 of every 675 Iraqis. Do you believe 'they' want what the other 674 want? Do you believe 'they' will be successful in their goal?

Of course, those 40,000 or 20,000 or less active insurgents couldn't successfully exist and operate in Iraq against US military might (oh, sorry, coalition of the willing military might) without the tacit and even the active support of their Iraqi friends and neighbors, could they?

 

[Miramonti]

Given the continued momentum and efficiency over the past year of the resistance and insurgency, iraq is already lost to the point of no return imo, particularly if nato forces do not join soon in a big way.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Only blowing up what WE want - not what they want.

At 40,000 strong 'they' would represent 1 of every 675 Iraqis. Do you believe 'they' want what the other 674 want? Do you believe 'they' will be successful in their goal?

Of course, those 40,000 or 20,000 or less active insurgents couldn't successfully exist and operate in Iraq against US military might (oh, sorry, coalition of the willing military might) without the tacit and even the active support of their Iraqi friends and neighbors, could they?

Sure they could. They simply intimidate them by threatening beatings, death, and generalized thuggery, much like Sadr's militia did in Najaf. Which is the very reason his militia lost respect in Najaf.

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Only blowing up what WE want - not what they want.

At 40,000 strong 'they' would represent 1 of every 675 Iraqis. Do you believe 'they' want what the other 674 want? Do you believe 'they' will be successful in their goal?

Of course, those 40,000 or 20,000 or less active insurgents couldn't successfully exist and operate in Iraq against US military might (oh, sorry, coalition of the willing military might) without the tacit and even the active support of their Iraqi friends and neighbors, could they?

I am willing to concede that each insurgent may have the moral, material, and financial support of a minimum of 10 other iraqis behind him.

At 400,000 strong 'they' would represent 1 of every 67 Iraqis. Same questions come to mind, with one additional question. At that number why haven't they kicked our ass out of Iraq?

 

[b0mbrman]

Originally posted by: Klixxer

Originally posted by: b0mbrman
Yes. It seems like that's an opinion about the Iraq invasion.

Any idea what it means that there are 1000+ foreign fighters in Iraq? The number seems to be something at least a few people are passionate about

That people from neighbouring countries are coming to help fight off the invader?

If Canada was attacked, would the people fighting the invaders be called insurgents and would the US troops joinging them in battle be terrorists?

All we know is that they were not there before and that the US has no control over the situation whatsoever.

Oops. Didn't see the word "troops." If regular US forces were sent, that would imply an overt government action.

Would you characterize those foreigners in Iraq as people like that or would you say they're more like the non-Bosnians who are helping out in that region?

 

[AndrewR]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
how you can complain about somebody building you a powerplant, sewers, schools

Ah, there's the rub. You see - they haven't really been built.
But those who gleefully followed the Bush Agenda think that they have.

Take the money (and Oil) and run.

Sure, power generation exceeded pre-war levels in October 2003 and is scheduled to be 50% higher than pre-war levels at the end of this year. Some other highlights:

Seaport Accomplishments to Date:

-USAID's $45 million programs to rehabilitate and improve management at the port were completed in June 2004.
-Port reopened to commercial traffic on June 17 2003; completed first passenger vessel test July 16.
-Up to 50 ships offload cargo at the port every month.
-Completed dredging to open all 21 berths to deep-draft ships; maintenance dredging is ongoing.
-Applied port tariffs on June 20, 2003.
-Renovated the grain-receiving facility to process 600 MT of grain an hour.
-Renovated the administration building, passenger terminal, customs hall, and electrical substations.

Airport Accomplishments to Date:

-Flights have been arriving and departing Baghdad International Airport since July 2003. BIAP is processing an average of 45 non-military arrivals and departures daily.

-Completed emergency infrastructure work at BIAP for civil air operations, including repairing Terminal C and administration offices and installing VSAT communications systems and 6.5 megawatt power generators.

-Completed work which is preparing Al Basrah International Airport for commercial operations, including installing VSAT and radio communications; runway, taxiway, and apron striping; and installing baggage x-ray units and a perimeter fence.

Sanitation:
Baghdad: Expanding one water treatment plant to increase capacity by more than 50 million gallons per day and rehabilitating sewage treatment plants.
- A major wastewater treatment plant in Baghdad began operating in June of 2004; this is the first major plant in the country to operate in over 12 years.

- The sewage treatment system in Baghdad, barely functioning for years before the conflict, will be restored to almost 100-percent capacity, serving 80 percent of Baghdad's population.

- Standby generators are being installed at 41 Baghdad water facilities.

South: Rehabilitating parts of the Sweet Water Canal system, including repairing breaches, cleaning the main reservoir, and refurbishing 14 water treatment plants around Basrah serving 1.75 million people.

South Central: Rehabilitating two water plants and four sewage plants.
- Sewage plants in An Najaf, Al Qadisiyah, Karbala', and Babil Governorates will serve 440,000.

- Water treatment in Najaf and Babil will serve residents and visitors at Iraq's holiest shrines.

