Kramer makes racial comments shame on him

[Deeko]

I made up the word running? Since when? ANd if you don't think McNabb and co. are mobile....well, I suggest you watch some film.

I never denied that it was stereotypical. I said most of them posess certain traits. Last time I checked, that's pretty much the definition. Its just that PC-morons like to make the word 'stereotype' into a form of racism, when it isn't. Its recognizing trends in a group.

Again you bring up white QBs. My post never mentioned that, why do you? The stereotypical black QB is how I described Romo. That doesn't mean those traits can't be found in white QBs either. Is that notion REAAAALLY hard to understand?

ps - the Eagles were 5-5 with McNabb. That's not very good, in case you've forgotten. Go ahead though, bring up the Dallas game. When Dallas is in the Superbowl, and the Eagles aren't even in the playoffs. you can cry all you want about McNabb getting hurt over 2/3 into the season when the team was already playing like ass. Seeing as this is getting off-topic, I won't reply to any more Dallas/Philly stuff. Yes, I started it, and now I'm ending it.

Irvin's comments weren't racist.

 

[rh71]

Originally posted by: Syringer
There's no denying it. The fastest, most athletic players are black.

Damn, hockey players are terrible athletes.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Deeko
I made up the word running? Since when? ANd if you don't think McNabb and co. are mobile....well, I suggest you watch some film.

I never denied that it was stereotypical. I said most of them posess certain traits. Last time I checked, that's pretty much the definition. Its just that PC-morons like to make the word 'stereotype' into a form of racism, when it isn't. Its recognizing trends in a group.

Again you bring up white QBs. My post never mentioned that, why do you? The stereotypical black QB is how I described Romo. That doesn't mean those traits can't be found in white QBs either. Is that notion REAAAALLY hard to understand?

ps - the Eagles were 5-5 with McNabb. That's not very good, in case you've forgotten. Go ahead though, bring up the Dallas game. When Dallas is in the Superbowl, and the Eagles aren't even in the playoffs. you can cry all you want about McNabb getting hurt over 2/3 into the season when the team was already playing like ass. Seeing as this is getting off-topic, I won't reply to any more Dallas/Philly stuff. Yes, I started it, and now I'm ending it.

Irvin's comments weren't racist.

Your post was blatantly stereotyping:
"Also, if you look at black QBs, they are known for A) mobility and B) being 'gunslinger-style' quarterbacks. Romo posseses both of these traits, so wouldn't Irvin's comments make sense?"

I'm glad that you finally admitted certain "traits" is sterotyping, which was exactly what you did. FAct: There are more white gunslingers than black, and just as many "mobile" white QBs as black if not more.

Would you be surprised if your employer correlated "bad worker" and "Dallas fan" together? That's what you just did with "blacks" and "gunslinging/mobile". Stereotyping to a T.

 

[chuckywang]

Irvin didn't say it with hate.

That's the difference. Not saying it's right, just saying that's what's different.

 

[Deeko]

Yea, there's probably a higher number of white mobile QBs....because there's more white QBs. How about being intelligent and using percentages? Of starters in the league right now, which black QBs aren't mobile? Leftwich was, but he's been benched for...a black QB that IS mobile. Yikes. Vick? Young? McNair (k he's kinda old, but in his prime he was definitely very mobile)? McNabb? Garrard? Campbell?

 

[leeland]

Originally posted by: Deeko
I made up the word running? Since when? ANd if you don't think McNabb and co. are mobile....well, I suggest you watch some film.

I never denied that it was stereotypical. I said most of them posess certain traits. Last time I checked, that's pretty much the definition. Its just that PC-morons like to make the word 'stereotype' into a form of racism, when it isn't. Its recognizing trends in a group.

Again you bring up white QBs. My post never mentioned that, why do you? The stereotypical black QB is how I described Romo. That doesn't mean those traits can't be found in white QBs either. Is that notion REAAAALLY hard to understand?

ps - the Eagles were 5-5 with McNabb. That's not very good, in case you've forgotten. Go ahead though, bring up the Dallas game. When Dallas is in the Superbowl, and the Eagles aren't even in the playoffs. you can cry all you want about McNabb getting hurt over 2/3 into the season when the team was already playing like ass. Seeing as this is getting off-topic, I won't reply to any more Dallas/Philly stuff. Yes, I started it, and now I'm ending it.

