Late 6970?

[betasub]

Um, ok. I'm convinced onboard video is the way to go for me. :thumbsup:

LOL, his follow-up will be to sell you some of those hangers and shirts. All genuine branded, of course.

 

[WelshBloke]

Do you have an xbox? http://www.engadget.com/2010/08/24/microsoft-details-vejle-the-new-xbox-360s-system-on-chip-archi/

What!!! No!!!!!

How very dare you!!!!





:sneaky:







And welcome to the forums

 

[betasub]

^ My bad. It's an xbox that he wants you to buy.

 

[T2k]

So what? In ten years onboard video may approach cards of today? Is that what your saying?



I dont want to game with a 5570/450 now or in the future.

I give up here and I don't think anyone can help you here - your problems are unrelated to video cards.

 

[Arkadrel]

It is.... In a thread where its relevant, you know, like the CPU sub-forum or a whole new thread. how did a thread about the 6970 being late turn into a thread about APUs? Seriously?
.

Think it started with a interveiw saying Amd was expecting the 580 to perform as it did, and have a product ready to counter it atleast on the price front.

talk of prices on the upcomeing 6970.. and the 580s being abit high.

makaveli made some comment on nvidia being a profitable company and amd not.

Aristotelian makes a comment back about apples 2 apples, when nvidia start makeing cpus bla bla bla.

makaveli says that ll never happend because of Intel not giveing a license to nvidia.

Aristotelian, says both companys are gonna be around for awhile so neither are doomed.

T2K mentions cude as nvidias future, APUs impact on future of grafics cards..

it goes on from there...

 

[cotak13]

What!!! No!!!!!

How very dare you!!!!





:sneaky:







And welcome to the forums

Thanks!

Been on this forum since the 90s but haven't posted in years and forgotten my password and the email the account it was attached to is long since gone (think it was a university account).

Anyhow not suggesting discrete will go the dino way soon. Just that in the long run a lot of people will run integrated because it's cheaper and works for them.

 

[AnandThenMan]

They already cater to special solutions. So what is your point? AMD will have a low performing APU that runs an OS. Nvidia will have a high performing GPGPU that runs specialized applications. Just like how it is today, except in 5 years.

That's not how it works. There is a convergence point, and a point of diminishing returns. More and more solutions will be satisfied by the processor alone, and no Nvidia hardware will be required, expect for the highest end solutions.

 

[Genx87]

That's not how it works. There is a convergence point, and a point of diminishing returns. More and more solutions will be satisfied by the processor alone, and no Nvidia hardware will be required, expect for the highest end solutions.

Just like today. What mainstream consumer grade product is utilizing cuda, DC, or OpenCL? The most utilized GPGPU applications are professional grade products. Where an APU will never be satisfactory.

 

[SolMiester]

deleted

 

[AnandThenMan]

Just like today. What mainstream consumer grade product is utilizing cuda, DC, or OpenCL? The most utilized GPGPU applications are professional grade products. Where an APU will never be satisfactory.

Kinda like where onboard sound will never be good enough, everyone will still want a discreet sound card.

BTW, I am not talking about consumer grade stuff, which is why I suggested you look at AMD's processor roadmap. And you discount the efficiency gains of an APU vs. a CPU/discreet solution. We'll have to agree to disagree, but I find your assertions very short sighted.

Using absolutes like will never be satisfactory is dangerous thinking at best, like no one will ever need more than 640K.

 

[cotak13]

Just like today. What mainstream consumer grade product is utilizing cuda, DC, or OpenCL? The most utilized GPGPU applications are professional grade products. Where an APU will never be satisfactory.

Once upon a time the FPU was a separate chip too only used by "professional".

3Dfx, dead because they insists on sticking to the separate card method for too long. Dead because Nvidia in particular made good enough integrated 1 card video solutions.

Desktops, used to dominate the market. Laptops were specialized machines used by "professionals". Now laptops and mobile sales exceeds desktops.

Ethernet cards, used to be discrete too for everyone. Now hard to find a motherboard that doesn't have at least 1 port built in.

Sun microsystem used to be big in the server space. They still have a decent market share. But a lot of places have found PC servers made from commodity parts to be more than enough for their needs.

