Law Professor Bans Laptops in Class

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919

Originally posted by: Dedpuhl
What a bunch of brats. What did students do 30 years ago?

They need to purchase a tape recorder if they need "complete" notes.

this isn't 30 years ago.

The guys that sent us to the moon didn't use laptops in class. They did all that with a pencil, some graph paper, and a slide ruler.
You don't need technology to learn, in fact, it seems the more technology we use the less we really know about the basics.

 

[EyeMWing]

I'm sitting in class taking notes right now.

Err, actually, I'm neffing.

 

[Thump553]

Originally posted by: DonVito
As it happens, I was in the first class at my law school (UC-Hastings) in which laptops were allowed for use in exams, and in which they were frequently used for taking notes in class. I used mine for taking notes more or less the entire time.

Honestly, if I had it to do over again, I think I'd have been better off using a pen and pad, then transcribing my notes into an outline on the computer. That step of reorganization forces you to think, at least somewhat, about the material. Instead, I used outline bulleting in Word as I sat there in class, so I could easily create what appeared to be a respectable outline without an additional step. This was definitely a time saver, but that's not really what school, or learning, is about. Thank God we didn't have wireless internet when I was in law school, or I would have been completely nonproductive some sizable percentage of the time.

I totally agree. I went to law school before laptops (heck, it was before PCs). All the professors banned tape recorders and most discouraged extensive note taking. My law school (and most I think) was based upon the Socratic mehthod-the major purpose of legal training is teaching you how to think critically and while "on your feet" and less about conveying data.

The worst students were almost always the ones who were obsessed with note taking. Basically all they did was parrot back what they heard. You made notes on cases at home, brought them to class and added marginal comments as appropriate. Rewrite the notes after class, or at least review them.

This anecdote is true. My law school had two tests per year per course. The first was a practice one and didn't count. In Civil Procedure (one of the most significant courses) the professor allowed the final test to be an open book one, we could bring our pamphlet of civil procedures rules with as many marginal notes and markups (no additional pages) as we wanted. My copy was a masterpiece of markups and tiny notes. Unfortunately I lost my rules book on the way to the test and had to borrow a clean one from the library. I got one of the best scores on the test. Preparation and organized, critical thinking makes the lawyer-gadgets are too often used as crutches.

The professor is 100% correct here.

 

[Fenixgoon]

quite frankly, i think the whole idea of laptops in the class (at least at an early age) is absolutely ridiculous. there's nothing in gradeschool that makes a laptop critical.

in college, that's up to the teacher. most of my profs don't mind, but if they said "no laptops" i wouldn't care because i don't have one. pencil & paper FTW

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: swimscubasteve
I was less interested in the professor's actions but rather with the student's response. They filed a complaint the the ABA! WTF!

Law students are (albeit with many many exceptions) probably the worst class of human beings I've ever met, and I have worked as a criminal defense attorney! Something about the law-school environment (at least at my school) brings out the most petty, backbiting, arrogant side of a group of people who are, after all, aspiring lawyers. I saw acts of selfishness and petty cruelty in law school that were unlike anything I've ever experienced before or since.

 

[LanceM]

Originally posted by: mugs
I can see 30 laptops in a room being noisy and distracting. Besides, people have gotten by with a pencil and paper for hundreds of years. If these kids can't handle it, then they just suck.

People also got by without cars, and toothbrushes were made out of horse hair. Doesn't mean we should've stuck to those times.

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
quite frankly, i think the whole idea of laptops in the class (at least at an early age) is absolutely ridiculous. there's nothing in gradeschool that makes a laptop critical.

in college, that's up to the teacher. most of my profs don't mind, but if they said "no laptops" i wouldn't care because i don't have one. pencil & paper FTW

I agree. I keep hearing about needing more computers or laptops for schools to sign out to elementary school kids? WTF? A keyboarding class maybe, but WTF does a 4th grader need a laptop for? They need to learn multiplication tables, spelling, reading and all the basic stuff at that point...not how to play solitare while the teacher talks.

I love computers, but they sap at least as much productivity out of me as they boost.

 

[DevilsAdvocate]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: swimscubasteve
I was less interested in the professor's actions but rather with the student's response. They filed a complaint the the ABA! WTF!

