Lets face it. US democracy is broken

[Mxylplyx]

This may sound elitist, though it is coming from someone who only has a BS degree that grew up in Alabama, so I'm far from some Berkley raised liberal.

The recent arrival of 24hr news cycles, and broad adoption of internet access, has essentially paralyzed our democracy, and I dont see any way out of it without a major crisis. The reason for it...too many intellectual half-wits have been drawn into the world of politics. I actually think this country was better off when the less intelligent in this country focused on sports and television, leaving the politicking in this country to those who actually had to make a concerted effort to stay informed about the current issues of the day. Cable news and internet sites have turned politics into a team sport that every tom, dick, and jane takes a side in, and now their voices are easily heard and their votes easily corralled into a reliable voting block. Ever since the arrival of the "information age" so to speak, what kind of significant legislation has been passed in this country? Welfare reform comes to mind, but that required the use of budget reconciliation. Now politicians are unwilling to make the hard choices, so they just make the easy ones, which are cutting taxes and raising spending.

Living in Alabama, politicians fall all over themselves trying to claim they are the "true conservative". My views are obviously skewed by where I live, but it's rather disheartening to be a non-ideological, intellectually honest voter here, because my voice is drowned out by hoards of bible beating, right wing, redneck retards who cant articulate their ideological views beyond a sound bite they heard on fox news. Now to be fair that isnt some kind of generalization of right wing people here, just the ones who make an effort to be heard. Those people are the easy votes, so people like me that a politician actually has to work for have no true representation.

Now for those of you that believe I just come off as another liberal, Chavez supporting, California liberal with a superiority complex that is so well represented on this board, read my post history. I'm a former right ringer that now leans towards the middle. Both parties disgust me equally.

 

[MotF Bane]

Both parties disgust me equally.

:thumbsup:

 

[Genx87]

Politics has always been a team sport. I dont think our democracy is broken. Just people who arent getting their way believe that is the case.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

The idea of Democracy is that everyone has a voice and input into the political process including rednecks, hippies, and the douchebag next door that wears his hat backwards and keeps his pants around his knees. Having the elite determine what is good for everyone is not Democracy at all. Democracy is not broken. If anything it's healthier than ever. What's broken is the political process. Quite frankly, we have outgrown the 2-party system here in the US. Two sizes does not fit all and the Rep/Dem stranglehold on our political process needs to change before things can get better.

 

[Craig234]

Well, there's an 'I told you so' response - you fit the portion of right-wing voters I've long said would react as you have to the bad things of the Republicans in recent history. Problem was, you didn't listen then.

I give you credit as an 'honest right-winger', and you fit the 'better' part of the movement as you laid it out, the part that can change at least some.

The remedies I've long recommended might make more sense ot you now than before - as you see 'idiots who cxan only spout what Fox tells them' and are the 'easy marks', warnings against the unlimited use of corporate money to create propaganda and ads for those voters leaving voters like you 'without representation' might more clearly be a problem.

Al Gore - go ahead and puke - wrote a book on this very topic you describe, called 'the assault on reason'. You might enjoy it, going by your post.

THe solutions haven't changed a lot. We need a more educated populace of voters, we need less corruption of our political system by non-citizen money - the big bucks of corporations (but unions too).

The danger all this leads to is people like you not recognizing the problem and instead getting cynical and the very basis of our country of democracy being in danger, because you no longer value it as broken.

We need to fix democracy, not view it as useless.

 

[nick1985]

The remedies I've long recommended might make more sense ot you now than before

Just follow Craig's 10 step program to 'recovery'!

 

[Fear No Evil]

First step - Throw out the progressives.

 

[EndGame]

"Lets face it. US Politics are broken"

Corrected for Accuracy...........

 

[BoberFett]

stupid bullshit snipped

diaf

 

[Descartes]

I'm going to go on a limb and say neither democracy nor the political system is broken. There are many great examples of success for both. We can't use a couple of years cast a cloud over the entire history of the US.

I think journalism is broken, and this manifests itself in the form of a broken political system and/or perception of a broken democracy. The journalistic landscape has transformed completely over the past decade or so, and not just with Murdoch and his cronies. Blogs, online "news" sites, etc. have massive readerships and disseminate truth equivalent to the onion while somehow managing to be "objective". Fox is a shining beacon of journalistic corruption and truly pioneered what is now a race for viewers, so others are following in their footsteps.