 

[Makaveli]

1) You talked about their (Nvidia or AMD) potentially failing before I wrote what you quoted.

2) You brought up the topic of companies and profitability in a thread meant to discuss the supposed lateness of the 6970.

Let me help you remember, okay? Charitable act for the day with respect to reading comprehension:



That was:

1) Your first post in this thread.
2) An attempt to counteract T2K's claim regarding Nvidia's dwindling revenues. (I understand this)
3) Your subsequent counterfactual made no sense, and you brought up the companies failing prior to my having mentioned it! So don't say you brought it up to address me! I, in fact, was addressing your meaningless counterfactual! Here it is:

"If anyone is allowed to fail and still survive it would be Nvidia not AMD they have way more cash in hand!"

My 'sorry' did not entail your having an agenda, but rather that you're seeing AMD in a negative light. The 'sorry' was for 'bursting your bubble', not for, as you might think, supporting Nvidia.

And with respect to the lateness of the 6970, either post an official announcement from AMD saying that the card was meant to ship on X, but won't, or think twice about declaring a product that was not promised by X to be 'late'. Or is 'late' presumed because the 580 is out? It's unclear, to me.

I won't bother to continue this because it will just derail the thread my post was meant for T2K and he provided answers and the reason why he thought so. You will believe what you will and so will I, I would also work on the tone abit you sound like a Jerk

when you say shit like this.

"Let me help you remember, okay? Charitable act for the day with respect to reading comprehension"

Now back on topic.

 

[WelshBloke]

I give up here and I don't think anyone can help you here - your problems are unrelated to video cards.

Promise? :sneaky:

 

[Aristotelian]

I won't bother to continue this because it will just derail the thread my post was meant for T2K and he provided answers and the reason why he thought so. You will believe what you will and so will I, I would also work on the tone abit you sound like a Jerk

when you say shit like this.

"Let me help you remember, okay? Charitable act for the day with respect to reading comprehension"

Now back on topic.

The thing is, you're simply wrong about who your post was meant for, and I'm either a) tired of your lying or b) tired of your illiteracy. In fact, you had already replied to T2K's post when I posted, and your next post was a direct response to my post.

Look at the post sequence in this thread at:

Post 120 (T2K)
Post 121 (Makaveli, direct quote of T2K)
Post 122 (Aristotelian, direct quote of Makaveli)
Post 123 (Directly referencing PRODUCTION after I, in post 122, mentioned that AMD produce CPUs in addition to GPUs).

Yet, your post 123 was meant for T2K?
^
This is why you think I sound like a jerk. I've basically shown you that you are wrong. There is no 'subjectivity' here. And you had to change your story twice to avoid my point. I'm sorry if you don't like the facts, but this isn't about personal belief.

Now quit saying that your post at 123 wasn't addressing me, because it's obvious that it was, whether or not you quoted me.

Now, for the people who actually want to talk about the supposed lateness of the 6970, I posited this a few posts ago (at post 170):

And with respect to the lateness of the 6970, either post an official announcement from AMD saying that the card was meant to ship on X, but won't, or think twice about declaring a product that was not promised by X to be 'late'. Or is 'late' presumed because the 580 is out? It's unclear, to me.

Who says it's late?

 

[Makaveli]

Dude do you ever stop I dropped it and you keep going.

My original post was for T2k then you decided to put in your 2c which I never asked for.

So then I responded to you.

 

[Arkadrel]

Once upon a time the FPU was a separate chip too only used by "professional".

3Dfx, dead because they insists on sticking to the separate card method for too long. Dead because Nvidia in particular made good enough integrated 1 card video solutions.

Desktops, used to dominate the market. Laptops were specialized machines used by "professionals". Now laptops and mobile sales exceeds desktops.

Ethernet cards, used to be discrete too for everyone. Now hard to find a motherboard that doesn't have at least 1 port built in.

Sun microsystem used to be big in the server space. They still have a decent market share. But a lot of places have found PC servers made from commodity parts to be more than enough for their needs.

I find this interresting... Im not sure you can just rule out discrete grafics cards though... the low-mid might disapear at some point, maybe even the mid-high... but I doubt the absolute top will ever be on a cpu chip.