North: Rehabilitating two water plants and one sewage plant near Mosul and Kirkuk.

Bridges and Roads:
-Completed 36 detailed bridge assessments and demolished irreparable sections in preparation for the rehabilitation of three major bridges in Iraq. Two bridges have been repaired and reopened while the last is set for completion in September 2004.

-Repaired a floating bridge over the Tigris River improving traffic in the region for 50,000 travelers a day.

-Completed an assessment of over one hundred 1,100 km lengths of track and associated facilities throughout the country to identify priority projects.

-Constructing 72 kilometers of new track and facilities between the Port of Umm Qasr and Shuaiba Junction, located west of Basrah.

Telecommunications:
-Audited more than 1,200 km of the fiber optic backbone network and performed emergency repairs, reconnecting 20 cities and 70% of the population.

-Reconstituted Baghdad area phone service by installing switches with 240,000 lines at 12 sites.

-Installed 13 new switches, and fully integrated them with the 14 existing switches.

-Ministry of Communications reactivated more than 213,000 subscriber lines.

-Installed a satellite gateway system at Baghdad's largest telecom exchange and restored international service.

-Trained ITPC engineers and technicians in the operation and maintenance of the satellite gateway system and the new switches.

I stopped halfway through the document. Read the rest here. Dated 22 Sep 04.

Facts -- cyanide for Bush haters.

 

[ForThePeople]

Originally posted by: Genx87
The Euroes said the same thing after WWII.

I find it utterly amazing how you can complain about somebody building you a powerplant, sewers, schools. And all you have to do is breath to get it.

Are you kidding me?

"Hi, we're here to steal your oil and indescriminately kill your family and neighbors while we occupy your land. But we'll eventually build you some infrastructure, we promise."

That is what the average Iraqi thinks. And if it were any country doing the same to us we would rebel just as fiercely regardless of any promised future civic improvements.

Really, the fact that you guys can't even begin to think about things from the Iraqi point of view is sad. What's even more sad is that the Bush administration also can't.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: ForThePeople
Are you kidding me?

"Hi, we're here to steal your oil and indescriminately kill your family and neighbors while we occupy your land. But we'll eventually build you some infrastructure, we promise."

That is what the average Iraqi thinks.

And you have knowledge on the thoughts of the "average Iraqi" how, exactly?

If you want to know what and how Iraqis think, go visit some Iraqi blogs, like this one. Then visit the other Iraqi blogs that are linked in the right-hand column.

Then come back with a better and more realistic idea of how Iraqis think, instead of how you think Iraqis think.

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: AndrewR

Facts -- cyanide for Bush haters.

:beer:

 

[imported_Smithy]

Originally posted by: maddogchen
hard to build something when the insurgents come to blow it up every other day.

Needs a new foil hat

 

[imported_Smithy]

Originally posted by: maddogchen
they don't want power plants? They got something against electricity?

They're not just attacking pipelines to exports but also gas pipelines to multiple power plants providing electricity to cities in Iraq.

Because they know we are after the oil. Really needs a new foil hat.

 

[burnedout]

Iraq Grabs 42 Foreign Fighters in Samarra - Reuters via ABC News

Moving right along. . . . .

 

[burnedout]

USMC caught 3 more near Qaim last week.

WaPo via the Bradenton Herald

Fallujah, a city of 200,000 people about 35 miles west of Baghdad, remains in the control of a volatile mix of local insurgents and foreign Arabs who traveled to Iraq to fight the U.S. military. Many are thought to have entered Iraq from Syria, and last week the Marines captured two Syrians and a Palestinian. The three were taken, along with several suspected Iraqi insurgents, during a raid on a safe house near Qaim, on the Syrian border. The raid took place Wednesday but was disclosed Sunday.

 

[burnedout]

Who exactly are the out-of-towners assisting local insurgents? NBC investigates:

During the past two months, NBC News scoured the Internet, cross-referencing names, tracking down biographical information and, in some cases, making direct contact with family members.

All told, NBC News found information on 31 individuals, including:

? One man from a wealthy family in Saudi Arabia
? The reigning Kung Fu champion of Jordan
? A former police officer from Kuwait
? An al-Qaida operative from Turkey

NBC News terror analyst Evan Kohlmann says their backgrounds are diverse ? some successful, others young and unemployed ? and in at least three cases, they came from France.

 

[judasmachine]

We fought the Iraqi government, now we're fighting the Iraqis. Man can Rummy plan a war or what?

 

[tnitsuj]

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: maddogchen
hard to build something when the insurgents come to blow it up every other day.

hmm, they have mostly been blowing up police recruitment centers and oil pipelines and not powerplants, sewers and schools as far as I know.

No, they blow that stuff up as soon as it is built. Been there seen that.

 

[Miramonti]

Fact: At this point, foreign terrorists dominate and set policy in roughly 30% of Iraq.

And if it wasn't for the complete ineptness of Donald Rumsfeld, we'd be dominating and setting policy in the other 70% by now as well.