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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
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Yea, the Golden rule, those who have the gold make the rules.

A guy like Sanders represents what those with all the gold fear. A return to a strong working class and FDR type policies

Give me the richest man on earth a million times over communist saviors. One has all the gold. The other has all the bodies.
 
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thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,054
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Sanders is a socialist/communist. He's got ideas that have no actual grounding in reality. That is unless you're willing to pay half your income in taxes to make all this free stuff happen.
Universal healthcare for example would SAVE money in the long term for the taxpayer. It will actually cost less than the system currently in place.

Whether you're paying out of your ass directly to a doctor/hospital/insurance company or paying a tax instead, it's still money out of your pocket whichever way you look at it.

And where are you getting your 50% tax number from?
 
May 13, 2009
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WTF are you talking about? Tutoring requires money, a lot of it. The kind of money that poor people don't have and never will. If we as a society decided that children with disabilities should get extra help through pooling our tax money for this specific purpose, how's that not accountability?
Yes it requires money. That's why you don't pop out numerous children with no plan for taking care of them.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
39,744
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Yes it requires money. That's why you don't pop out numerous children with no plan for taking care of them.

That's a mighty big brush you're painting with. Put your anecdotes away and address the topic at hand. The fact that you have to sue a school district to get what your child needs is just sad.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
39,744
20,313
146
Universal healthcare for example would SAVE money in the long term for the taxpayer. It will actually cost less than the system currently in place.

Whether you're paying out of your ass directly to a doctor/hospital/insurance company or paying a tax instead, it's still money out of your pocket whichever way you look at it.

And where are you getting your 50% tax number from?

Haha, OFT will just make up whatever anyways.
 
May 13, 2009
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That's a mighty big brush you're painting with. Put your anecdotes away and address the topic at hand. The fact that you have to sue a school district to get what your child needs is just sad.
Schools are under funded. End of story. Too many low income people that pay little to no taxes and decide they need 6 kids. There is no accountability. Parents should have to pay a fee for every child enrolled in school.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
39,744
20,313
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Schools are under funded. End of story. Too many low income people that pay little to no taxes and decide they need 6 kids. There is no accountability. Parents should have to pay a fee for every child enrolled in school.

We have no problem funneling money to our war machine, but as soon as healthcare or education comes up suddenly there's no funds.

Your continued assertion that the OP topic applies only to low income people with 6 kids is moronic, not true, and I can tell you first hand that it's a egregious assertion.
 
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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,001
571
126
Communism didn't lead to bodies...narcissistic despot strongmen (kinda like Trump) is what led to bodies.

The concentration of power concomitant with communism, coupled with a vengeance narrative ("poor" against the "rich", "oppressed" against "oppresser"), definitely leads to bodies.
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,054
2,271
126
Schools are under funded. End of story. Too many low income people that pay little to no taxes and decide they need 6 kids. There is no accountability. Parents should have to pay a fee for every child enrolled in school.
Or maybe instead of tax cuts that ended up in the hands of the already wealthy, that money could have been used to fund those "under funded" schools you mention.

Agreed on the accountability...people shouldn't have kids they can't afford. But really, schools aren't under funded just because some low income people have more than 2+ kids...they are underfunded because priorities for tax revenue are just wrong.
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
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Or the parents could step up and get tutoring for the child. Or that's right. That would require accountability.

Yes I know one mother has 6 kids and no real job to speak of... But she can't be blamed for that either.

This is a profoundly ignorant statement, which is an attempt to conveniently wave away family's and student's needs rather than reflect on your own fortune, empathy and compassion (or lack thereof.)

Personally, I am very thankful my children never had such learning or developmental disabilities, and I know these challenges were not brought about by other's moral failings, rather it was life's misfortunes.

But what do I know, I'm not a Trump Christian.
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,054
2,271
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The concentration of power concomitant with communism, coupled with a vengeance narrative (poor against the rich), definitely leads to bodies.
Poor against the rich revenge would lead to how many bodies? There weren't that many "rich" people in tsarist Russia for example to account for the millions of deaths after the rise of communism. No, it was not communism that led to the majority of the bodies....it was "strongmen" like Stalin obsessed with keeping power.

And this was brought up in another thread...what about slavery and capitalism? How many millions died through slavery pursued by capitalists trying to maximize profit?
 

Ajay

Lifer
Jan 8, 2001
16,094
8,114
136
Universal healthcare for example would SAVE money in the long term for the taxpayer. It will actually cost less than the system currently in place.

Whether you're paying out of your ass directly to a doctor/hospital/insurance company or paying a tax instead, it's still money out of your pocket whichever way you look at it.

And where are you getting your 50% tax number from?
Probably for Nordic countries. Anyway, no president is going to be able to implement a National Health Care service without raising taxes on all income groups except the bottom quintile. The point is that the 3rd and 4th quintile will be paying less in health care, hence offsetting the higher taxes. Anyway, while I was intrigued by medicare for all, I always return to wanting the German model for the US. It's working very well and should scale up pretty well given Germany has a population of about 85M. Switzerland (~8.5M) has a better system, but scaling that up would be a nightmare.
 
