leary about getting an AMD after reading this

[minofifa]

hey everybody,
sorry if this has been asked but I have to ask to be sure that i don't waste 400 buck on a new processor. I am getting a computer to use stricktly as a DAW (no internet or word processing or games or anything like that) just Music editing. I use cakewalk sonar for my production but a developer there posted the following:

SP2 adds a security feature called Data execution prevention (DEP) aka "NX memory" (NX = no execute). The idea is that viruses often enter a computer by coming in via a data buffer, and then injecting code into the data buffer and running that code. SP2 locks that down by only allowing true code pages to be run.

On later model AMD chips (the AMD 64 in particular), NX has hardware support. The chip itself will trigger an exception if a virus tries to run in data memory.

SONAR 3's (and earlier generations) mix engine uses self-generating/modifying code, which is equivalent to code running in data memory. After installing SP2, running SONAR may cause XP to warn about a Windows security problem.

should i stay away from AMD to avoid this problem? i will not be installing SP2 either. i have a feeling there will be problems with several of of my other plug ins and programs as well....

 

[MDE]

If you don't install SP2 then you don't have NX support at all. IMO, hardware NX support is a very good reason to buy an Athlon 64 and shouldn't discourage you from getting one in any way.

 

[dullard]

Intel will have the same thing at the end of this year. Thus are you going to avoid both AMD and Intel?

Just don't run SP2 and you'll have no problem.

 

[minofifa]

ohhh ok, i thought that the NX feature in the AMD cpu would be working even without SP2. I hope that we are not forced to instal SP2 in order to get later updates (as i'm sure we probably will be). There must be other people in a similar situation as me who won't benefit from this feature. It seems like a good idea for stopping viruses but it seems like a lot of headaches are going to arise from it.

 

[neutralizer]

Originally posted by: minofifa
hey everybody,
sorry if this has been asked but I have to ask to be sure that i don't waste 400 buck on a new processor. I am getting a computer to use stricktly as a DAW (no internet or word processing or games or anything like that) just Music editing. I use cakewalk sonar for my production but a developer there posted the following:

SP2 adds a security feature called Data execution prevention (DEP) aka "NX memory" (NX = no execute). The idea is that viruses often enter a computer by coming in via a data buffer, and then injecting code into the data buffer and running that code. SP2 locks that down by only allowing true code pages to be run.

On later model AMD chips (the AMD 64 in particular), NX has hardware support. The chip itself will trigger an exception if a virus tries to run in data memory.

SONAR 3's (and earlier generations) mix engine uses self-generating/modifying code, which is equivalent to code running in data memory. After installing SP2, running SONAR may cause XP to warn about a Windows security problem.

should i stay away from AMD to avoid this problem? i will not be installing SP2 either. i have a feeling there will be problems with several of of my other plug ins and programs as well....

that's a GOOD thing. not a bad thing.

 

[Megatomic]

Yes, it is a good thing. As in it was designed to do that. Why don't you want NX minofifa? Most of us can't wait to get it....

 

[minofifa]

that's a GOOD thing. not a bad thing

no its not, cause when i am recording and that message pops up and my track is interrupted, i will snap because that was the only good take i will ever do. Well its not that severe but still i don't want to have audio drop outs when recording everytime that sonar violates that NX thingy.

 

[sandorski]

I wonder if SP2 would be ok in this situation(don't really know) with the Security Settings on Low. That said, has anyone actually tested this software under these conditions yet to see what happens? Kinda sounds like it is just a warning of "possible" results and not an actually known issue.

 

[minofifa]

maybe i did not post enough of the article.

here is the rest

http://www.cakewalk.com/forum/tm.asp?m=192828

 

[lakefire]

If you don't have internet don't install any security stuff and don't keep the computer connected to the internet. You have nothing to worry about. Also don't download SP2 because thats' the main focus of the SP.

