Laptop and Linux

[MikeA]

What should I install on a laptop that has a 486 100mhz, 24mb RAM, 1mb video, 500meg HD, 4x CDROM, 640x480 16bit LCD? I haven't really used Linux before. I'm planning on using this laptop for FTP, MP3, SNES, internet, and instant messaging (maybe other emulators too, if it's fast enough to run them) and that's about it. I just wanna get the max performance out of it (I'll need all the performance I can get) and not loose my mind trying to install/setup the OS. A simple/fast GUI is also needed. Thanks for any help.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Whatever you decide to go with, stick with a lightweight window manager. Blackbox (and clones), Window Maker, IceWM, and several others will fit the bill. They may even be usable. Id recommend Slackware or Debian, but some people dont take the time to read the documentation and think the install is hard.

 

[jonmullen]

Something of the 2.2.x kernal is what I would go with. Like Redhat 5.1.

 

[MikeA]

Thanks for the suggestions monkey and jon. What would the pro's and con's be of slackware or debian, and the window managers blackbox, window maker, and icewm. Anything else I should check out? Thanks again.

 

[ProviaFan]

Originally posted by: MikeA
Thanks for the suggestions monkey and jon. What would the pro's and con's be of slackware or debian, and the window managers blackbox, window maker, and icewm. Anything else I should check out? Thanks again.

Not used slackware, so can't really comment there, but Debian is very easy to maintain after getting through the install (which is not too bad if you read the docs). Once you get it installed, installing programs is very easy: just go to a command prompt and do apt-cache search whatyouarelookingfor. Then, type apt-get install the_real_name_of_your_program. Not bad, huh?

Oh, and I second the light window manager suggestion - KDE 3 or GNOME 2 would be way too much for your poor old laptop.

 

[Nothinman]

Something of the 2.2.x kernal is what I would go with. Like Redhat 5.1.

I'd want something in the 2.4 range just for the newer APM (although not great) support. The kernel version won't affect it too much, what software you run on top of it will.

 

[ProviaFan]

Originally posted by: Nothinman

Something of the 2.2.x kernal is what I would go with. Like Redhat 5.1.

I'd want something in the 2.4 range just for the newer APM (although not great) support. The kernel version won't affect it too much, what software you run on top of it will.

The Linux kernel 2.4 is best due to more hardware support; the kernel itself won't take up much more RAM unless all sorts of extras are compiled in (ala Redhat). I also dislike having a kernel that uses the video framebuffer for text display (ala the particular ISO that I used to net-install debian) as that makes things very slow, especially in VMWare. Yes, I should recompile my kernel; no, it's still "broke" because I've been too busy to get it done yet.

 

[MGMorden]

I'm running Knoppix on my laptop personally (a HP Pavilion ze4115). It's working great, though the APM stuff isn't built into the kernel. It might be available as a module but I didn't check (only had the laptop 2 days, haven't played around with it too much). I personally tried Slackware (my favorite distro) and couldn't get it to work (well, Slackware worked but I had troubled configuring X. the XF86Config that I setup wouldn't work and the autoconfig kept locking up the machine). Knoppix is pretty cool though. You might take a look at it. The latest CD is pretty fast and complete and you can use it to get an idea of compatibility with your laptop with Linux. (BUT, I just rembered after getting to the bottom of this message. there's no option to install seperate parts of Knoppix, and the install won't fit on that 500meg hard drive. you can still use it to check compatibility, but installation is out. try Debian if you want a similiar system if you like knoppix).

Definately take noc's advice on window managers though. I'm personally a fan of Window Maker when I'm feeling minimalist, but many others here like Blackbox and/or Fluxbox a lot, so you might want to try those to see which you like.

As to SNES emulation, a 486 100mhz isn't your best choice, but I'm sure you can't change that. The only emulator that I remember being able to run at anything close to decent on that type of hardware was Nerlaska, which I don't believe they ever made for Linux (and it's compatibility rate wasn't great anyways). Most of the emulators of old required at least a 200mhz Pentium to run well (once upon a time I upgraded my processor/MB from a Cyrix 5x86 100mhz to a Cyrix 6x86 PR200 almost solely for Snes9x ). I'm not sure about requirements on the newer stuff as it's been a while since I've really needed to check (that 200mhz mark seems trivial nowadays).