May 13, 2009
12,333
612
126
Universal healthcare for example would SAVE money in the long term for the taxpayer. It will actually cost less than the system currently in place.

Whether you're paying out of your ass directly to a doctor/hospital/insurance company or paying a tax instead, it's still money out of your pocket whichever way you look at it.

And where are you getting your 50% tax number from?
No thanks. I get free healthcare for me from my job. My wife gets hers very cheaply through her job. I have no interest in subsidizing healthcare for those that have no personal accountability. I already pay through the nose in school taxes yet have no children.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
39,744
20,313
146
No thanks. I get free healthcare for me from my job. My wife gets hers very cheaply through her job. I have no interest in subsidizing healthcare for those that have no personal accountability. I already pay through the nose in school taxes yet have no children.
Haha, classic FYGM.

Newsflash, free employer provided healthcare is very rare.

Even "cheap" or "inexpensive" healthcare isnt common.

You pay "thru the nose" because that's what a community requires, educating young people is in everyone's best interest.
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,054
2,271
126
No thanks. I get free healthcare for me from my job. My wife gets hers very cheaply through her job. I have no interest in subsidizing healthcare for those that have no personal accountability. I already pay through the nose in school taxes yet have no children.
You think your healthcare is "free"? Just because your paycheck doesnt have a line that say "medical fee/tax" doesn't mean you aren't paying for it. Guaranteed your employer is charging you somehow.

Until you are old and medical issues start popping up it won't make a difference to you. I'm single and in my mid-30s, living in Canada, and I have no qualms about paying higher taxes to support a single payer system. I know if I ever need to tap into the system it's there, and won't have me going broke.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Lifer
Dec 15, 2015
17,361
16,621
146
Schools are under funded. End of story. Too many low income people that pay little to no taxes and decide they need 6 kids. There is no accountability. Parents should have to pay a fee for every child enrolled in school.
I guess we should just start shooting them, right? Too much demand, not enough supply?
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
126
If you want to force taxpayers to fund your whackadoodle christian madrasa, they're still ready to roll.
Or the parents could step up and get tutoring for the child. Or that's right. That would require accountability.

Yes I know one mother has 6 kids and no real job to speak of... But she can't be blamed for that either.
This how you can have as many kids as you want, have the government pay for their religious schooling and the cowardly liberals who have no problem getting all separation of religion from state on them evil christian madrassa types stay silent.

Why is Lakewood spending $32M to send kids to private school?

By Kelly Heyboer | NJ Advance Media for NJ.com

LAKEWOOD — Attorney Michael Inzelbuch walked into court in Atlantic City a few weeks ago with the family of his latest client.

She was a little girl from an Orthodox Jewish family preparing to begin pre-K in Lakewood's public school system. Her evaluation said she had a long list of challenges – Down syndrome, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder and physical problems, including a limp.

Lakewood's experts said the school district could educate her in the district's Early Childhood Center, located in a series of trailers. But Inzelbuch argued the public school couldn't accommodate the girl's disabilities.

In the end, the judge agreed. Lakewood taxpayers will foot a higher bill to pay for the girl's private school tuition at one of the specialized schools in town run by members of the Orthodox Jewish community.

"I got them what they deserved. Nothing more. Nothing less," said Inzelbuch, who has sued the Lakewood district more than 100 times on behalf of special ed students. "They deserve an appropriate education."

Lakewood expects to spend nearly $32 million on tuition this year to send special education students -- including hundreds of members of the growing Orthodox Jewish community -- to private and out-of-district schools. The bill is among the highest in the state and one of the reasons the booming Ocean County town is facing a school funding crisis.
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2017/08/lakewood_inside_the_turmoil_in_njs_most_controvers.html


White welfare parents get government aid for their special needs and private religious schools while draining precious public school funds, black and brown people have to fight over the forever dwindling scraps and our social justice warrior liberals are pretty much silent.

But if an anti -LGBT private school gets funding out comes the torches and pitchforks
Anti-LGBT Florida schools getting school vouchers
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,239
136
Or the parents could step up and get tutoring for the child. Or that's right. That would require accountability.

Yes I know one mother has 6 kids and no real job to speak of... But she can't be blamed for that either.

This is where a clever conservative argument could be made for school choice and portability of tuition dollars (as already paid for by existing property taxes.)

Instead we have this defense of the status quo, fygm, and proposal to raise new taxes to punish working families and children with disabilities.

No wonder Trumpettes are losing the suburbs in droves.
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,239
136
I guess we should just start shooting them, right? Too much demand, not enough supply?

It's like they WANT to increase reliance on foreign born and educated workers to fill the skills and knowledge gap our underperforming education system is creating...
 
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brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,365
1,223
126
It's like they WANT to increase reliance on foreign born and educated workers to fill the skills and knowledge gap our underperforming education system is creating...
So we should keep letting the Progressives run the education system?