Law students are (albeit with many many exceptions) probably the worst class of human beings I've ever met, and I have worked as a criminal defense attorney! Something about the law-school environment (at least at my school) brings out the most petty, backbiting, arrogant side of a group of people who are, after all, aspiring lawyers. I saw acts of selfishness and petty cruelty in law school that were unlike anything I've ever experienced before or since.

I agree. That is precisely why I turned down a job at my law school. I had no desire to work with law students.

 

[Ryan]

Good - people with laptops are distracting, rude, and inconsiderate of other students.

 

[Horus]

Originally posted by: swimscubasteve
"MEMPHIS, Tenn. - A University of Memphis law professor has banned laptop computers from her classroom and her students are passing a petition against it.

Professor June Entman says her main concern is that students are so busy keyboarding they can't think and analyze what she's telling them.

Students have begun collecting signatures on petitions and tried unsuccessfully to file a complaint with the American Bar Association.

Student Cory Winsett says if he must continue without his laptop, he'll transfer to another school. Winsett says he won't be able to keep up if he has to rely on hand-written notes, which he says are incomplete and less organized."


link



talk about a sense of entitlement

You're an idiot. By typing on my laptop, I'm able to keep up WAY faster on my notes. I don't THINK about typing, it comes naturally. Therefore, I'm able to have much more coherent thoughts, and am able to think much quicker.

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: Horus

Originally posted by: swimscubasteve
"MEMPHIS, Tenn. - A University of Memphis law professor has banned laptop computers from her classroom and her students are passing a petition against it.

Professor June Entman says her main concern is that students are so busy keyboarding they can't think and analyze what she's telling them.

Students have begun collecting signatures on petitions and tried unsuccessfully to file a complaint with the American Bar Association.

Student Cory Winsett says if he must continue without his laptop, he'll transfer to another school. Winsett says he won't be able to keep up if he has to rely on hand-written notes, which he says are incomplete and less organized."


link



talk about a sense of entitlement

You're an idiot. By typing on my laptop, I'm able to keep up WAY faster on my notes. I don't THINK about typing, it comes naturally. Therefore, I'm able to have much more coherent thoughts, and am able to think much quicker.

Nevermind that you're a huge distraction to the rest of the class.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Ryan

Nevermind that you're a huge distraction to the rest of the class.

I really don't agree with that at all. I have never found other people's laptops distracting, nor have I ever heard of a professor (other than this one) who has lodged that complaint. As I said, I don't think people using laptops in law school are doing themselves much of a favor, but I don't see it as a problem for others in general.

 

[swimscubasteve]

Originally posted by: Horus

Originally posted by: swimscubasteve
"MEMPHIS, Tenn. - A University of Memphis law professor has banned laptop computers from her classroom and her students are passing a petition against it.

Professor June Entman says her main concern is that students are so busy keyboarding they can't think and analyze what she's telling them.

Students have begun collecting signatures on petitions and tried unsuccessfully to file a complaint with the American Bar Association.

Student Cory Winsett says if he must continue without his laptop, he'll transfer to another school. Winsett says he won't be able to keep up if he has to rely on hand-written notes, which he says are incomplete and less organized."


link



talk about a sense of entitlement

You're an idiot. By typing on my laptop, I'm able to keep up WAY faster on my notes. I don't THINK about typing, it comes naturally. Therefore, I'm able to have much more coherent thoughts, and am able to think much quicker.

Be that as it may, my point was that the student's are being pricks. I made no comment about whether or not it is easier to us a laptop to take notes.

 

[TheAdvocate]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: swimscubasteve
I was less interested in the professor's actions but rather with the student's response. They filed a complaint the the ABA! WTF!

Law students are (albeit with many many exceptions) probably the worst class of human beings I've ever met, and I have worked as a criminal defense attorney! Something about the law-school environment (at least at my school) brings out the most petty, backbiting, arrogant side of a group of people who are, after all, aspiring lawyers. I saw acts of selfishness and petty cruelty in law school that were unlike anything I've ever experienced before or since.

Seconded. And there is something about the environment itself which encourages people to take extreme stands on every imaginable issue. I think it's just the collection of too many type A personalities vying for attention and peer adolation. I grew to hate it by the time I was a 2L and managed to stay blissfully apathetic as a 3L by spending as little time in the law building as possible.

 

[theknight571]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

The guys that sent us to the moon didn't use laptops in class. They did all that with a pencil, some graph paper, and a slide ruler.
You don't need technology to learn, in fact, it seems the more technology we use the less we really know about the basics.