Irvin's comments weren't racist.

OK I will take your last comment and partially agree with it...they may or may not have been racist...depends on your view.


BUT at the very least it was disrespectful...if you can't agree with that then you are missing the entire point of the topic...

To say that someone is a lesser person or lesser talent because they do not possess the genes of another race is offending at the very least...and in some lights (IMO) could be considered a racist comment.

By no means where Kosmo went...but none the less the thought process is their as the lovely words of Al Sharpton...

 

[Deeko]

Would you be surprised if your employer correlated "bad worker" and "Dallas fan" together? That's what you just did with "blacks" and "gunslinging/mobile". Stereotyping to a T.

There is a difference between a stereotype, and using a stereotype to make assumptions. I can say "yea, most black QBs are mobile". That's stereotyping. There is nothing wrong with that. It is different to say "he's black - he must be mobile".

 

[Syringer]

According to Cornheiser, even Leftwich said himself that, among black QBs, he's pretty slow..but when compared to whites, he's about average.

 

[RagingBITCH]

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Deeko
Have you looked at the NFL lately?

Yep, the vast majority of the talented players are black.

Also, if you look at black QBs, they are known for A) mobility and B) being 'gunslinger-style' quarterbacks. Romo posseses both of these traits, so wouldn't Irvin's comments make sense?

Drew Brees, Plummer, Elway, Steve Young, nice stereotypes.

MI didn't mention anything about a relationship between style and race. The only things I have to say is that as much of a tool as he is now, the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino. Neither black or extremely mobile.

The sprinkles to that icing is Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and two Heismann winning QBs Carson Palmer and Matt Leinert (while not doing so hot this season, are still pretty damn good quarterbacks).


Iriving is just a freaking jackass. He's not a good commentator, and he's not good with words. The only thing he has going for him is that he's got the bankroll to dress stylishly.

You still haven't corrected your statement about "the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino"

 

[DougK62]

Black people are better athletes. There are documented physical differences for this. What's the problem?

 

[Syringer]

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Deeko
Have you looked at the NFL lately?

Yep, the vast majority of the talented players are black.

Also, if you look at black QBs, they are known for A) mobility and B) being 'gunslinger-style' quarterbacks. Romo posseses both of these traits, so wouldn't Irvin's comments make sense?

Drew Brees, Plummer, Elway, Steve Young, nice stereotypes.

MI didn't mention anything about a relationship between style and race. The only things I have to say is that as much of a tool as he is now, the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino. Neither black or extremely mobile.

The sprinkles to that icing is Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and two Heismann winning QBs Carson Palmer and Matt Leinert (while not doing so hot this season, are still pretty damn good quarterbacks).


Iriving is just a freaking jackass. He's not a good commentator, and he's not good with words. The only thing he has going for him is that he's got the bankroll to dress stylishly.

You still haven't corrected your statement about "the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino"

:laugh: that was pretty funny. Maybe he meant the only QB with a 14-2 season in his 2nd year who's never won a Super Bowl.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Would you be surprised if your employer correlated "bad worker" and "Dallas fan" together? That's what you just did with "blacks" and "gunslinging/mobile". Stereotyping to a T.

There is a difference between a stereotype, and using a stereotype to make assumptions. I can say "yea, most black QBs are mobile". That's stereotyping. There is nothing wrong with that. It is different to say "he's black - he must be mobile".

The fact of the matter is that your statements were false. If they're false, then it seems more like your statement #2 above.

Most blacks are not mobile QBs (even if they used to be), including McNair/McNabb/Leftwich/Culpepper/HoFer Warren Moon (stars that people have heard of, not guys who have played < 1 season and fizzled out). Yes McNabb was mobile in his immature days, but now he's much better as a mature pure passer and won't be mobile at all after the ACL injury. Take a look at his scrambling yardage in the past few years. Vick, VY (although < 1 season he is a huge star), Cunningham, and Kordell Stewart (ret) are really the only stars who have broken the mold and defined "mobile" but no more than Drew Brees, Steve Young, Elway, and Plummer have.

 

[Deeko]

listen....you're just wrong. I'm not going to argue with you any more. What you're saying is blatently untrue, so its not worth my time.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Deeko
listen....you're just wrong. I'm not going to argue with you any more. What you're saying is blatently untrue, so its not worth my time.