 

[MikeA]

Thanks a lot for all your help guys I knew I'd have some great help asking my question here. I'm gonna go download the latest version of Debian, but still unsure of which window maker to use. Heard blackbox mentioned a lot, so I'll give that a go first. Another quick question, is there a port of Wolfenstein 3d (maybe some other good games too) on Linux? I used to play that game none stop back in the day when it came out (and that was on a 386 (or was it a 286, can't remember), so it should run speedy ), wouldn't mind giving it a go again.

 

[Nothinman]

the kernel itself won't take up much more RAM unless all sorts of extras are compiled in (ala Redhat)

RedHat compiles everything as a module, so anything you don't load isn't using any memory.

I also dislike having a kernel that uses the video framebuffer for text display (ala the particular ISO that I used to net-install debian) as that makes things very slow, especially in VMWare.

I don't like the framebuffer myself, but it's used on the Debian installer for international language support.

 

[MikeA]

Didn't know debian was 7 CDs! :Q Do I just need to download the first to install it, and the other 6 CDs are just extra packages? What would be the best programs (small size, remember <500 meg limit) to install as far as internet browser, ftp client, media player (mp3), simple word processing, etc. Which one of the windows managers takes up the least space and least serouces, yet isn't completely useless? Forget the SNES and other emulators, I figured I would need more horsepower, but was worth asking. Sorry for all the questions, your help is greatly appreciated Thanks once more.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: MikeA
Thanks a lot for all your help guys I knew I'd have some great help asking my question here. I'm gonna go download the latest version of Debian, but still unsure of which window maker to use. Heard blackbox mentioned a lot, so I'll give that a go first. Another quick question, is there a port of Wolfenstein 3d (maybe some other good games too) on Linux? I used to play that game none stop back in the day when it came out (and that was on a 386 (or was it a 286, can't remember), so it should run speedy ), wouldn't mind giving it a go again.

quake was ported.

Didn't know debian was 7 CDs! :Q Do I just need to download the first to install it, and the other 6 CDs are just extra packages?

Read the install docs, they might answer this question and are *necessary* for "new to Debian" users. I know that one from personal experience

What would be the best programs (small size, remember <500 meg limit) to install as far as internet browser,

Phoenix maybe? Or Opera.

ftp client,

A CLI ftp client is installed, it should be fine.

media player (mp3),

mpg321

simple word processing,

OpenOffice, AbiWord, TeX stuff

etc. Which one of the windows managers takes up the least space and least serouces, yet isn't completely useless?

Blackbox (and clones), WindowMaker, IceWM.

Forget the SNES and other emulators, I figured I would need more horsepower, but was worth asking. Sorry for all the questions, your help is greatly appreciated Thanks once more.

 

[MikeA]

Thanks again monkey

"Read the install docs, they might answer this question and are *necessary* for "new to Debian" users. I know that one from personal experience "
I read up to page 7 (out of 10?) without it ever mentioned what exactly I need to download. It just pointed me to the download page a few times. So I know how to setup all the hardware, install packages, etc, and don't even know what I need to download

Here is what I mean,
"1.5 Getting Debian
For information on how to download Debian GNU/Linux from the Internet or from whom official Debian CDs can be purchased, see the distribution web page. The list of Debian mirrors contains a full set of official Debian mirrors.

Debian can be upgraded after installation very easily. The installation procedure will help setup up the system so that you can make those upgrades once installation is complete, if need be."

"OpenOffice, AbiWord, TeX stuff"
Which one would you personaly recommend (like the most)?

"Blackbox (and clones), WindowMaker, IceWM."
Same for these three.

Thanks

 

[ProviaFan]

Originally posted by: MikeA
Here is what I mean,
"1.5 Getting Debian
For information on how to download Debian GNU/Linux from the Internet or from whom official Debian CDs can be purchased, see the distribution web page. The list of Debian mirrors contains a full set of official Debian mirrors.

Debian can be upgraded after installation very easily. The installation procedure will help setup up the system so that you can make those upgrades once installation is complete, if need be."

If the laptop has a modem / network connection, you can download a small CD image or set of floppy images, which, once booted, will download only the programs that you select. Usually it only has to download between 100 to 200 MB for a basic installation.