I thought they used camera tricks and movie studios to send us to the moon.

j/k lol

 

[Shadowknight]

Originally posted by: Ryan
Good - people with laptops are distracting, rude, and inconsiderate of other students.

I had a professor in a graduate-level accounting class last semester was was furious that some people were using their laptops during a guest presentation the prior week. I used mine 2 or 3 times for a few seconds to see if he had posted the handouts on the class webpage. The rest of the time, I kept the screen pulled down so that it was almost in the locked position. I didn't pay attention to others, but I thought that was reasonable as long as it was for very short periods or time. On the otherhand, those that were screwing around with their laptops during most of the presentation, I could see his point.

 

[ParStyles]

I think it's cute that they are already training to sue to get what they want.
Isn't that how the profession works?

 

[krunchykrome]

don't think they're brats. Half of the students in my classes bring laptops to their small classes and large lectures. Whether they use them during class for notes or surfing the internet, all students in college are entitled to bring them to class. This is not high school.

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: krunchykrome
don't think they're brats. Half of the students in my classes bring laptops to their small classes and large lectures. Whether they use them during class for notes or surfing the internet, all students in college are entitled to bring them to class. This is not high school.

What entitles them to use them? Why should a laptop be allowed at the expense of disruption to the rest of the class?

I attend a small college - most of my classes (outside of major required courses) have been limited to 20 students per class, with a maximum of 30. A laptop is a major distraction for most students.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: LanceM

Originally posted by: mugs
I can see 30 laptops in a room being noisy and distracting. Besides, people have gotten by with a pencil and paper for hundreds of years. If these kids can't handle it, then they just suck.

People also got by without cars, and toothbrushes were made out of horse hair. Doesn't mean we should've stuck to those times.

<---------- my point





^ your head

 

[cliftonite]

Originally posted by: Ryan

Originally posted by: krunchykrome
don't think they're brats. Half of the students in my classes bring laptops to their small classes and large lectures. Whether they use them during class for notes or surfing the internet, all students in college are entitled to bring them to class. This is not high school.

What entitles them to use them? Why should a laptop be allowed at the expense of disruption to the rest of the class?

I attend a small college - most of my classes (outside of major required courses) have been limited to 20 students per class, with a maximum of 30. A laptop is a major distraction for most students.

how is it a distraction

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: cliftonite

Originally posted by: Ryan

Originally posted by: krunchykrome
don't think they're brats. Half of the students in my classes bring laptops to their small classes and large lectures. Whether they use them during class for notes or surfing the internet, all students in college are entitled to bring them to class. This is not high school.

What entitles them to use them? Why should a laptop be allowed at the expense of disruption to the rest of the class?

I attend a small college - most of my classes (outside of major required courses) have been limited to 20 students per class, with a maximum of 30. A laptop is a major distraction for most students.

how is it a distraction

The typing and clicking of the keyboard is a major disruption. I've only had one guy try to use a laptop in my classes - the stares of distraction from other students were enough to make him not use it again.

 

[RKS]

My law school went wireless during my 1st year.

Some professors did not like laptops in class and walked up and down the isles to make sure the students were not playing solitare or looking at porn, other professors had presentations on powerpoint that could be downloaded and referenced during class.

Laptops were never distracting to me even though I didn't use one in class due to my lack of typing skills. Students should use whatever medium works best for them.

BTW Ohio has recently begun allowing graduates to take the bar exam on laptops, some people actually think/organize/compose better with a keyboard rather than paper and pen. It certainly makes it easier to organize an answer but like I mentioned I type too slow for me to take advantage of this testing opportunity.

 

[Babbles]

I think that if students rely on a laptop for their education, then they are totally missing the point in regards to learning. Additionally there is a larger life lesson that these students have managed to gloriously miss: life isn't fair, you don't always get your way.

 

[daniel1113]

Originally posted by: Ryan
The typing and clicking of the keyboard is a major disruption. I've only had one guy try to use a laptop in my classes - the stares of distraction from other students were enough to make him not use it again.

Right. I use my laptop every day in all of my courses, and have never received a look from other students or a complaint from a professor. There is no way a laptop is any more distracting than anything else in a course. If you don't like them, don't use one. The same advice goes to the professors that think they have a right to ban laptops in their courses. I long for the day when professors and universities realize that they are providing a service and students are the customers.