You made false statements, so don't try to wriggle out of them. Bringing up Campbell and Gerrard is utterly stupid, they will probably just fizzle out or convert more to a pure passer like McNabb once they learn how to play the QB position (and as a result stop scrambling). Playing 2 games is not worthy of this discussion, and you refuse to discuss stars for some reason nor respond to the fact the most famous black quarterback of all time was completely immobile. If blacks were always such mobile QBs back in the day, why did Joe Gilliam lose his job to Bradshaw? What about Doug Williams with the Skins, he was a decent passer who couldn't secure a QB position over Shroeder and Rypien?

None of them were considered rushing QB's, in fact the first one was McNair. However, McNair is not mobile now and wins with his passing, just like McNabb. When it's all said and done, they will be remembered as entering the league as rushing QBs who matured into true passers and could win with their arm and stopped scrambling. I don't think many people would consider them very mobile now.

 

[Deeko]

I'm not wriggling out of anything, again you confuse being mobile with being a runner. Vick/Cunningham are RUNNERS. McNabb is MOBILE. No one called Romo a RUNNER either, he is MOBILE. Are you seriously that dense?

Drew Bledsoe - not mobile
Tony Romo - mobile
Byron Leftwith - not mobile
David Garrard - mobile

I am not saying they are better because they are mobile...just simple comparisons. I don't understand how you can not understand this, other than you're a biased, unintelligent Eagles fan who hates Irvin, Romo, me, and anything else Cowboys-related.

Seriously, I'm done with you. Not only have you proven that you know nothing about football, repeatedly you showed in this thread you can't even comprehend the English language. I have better things to do than argue with someone with the apparent mental prowess of a 4 year old.

 

[Injury]

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Deeko
Have you looked at the NFL lately?

Yep, the vast majority of the talented players are black.

Also, if you look at black QBs, they are known for A) mobility and B) being 'gunslinger-style' quarterbacks. Romo posseses both of these traits, so wouldn't Irvin's comments make sense?

Drew Brees, Plummer, Elway, Steve Young, nice stereotypes.

MI didn't mention anything about a relationship between style and race. The only things I have to say is that as much of a tool as he is now, the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino. Neither black or extremely mobile.

The sprinkles to that icing is Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and two Heismann winning QBs Carson Palmer and Matt Leinert (while not doing so hot this season, are still pretty damn good quarterbacks).


Iriving is just a freaking jackass. He's not a good commentator, and he's not good with words. The only thing he has going for him is that he's got the bankroll to dress stylishly.

You still haven't corrected your statement about "the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino"

Yep, I'm new to football. I thought that old fart was the QB back then. I was wrong. Oh well. Still a damn good quarterback, still white, still not mobile.

edit: fixed typo.

 

[Syringer]

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Deeko
Have you looked at the NFL lately?

Yep, the vast majority of the talented players are black.

Also, if you look at black QBs, they are known for A) mobility and B) being 'gunslinger-style' quarterbacks. Romo posseses both of these traits, so wouldn't Irvin's comments make sense?

Drew Brees, Plummer, Elway, Steve Young, nice stereotypes.

MI didn't mention anything about a relationship between style and race. The only things I have to say is that as much of a tool as he is now, the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino. Neither black or extremely mobile.

The sprinkles to that icing is Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and two Heismann winning QBs Carson Palmer and Matt Leinert (while not doing so hot this season, are still pretty damn good quarterbacks).


Iriving is just a freaking jackass. He's not a good commentator, and he's not good with words. The only thing he has going for him is that he's got the bankroll to dress stylishly.

You still haven't corrected your statement about "the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino"

Yep, I'm new to football. I thought that old fart was the QB back then. I was wrong. Oh well. Still a damn good quarterback, still not white, still not mobile.

 

[akshatp]

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH

Originally posted by: Injury

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Deeko
Have you looked at the NFL lately?

Yep, the vast majority of the talented players are black.

Also, if you look at black QBs, they are known for A) mobility and B) being 'gunslinger-style' quarterbacks. Romo posseses both of these traits, so wouldn't Irvin's comments make sense?

Drew Brees, Plummer, Elway, Steve Young, nice stereotypes.

MI didn't mention anything about a relationship between style and race. The only things I have to say is that as much of a tool as he is now, the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino. Neither black or extremely mobile.

