Leaders in Congress Agree on Auto Bailout Plan!

[Zim Hosein]

WASHINGTON ? Faced with staggering new unemployment figures, Democratic Congressional leaders said on Friday that they were ready to provide a short-term rescue plan for the cash-strapped American automakers, and expected to hold votes on the legislation during a special session next week.

Details of the rescue package were not immediately available but senior Congressional aides said that it would include billions of dollars in short-term loans to keep the automakers afloat at least until President-elect Barack Obama takes office.

Leaders in Congress Agree on Auto Bailout Plan

I & others who bought F & GM recently may make some money on their stocks after all!

 

[paulney]

Big surprise....
They just needed to do some fake posturing and public scolding on TV. Then they hand out money like a drunken sailor at a bar.

 

[schneiderguy]

:thumbsdown:

 

[Jumpem]

Terrible news. This is the one chance they had to shed the UAW.

 

[sunzt]

Wish I held on to those F stocks, but i sold at 2.70

 

[venkman]

yay!

I don't mind spending $6 on some GM stock.

 

[Eli]

So what if it doesn't pass the vote?

Hope they aren't counting their chickens before they hatch.

 

[Zim Hosein]

Originally posted by: venkman
yay!

I don't mind spending $6 on some GM stock.

GM closed at $4.08 a share today, you'll be able to buy more than one share for $6.00 venkman!

 

[venkman]

Originally posted by: Zim Hosein

Originally posted by: venkman
yay!

I don't mind spending $6 on some GM stock.

GM closed at $4.08 a share today, you'll be able to buy more than one share for $6.00 venkman!

err...I meant $6/share.

I'm sure all of the after hours/institutional/insider trading that goes on will push up the price before my sad little e-trade account can get me in on the action.

 

[mizzou]

oh thank god, now they can pay off my damn bonds that they owe me lol

 

[EMPshockwave82]

Originally posted by: Jumpem
Terrible news. This is the one chance they had to shed the UAW.

yep. I was hoping this was going to happen....


Anyone else wonder why US auto makers cant afford to make cars in the US and are closing down plants while foreign auto makers are building plants in the US? Man something doesnt seem right there. Basically the same product is being made just different management, processes and employees.

Edit: yes I know I'm greatly oversimplifying things here

 

[NL5]

Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82

Originally posted by: Jumpem
Terrible news. This is the one chance they had to shed the UAW.

yep. I was hoping this was going to happen....


Anyone else wonder why US auto makers cant afford to make cars in the US and are closing down plants while foreign auto makers are building plants in the US? Man something doesnt seem right there. Basically the same product is being made just different management, processes and employees.

Edit: yes I know I'm greatly oversimplifying things here

http://www.freep.com/article/2...COL14/812050400/?imw=Y

 

[EMPshockwave82]

Originally posted by: NL5

Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82

Originally posted by: Jumpem
Terrible news. This is the one chance they had to shed the UAW.

yep. I was hoping this was going to happen....


Anyone else wonder why US auto makers cant afford to make cars in the US and are closing down plants while foreign auto makers are building plants in the US? Man something doesnt seem right there. Basically the same product is being made just different management, processes and employees.

Edit: yes I know I'm greatly oversimplifying things here

http://www.freep.com/article/2...COL14/812050400/?imw=Y

From your link:
Myth No. 7: Their union workers are lazy and overpaid
Reality: Chrysler tied Toyota as the most productive automaker in North America this year, according to the Harbour Report on manufacturing, which measures the amount of work done per employee. Eight of the 10 most productive vehicle assembly plants in North America belong to Chrysler, Ford or GM.

The oft-cited $70-an-hour wage and benefit figure for UAW workers inaccurately adds benefits that millions of retirees get to the pay of current workers, but divides the total only by current employees. That's like assuming you get your parents' retirement and Social Security benefits in addition to your own income.

Hourly pay for assembly line workers tops out around $28; benefits add about $14. New hires at the Detroit Three get $14 an hour. There's no pension or health care when they retire, but benefits raise their total hourly compensation to $29 while they're working. UAW wages are now comparable with Toyota workers, according to a Free Press analysis.



Seen most of that before.... never seen the 70 dollar an hour wage figure. That doesnt even sound right and anyone who would have believed that is a total idiot. I have never thought the UAW workers were lazy and have never heard that they were. Either way, something fishy is going on with the US auto manufacturers and think it's wrong to bail them out. Also thought it was wrong to bail out the banks.

 

[sunzt]

Check out the Ford volumes in the last hour, someone knew something was up. However, GM didn't get the same end bounce.... perhaps F got a better deal or more money?

 

[Zim Hosein]

Originally posted by: sunzt
Check out the Ford volumes in the last hour, someone knew something was up. However, GM didn't get the same end bounce.... perhaps F got a better deal or more money?

I thought it was because F was in a better financial position from the start sunzt, of course I'm probably wrong

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82
Seen most of that before.... never seen the 70 dollar an hour wage figure. That doesnt even sound right and anyone who would have believed that is a total idiot. I have never thought the UAW workers were lazy and have never heard that they were. Either way, something fishy is going on with the US auto manufacturers and think it's wrong to bail them out. Also thought it was wrong to bail out the banks.