They're merely giving what the mob wants, so for that reason you can't really blame them. After all, that's what this country is all about; go where the market demand takes you, and so they are. It's simply no longer good business to be good journalists, and this puts us all at tremendous risk.

 

[sandorski]

People seem to have forgotten what Democracy means. It means that if you chose the losing side, you can voice your disapproval, but you can't expect to get your way. Threats of violence, even subtle threats, step way over the line, yet are becoming more common.

 

[Bowfinger]

The idea of Democracy is that everyone has a voice and input into the political process including rednecks, hippies, and the douchebag next door that wears his hat backwards and keeps his pants around his knees. Having the elite determine what is good for everyone is not Democracy at all. ...

Yet that is exactly what we have today, though "the elite" aren't the intelligent and well-informed. No, sadly, the elite are those wealthy enough to buy representation for their interests. One need only look at the hundreds of billions we showered upon Wall Street with no material accountability or strings attached to see exactly how American democracy works today.

As long as we maintain the dual fictions that money is protected speech and that organizations have the same rights as individuals (yes, that includes groups like labor unions), American democracy will remain a grotesque perversion of what it could and should be.

What's broken is the political process. Quite frankly, we have outgrown the 2-party system here in the US. Two sizes does not fit all and the Rep/Dem stranglehold on our political process needs to change before things can get better.

I agree 100%. The two party system is more destructive than beneficial. It encourages collusion and leads voters to choose between pairs of poor choices instead of supporting candidates who will truly represent their interests well.

 

[Fear No Evil]

I thought the Messiah was going to bring us all together? Seems he's took the divide Bush started and turned it into the Grand Canyon. Yes we can!

 

[Throckmorton]

I thought the Messiah was going to bring us all together? Seems he's took the divide Bush started and turned it into the Grand Canyon. Yes we can!

So it's Obama's fault under-educated, over-egoed people like you have been spreading FUD for a year? Are you seriously pretending you even gave him a chance? Give me a break.

 

[Fear No Evil]

So it's Obama's fault under-educated, over-egoed people like you have been spreading FUD for a year? Are you seriously pretending you even gave him a chance? Give me a break.

He didn't need my support to accomplish something. He's failed so badly people wish Bush was still President. He had a supermajority. Fuck, Bush didn't even have that to start 2 wars. Pelosi is leading him around by his cock and you guys sit there and think he just needs to give another speech to make things all better. Speeches don't fix things.

Its amazing how these 'under-educated, over egoed' people keep kicking your elitist asses.

 

[Carmen813]

The idea of Democracy is that everyone has a voice and input into the political process including rednecks, hippies, and the douchebag next door that wears his hat backwards and keeps his pants around his knees. Having the elite determine what is good for everyone is not Democracy at all. Democracy is not broken. If anything it's healthier than ever. What's broken is the political process. Quite frankly, we have outgrown the 2-party system here in the US. Two sizes does not fit all and the Rep/Dem stranglehold on our political process needs to change before things can get better.

We're a Republic, with Democratically elected Representatives....uh...sort of...the President is a bit of a...let's just not go there...

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Yet that is exactly what we have today, though "the elite" aren't the intelligent and well-informed. No, sadly, the elite are those wealthy enough to buy representation for their interests. One need only look at the hundreds of billions we showered upon Wall Street with no material accountability or strings attached to see exactly how American democracy works today.

As long as we maintain the dual fictions that money is protected speech and that organizations have the same rights as individuals (yes, that includes groups like labor unions), American democracy will remain a grotesque perversion of what it could and should be.

afaik, the Wall Street bailout (TARP) came with a string attached - They had to pay back the loans. Many institutions have already payed back the government for those loans. I think that Wall Street made a lot of bad bets, but so did a lot of not so rich Americans. It wasn't just Wall Street that brought the economy to a halt. Blame can be placed all the way down the line.

I agree 100%. The two party system is more destructive than beneficial. It encourages collusion and leads voters to choose between pairs of poor choices instead of supporting candidates who will truly represent their interests well.

I would like to see 3 or 5 major parties somewhat equally represented. The reason for that is that an odd number of parties of 3 or more would prevent any one single from having a majority and would force compromise. No doubt that system has its own drawbacks too. Unfortunately, there is no perfect system.