 

[Markfw]

XP SP2 is not out yet, and even if it was, you don't have to install it ! Then you have no problem. Or do this:

To prevent XP stopping SONAR, go to the system control panel and find the tab where DEP is configured. In there you are allowed to specify applications for which NX can be shut off. If you are using SONAR 3 you will need to add SONARPDR.EXE or SONARSTD.EXE to the list. Choose the appropriate name for the executable file.

 

[Carbonadium4]

Originally posted by: Markfw900
XP SP2 is not out yet, and even if it was, you don't have to install it ! Then you have no problem. Or do this:

To prevent XP stopping SONAR, go to the system control panel and find the tab where DEP is configured. In there you are allowed to specify applications for which NX can be shut off. If you are using SONAR 3 you will need to add SONARPDR.EXE or SONARSTD.EXE to the list. Choose the appropriate name for the executable file.

Thats weird, I hope my co-worker didn't download a beta and let us to that its a release.. lol..

Released What a big ass file.. 272 Megs... its like rewriting part of the OS
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=049C9DBE-3B8E-4F30-8245-9E368D3CDB5A&displaylang=en

 

[Oyeve]

I am sure AMD will have some sort of patch to fix this. I wouldnt worry.

 

[neutralizer]

Originally posted by: Carbonadium4

Originally posted by: Markfw900
XP SP2 is not out yet, and even if it was, you don't have to install it ! Then you have no problem. Or do this:

To prevent XP stopping SONAR, go to the system control panel and find the tab where DEP is configured. In there you are allowed to specify applications for which NX can be shut off. If you are using SONAR 3 you will need to add SONARPDR.EXE or SONARSTD.EXE to the list. Choose the appropriate name for the executable file.

Thats weird, I hope my co-worker didn't download a beta and let us to that its a release.. lol..

Released What a big ass file.. 272 Megs... its like rewriting part of the OS
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=049C9DBE-3B8E-4F30-8245-9E368D3CDB5A&displaylang=en

It's actually 266 MB and because it is cumulative, it includes sp1 updates. If you have been doing window updates, you shouldn't need sp2 except for the firewall, av, and nx bit.

 

[txxxx]

Originally posted by: dullard
Intel will have the same thing at the end of this year. Thus are you going to avoid both AMD and Intel?

Just don't run SP2 and you'll have no problem.

Nevermind : Markfw900 covered what I was saying.

 

[dmw16]

Im sure you will have to get SP2 @ some point. But I am also sure someone will put out a fix for the problem you are worried about. Stall getting SP2 as long as possible then when you have to, hope there is a fix. But dont hestitate to get an A64, they are great CPUs.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I really wouldn't worry about either issue. I don't have a system with NX features yet, but I think that I've read that you can actually turn off that feature, either on a per-program, or system-wide basis. Actually, I think I read about that on an emulation forum, since there are quite a few emulators that use dynamic code generation, which could also potentially trigger the NX-bit feature, if there was no way to disable it. I wouldn't be worried, it's actually an excellent feature to prevent viruses and worms from getting into a system through buffer overflows.

 

[CVSiN]

SP2 is out BTW as of last night =P

 

[NFactor]

The NX bit feature actually wouldn't give you any trouble. If you run SP2 and have a compatible processor you will see that there are two options for NX protection:
"Turn on DEP for essential Windows programs and services only" and "Turn on DEP for all programs and services except those I select". So basically if it is on the first setting it shouldn't prevent your audio program from working and if it is on the second you can tell Windows to not use NX protection on that particular program.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I thought Apple was great for this type of work?

 

[MDE]

Originally posted by: NFactor
The NX bit feature actually wouldn't give you any trouble. If you run SP2 and have a compatible processor you will see that there are two options for NX protection:
"Turn on DEP for essential Windows programs and services only" and "Turn on DEP for all programs and services except those I select". So basically if it is on the first setting it shouldn't prevent your audio program from working and if it is on the second you can tell Windows to not use NX protection on that particular program.

There's also a software DEP for non-NX chips that can be turned on\off\exceptions made.