 

[MikeA]

Yes I know jliechty, but the problem is; I have an IBM 16/4 CardBus Adapter, but for some reason it will not go in all the way into either of the PCMCIA slots (fits and works fine in a newer Toshiba laptop). I have no idea why, maybe one of you guys knows (are there different standards I don't know about, like pin count, because the card physically is the same size, and goes all the way in until the end right when it hits the pins).

 

[mjquilly]

"Blackbox (and clones), WindowMaker, IceWM."
Same for these three.

Thanks

I recall having problems getting Blackbox working correctly. I tried fluxbox and it worked w/o a hitch, I liked it, so I stayed with it. It's very lightweight. I'm not saying that Blackbox is tricky in anyway, just my personal exprience.

 

[MikeA]

Thanks for your input mjquilly. I have a feeling I'm gonna end up trying them all out, not getting any concrete pro's/con's of each.

The laptop supports Type II and Type III PCMCIA cards. The card that won't fit is a Type I/Type II. I have no clue anymore... a friend is gonna lend me one to try tomorrow, see how that goes.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: MikeA
Thanks again monkey

"Read the install docs, they might answer this question and are *necessary* for "new to Debian" users. I know that one from personal experience "
I read up to page 7 (out of 10?) without it ever mentioned what exactly I need to download. It just pointed me to the download page a few times. So I know how to setup all the hardware, install packages, etc, and don't even know what I need to download

Here is what I mean,
"1.5 Getting Debian
For information on how to download Debian GNU/Linux from the Internet or from whom official Debian CDs can be purchased, see the distribution web page. The list of Debian mirrors contains a full set of official Debian mirrors.

Debian can be upgraded after installation very easily. The installation procedure will help setup up the system so that you can make those upgrades once installation is complete, if need be."

I said might because I couldnt remember

"OpenOffice, AbiWord, TeX stuff"
Which one would you personaly recommend (like the most)?

I have only used OpenOffice, and that was in Windows. It was alright.

"Blackbox (and clones), WindowMaker, IceWM."
Same for these three.

I am a bb fan. The clones do not interrest me, although they have more features (stuff I consider unnecessary for my use, but could be extremely useful for others). WindowMaker was nice, but I didnt spend enough time with it to get a good feel of it. IceWM was too Windowsish for me.

 

[mjquilly]

Also, you might want to get your hands on a copy of Knoppix Linux. That way, you could (sort of) test drive a few WM's to get a taste of them.

edit to explain, just in case: Knoppix is a distro that you can run totally off of the CD - no need to install to HDD. It includes severl wm's that you can try.

 

[MikeA]

Downloading Knoppix right now to try out the different WM's. Does anyone have a cheap PCMCIA ethernet card (10mbit is fine)? I don't have too much to trade. Have 3 IBM Token-ring 16/4 cards (Type II). An IBM external laptop floppy drive. Netgear 10/100 NIC, Dlink 10/100 NIC, some old ISA 10mbit NICs and I might have some other hardware (like fans, etc). Have some money, but not a lot I can spend on this. Thanks.

 

[mjquilly]

Originally posted by: MikeA
Downloading Knoppix right now to try out the different WM's. Does anyone have a cheap PCMCIA ethernet card (10mbit is fine)? I don't have too much to trade. Have 3 IBM Token-ring 16/4 cards (Type II). An IBM external laptop floppy drive. Netgear 10/100 NIC, Dlink 10/100 NIC, some old ISA 10mbit NICs and I might have some other hardware (like fans, etc). Have some money, but not a lot I can spend on this. Thanks.

check the for sale/trade forum

 

[oniq]

Originally posted by: MikeA
Downloading Knoppix right now to try out the different WM's. Does anyone have a cheap PCMCIA ethernet card (10mbit is fine)? I don't have too much to trade. Have 3 IBM Token-ring 16/4 cards (Type II). An IBM external laptop floppy drive. Netgear 10/100 NIC, Dlink 10/100 NIC, some old ISA 10mbit NICs and I might have some other hardware (like fans, etc). Have some money, but not a lot I can spend on this. Thanks.

YHPM regarding this..

 

[MikeA]

I can't boot of the CD (the laptop doesn't have the option), so I made a boot floppy for Knoppix. What do I do after I boot from the floppy? The Knoppix site has no usefull instructions at all.

Oniq, you're the best! Truly a great guy. I owe you one bro