Still people are right... thread was supposed to be about the rumor from fudzilla about a late 6970.
*afaik amd has released any offical launch date for the thing... so hard to say when its "late". Rumors specualated around the 22th of november I believe.

 

[AnandThenMan]

... but I doubt the absolute top will ever be on a cpu chip.

It won't. But the R&D dollars to enable the top end hardware will come from the volume products. Conversely, the tech in the flagship units will trickle down into the mainstream.

 

[Genx87]

Kinda like where onboard sound will never be good enough, everyone will still want a discreet sound card.

BTW, I am not talking about consumer grade stuff, which is why I suggested you look at AMD's processor roadmap. And you discount the efficiency gains of an APU vs. a CPU/discreet solution. We'll have to agree to disagree, but I find your assertions very short sighted.

Using absolutes like will never be satisfactory is dangerous thinking at best, like no one will ever need more than 640K.

Professionals demand the highest performance they can get. AFAIK AMD doesnt have a roadmap out far enough to put their APU in the high end of graphics processors. Until they do, their APU will never be satisfactory for professional level work.

 

[Genx87]

Once upon a time the FPU was a separate chip too only used by "professional".

3Dfx, dead because they insists on sticking to the separate card method for too long. Dead because Nvidia in particular made good enough integrated 1 card video solutions.

Desktops, used to dominate the market. Laptops were specialized machines used by "professionals". Now laptops and mobile sales exceeds desktops.

Ethernet cards, used to be discrete too for everyone. Now hard to find a motherboard that doesn't have at least 1 port built in.

Sun microsystem used to be big in the server space. They still have a decent market share. But a lot of places have found PC servers made from commodity parts to be more than enough for their needs.

Your examples have little to do with the topic at hand.

 

[Makaveli]

Genx87

question do you think AMD will eventually enter that market once we possibly have a few generations of fusion products with us?

Or will they just continue to fight it out with NV on the consumer/gaming market.

 

[Daedalus685]

Professionals demand the highest performance they can get. AFAIK AMD doesnt have a roadmap out far enough to put their APU in the high end of graphics processors. Until they do, their APU will never be satisfactory for professional level work.

Depends on what kind of professional work.

I can certainly see APUs finding a home in HPCs.

But no, a graphics designer will likely never use an APU alone, at least not any of the 'first generation' products.

 

[Genx87]

AMD already competes with Nvidia with their Firepro line in the Professional level market. The problem is it isnt very good from a drivers or functionality aspect. Thus Nvidia owns 90% of the market with their quadro line. If AMD gets its act together in the professional space. I dont see why they would be utilizing a sub 100 dollar chip to do it. They may have a firepro built around an APU. But it wont resemble the sub 100 part imo.

 

[WelshBloke]

Genx87

question do you think AMD will eventually enter that market once we possibly have a few generations of fusion products with us?

Or will they just continue to fight it out with NV on the consumer/gaming market.

Amd are in that market, they just aren't that successful in it.

I think they will concentrate on pinning down the laptop market first with fusion.

 

[AnandThenMan]

AMD already competes with Nvidia with their Firepro line in the Professional level market. The problem is it isnt very good from a drivers or functionality aspect. Thus Nvidia owns 90% of the market with their quadro line. If AMD gets its act together in the professional space. I dont see why they would be utilizing a sub 100 dollar chip to do it. They may have a firepro built around an APU. But it wont resemble the sub 100 part imo.

Your thinking seems to be very tightly confined to what the structure of the current market is, you need to think about how the market is evolving.

And the examples cited have everything to do with this.

 

[Arkadrel]

Yeah I can see amd stealing even more of the laptop/notebook market share (when they launch the APUs)... instead of haveing 61% amd might raise to like ~80%+. It might even effect the low end desktops abit, so they take abit of market share on that front too.

The apu wont have any effect on the mid-high, as I see it.


Almost forgot... Intel is gonna take on the low end desktop market too... nvidia/amd might lose abit of sales to that.
You might laugh at intel grafics solutions so far, but I wouldnt underestimate intel, they ll catch up at some point.