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

Democracy is not broken. It is thriving. This is because democracy is about giving people what they want, not what they need. And apparently, what people want in your country is what you are currently getting; heavily biased half-hour rants disguised as news shows looping over and over again 24/7, weak, useless policy aimed at pleasing the masses rather than progressing the country, useless arguments about a leader's race and religion rather than informed, objective discussion about the factors that will affect his actual performance, small, powerful special interests groups affecting or stalling useful policy because of shortsighted asinine greed, etc. etc.

 

[cubby1223]

People seem to have forgotten what Democracy means. It means that if you chose the losing side, you can voice your disapproval, but you can't expect to get your way. Threats of violence, even subtle threats, step way over the line, yet are becoming more common.

Yep, all those violent radical extremists who shouted at congressmen while remaining seated in their chairs at those town-hall meetings!

Quite interesting what you are saying. Are we voting for a representative who votes in favor of the people of our district, or are we voting for a representative who votes in favor of the party leaders? I'd prefer the former, while you clearly are advocating for the latter.

 

[irishScott]

The situation is what it is. I'd still rather live here than anywhere else on the planet. We just need another legitimate war or other threat to bind us together. That's more-or-less how things have worked in the past IIRC. Personally I think it'll happen when by some method ICBMs are rendered ineffective. Or the terrorists get a nuke or other WMD off somewhere.

As for the two party system, I think more and more people are getting fed up with it. In a couple of decades, if things continue I forsee the pretty defunct Centralist Party gaining power.

http://www.uscentrist.org/about/party/centrist-america/view

The problem with any moderate party is the lack of a solid platform. Moderates by definition disagree, however mildly, on a lot of issues.

Personally at this point I wouldn't be opposed the Libertarians gaining a significant minority in congress, just to get some sort of new blood in there.

 

[sandorski]

Yep, all those violent radical extremists who shouted at congressmen while remaining seated in their chairs at those town-hall meetings!

Quite interesting what you are saying. Are we voting for a representative who votes in favor of the people of our district, or are we voting for a representative who votes in favor of the party leaders? I'd prefer the former, while you clearly are advocating for the latter.

Selective Memory.

 

[sandorski]

The situation is what it is. I'd still rather live here than anywhere else on the planet. We just need another legitimate war or other threat to bind us together. That's more-or-less how things have worked in the past IIRC. Personally I think it'll happen when by some method ICBMs are rendered ineffective. Or the terrorists get a nuke or other WMD off somewhere.

As for the two party system, I think more and more people are getting fed up with it. In a couple of decades, if things continue I forsee the pretty defunct Centralist Party gaining power.

http://www.uscentrist.org/about/party/centrist-america/view

The problem with any moderate party is the lack of a solid platform. Moderates by definition disagree, however mildly, on a lot of issues.

Personally at this point I wouldn't be opposed the Libertarians gaining a significant minority in congress, just to get some sort of new blood in there.

Unsustainable and ultimately self-destructive. You need more than that if you want to survive.

 

[dmcowen674]

Both parties disgust me equally.

I don't believe you for a second.

As soon a Republicans regain control you will be 110% happy once again.

 

[Deleted member 4644]

.... has essentially paralyzed our democracy, and I dont see any way out of it without a major crisis. ....

I agree.

I am not sure exactly what is to blame for the situation, but I agree.

We are spending our time squabbling over INSANE BANAL TRIVIALITIES, like whether the Missile Defense Agency logo looks like Obama's campaign logo.

Meanwhile, jobs are vanishing overseas, states are going bankrupt, and the economy is still on the brink of collapse.

Fuck the masses. They are too stupid to understand basic economics (such as H-O and Ricardian trade theory). They are too stupid to understand basic tax law and theory. And they are too stupid to understand that free trade has assraped this country, and there is no "easy" fix.

Meanwhile, our politicians squabble over trivial details and haven't done a fucking thing to improve the country in well over a decade.

I think it will take a real economic crisis that turns into a political crisis to fix it. I just pray to god that we don't end up with communists or fascists running it all.

 

[Siddhartha]

First step - Throw out the progressives.

When did "progressives" become to hated group du jour?

One of the problems with or rather realities of a functional republic is that a lot of people one does not agree with have a voice in how the country is ran. I think this system of government is better than the alternatives.