While a given worker doesn't cost them $70/hr, the worker PLUS the non-working pensioners (which are also collecting GM money) means that the effective "cost per worker" is much higher for GM than for Toyota.

The only way that I would be in support of a bailout is if it were 100% a loan, with a reasonable interest rate and payback period. There's some risk of a default, but it seems like a more fair way to structure it than the "buying" of worthless assets that Wall Street got.

Mind you, I'm no economist.

Still, I'd support the auto bailout over the Wall Street bailout. IMHO actual jobs and actual industrial capacity is more important to a country than transient money losses on paper. Those do affect real people, for sure, but not as much as primary production.

If GM goes under, thousands of people lose their jobs. If WaMu goes under, stockholders lose tons of money and customers lose a lot as well, but most people still actually have a job.

 

[Strk]

Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82

Originally posted by: Jumpem
Terrible news. This is the one chance they had to shed the UAW.

yep. I was hoping this was going to happen....


Anyone else wonder why US auto makers cant afford to make cars in the US and are closing down plants while foreign auto makers are building plants in the US? Man something doesnt seem right there. Basically the same product is being made just different management, processes and employees.

Edit: yes I know I'm greatly oversimplifying things here

Well, even when you combine all of the foreign automakers, they still don't have as many plants as just one of the big three. I don't even think they approach half of what they have.

 

[Chadder007]

They don't need to be handing them money. They need to come up with a plan to actually put people to work. With no cars needing to be built since sales have tanked, why would they and especially the suppliers to the Big 3 keep staff hired? People will still get laid off causing even less people to be out pushing the economy with purchases.

 

[SSSnail]

Magically, the bail-out amount somehow matched with this http://www.washingtonpost.com/...6/AR2007092600155.html.... Coincidence? I think not.

 

[sunzt]

Originally posted by: Zim Hosein

Originally posted by: sunzt
Check out the Ford volumes in the last hour, someone knew something was up. However, GM didn't get the same end bounce.... perhaps F got a better deal or more money?

I thought it was because F was in a better financial position from the start sunzt, of course I'm probably wrong

F had been stuck at 2.70-2.90 for the past few days and was steadily heading towards a 2.70ish finish today due to more than expected resistance to an auto bailout by congress. The news of the bailout came out after After Hours trading. It was unusual for such a heavy buy volume at the last 30 minutes with no new public news (or even rumors).

 

[SSSnail]

Originally posted by: sunzt

Originally posted by: Zim Hosein

Originally posted by: sunzt
Check out the Ford volumes in the last hour, someone knew something was up. However, GM didn't get the same end bounce.... perhaps F got a better deal or more money?

I thought it was because F was in a better financial position from the start sunzt, of course I'm probably wrong

F had been stuck at 2.70-2.90 for the past few days and was steadily heading towards a 2.70ish finish today due to more than expected resistance to an auto bailout by congress. The news of the bailout came out after After Hours trading. It was unusual for such a heavy buy volume at the last 30 minutes with no new public news (or even rumors).

Because the package is being worked on over the weekend and the announcement will be made Monday, expect the BIG jump then.

 

[NL5]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82
Seen most of that before.... never seen the 70 dollar an hour wage figure. That doesnt even sound right and anyone who would have believed that is a total idiot. I have never thought the UAW workers were lazy and have never heard that they were. Either way, something fishy is going on with the US auto manufacturers and think it's wrong to bail them out. Also thought it was wrong to bail out the banks.

While a given worker doesn't cost them $70/hr, the worker PLUS the non-working pensioners (which are also collecting GM money) means that the effective "cost per worker" is much higher for GM than for Toyota.

The biggest expense is healthcare. Toyota benefits massively from Japans national healthcare. So, should we level the playing field and provide GM workers with national healthcare?

It's ironic that most people arguing against the UAW (and the benefits they get), usually rally against National Healthcare, and say it should be provided by employers. A classic example of wanting to have your cake and eating it too.

 

[Chadder007]

What is the expected jump for shares?

 

[Queasy]

Originally posted by: NL5

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82
Seen most of that before.... never seen the 70 dollar an hour wage figure. That doesnt even sound right and anyone who would have believed that is a total idiot. I have never thought the UAW workers were lazy and have never heard that they were. Either way, something fishy is going on with the US auto manufacturers and think it's wrong to bail them out. Also thought it was wrong to bail out the banks.

While a given worker doesn't cost them $70/hr, the worker PLUS the non-working pensioners (which are also collecting GM money) means that the effective "cost per worker" is much higher for GM than for Toyota.

The biggest expense is healthcare. Toyota benefits massively from Japans national healthcare. So, should we level the playing field and provide GM workers with national healthcare?

It's ironic that most people arguing against the UAW (and the benefits they get), usually rally against National Healthcare, and say it should be provided by employers. A classic example of wanting to have your cake and eating it too.

If you compare Toyota American workers vs Ford/GM/Chrysler American workers, that's not the case.

 

[Train]

Originally posted by: Jumpem
Terrible news. This is the one chance they had to shed the UAW.

Too many of those congressmen took large donations from the UAW to let that happen.

Chrysler tried to shed the UAW in 1979 when the Fed bailed them out. Carter and the dems wouldnt allow them to hire non UAW, even though the UAW was strike.