The sprinkles to that icing is Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and two Heismann winning QBs Carson Palmer and Matt Leinert (while not doing so hot this season, are still pretty damn good quarterbacks).


Iriving is just a freaking jackass. He's not a good commentator, and he's not good with words. The only thing he has going for him is that he's got the bankroll to dress stylishly.

You still haven't corrected your statement about "the only QB with an undefeated season is Dan Marino"

Yep, I'm new to football. I thought that old fart was the QB back then. I was wrong. Oh well. Still a damn good quarterback, still not white, still not mobile.

How new exactly? I am guessing you watched your first game tonight.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Deeko
I'm not wriggling out of anything, again you confuse being mobile with being a runner. Vick/Cunningham are RUNNERS. McNabb is MOBILE. No one called Romo a RUNNER either, he is MOBILE. Are you seriously that dense?

Drew Bledsoe - not mobile
Tony Romo - mobile
Byron Leftwith - not mobile
David Garrard - mobile

I am not saying they are better because they are mobile...just simple comparisons. I don't understand how you can not understand this, other than you're a biased, unintelligent Eagles fan who hates Irvin, Romo, me, and anything else Cowboys-related.

Seriously, I'm done with you. Not only have you proven that you know nothing about football, repeatedly you showed in this thread you can't even comprehend the English language. I have better things to do than argue with someone with the apparent mental prowess of a 4 year old.

Nice insults, I wouldn't expect anything less from a little Dallas Cowboy frat boy (for some reason I always think of the drunken frat boys in Borat when I think of you). You claimed most black QBs in the NFL are "mobile", and I've proven no - they are not - historically and present day. There are exceptions like Vick and VY (and historically Cunningham/Stewart), but they are not the norm. Scrambling (i.e. "mobile") QBs are a thing of the past, and while Romo can scramble (i.e. mobile) he is the exception - not the norm. The norm is historically Warren Moon, Doug Williams, and Joe Gilliam. Present day it's Culpepper/McNabb/Leftwich/Culpepper/McNair. None of them are considered mobile (even though they may have been in the past), Romo is the exception NOT the stereotype you and the media have created for the black QB.

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: blue1friday2
They are both jerks.

The Kramer guy (it's easier to refer to him as Kramer than try to remember the actor's name) seems morified and remorseful by his comments, and has apologized profusely. So I am not sure I would agree that the guy is a jerk. I think he made some unfortunate comments during a moment of rage, but I question whether this guy is actually racist in his day to day living.

 

[platinumike]

if anything irvin should be saying that about steve young. I was watching some young highlights the other day(cant find um anymore on youtube) young was like a white mike vick. One play he broke like 3 tackles in a 50 yrd td run.

 

[purbeast0]

eeh i have to agree with Deeko. Most black QB's in the NFL are mobile.

and i'm a redskins fan

 

[Conky]

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
How is what he said "racist"?

He's saying the only reason Romo is succeessful is because he's part black. Now imagine Steve Young saying that about about a black QB like McNabb and see how long he would last.

This is the point that people need to address. Instead, some of these guys have gone off on tangents. :roll:

You're right though... if Steve Young said that the reason McNabb is not one of the great QB's is because he didn't have enough white in him then sparks would fly! :laugh:

 

[leeland]

Originally posted by: Beachboy

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
How is what he said "racist"?

He's saying the only reason Romo is succeessful is because he's part black. Now imagine Steve Young saying that about about a black QB like McNabb and see how long he would last.

This is the point that people need to address. Instead, some of these guys have gone off on tangents. :roll:

You're right though... if Steve Young said that the reason McNabb is not one of the great QB's is because he didn't have enough white in him then sparks would fly! :laugh:

Point made...

 

[thecoolnessrune]

Originally posted by: SunnyD

Originally posted by: Kalvin00

Originally posted by: yllus
Is that really anywhere near the same level of comment? I don't think so.

No. And Kramer's comments weren't that bad either. And yet the stupid black kids are trying to sue him :roll:

What's more is he apologized, and has offered to apologize directly to the two. When asked, the two stated, "That's not enough - we want to be compensated for it."

She ain't nuthin' but a gold digger... Not my lyrics... just calling them like I see them.

Yes they are because the original lyrics are:

Now I ain't sayin she a gold digger

which by itself, is quite opposite to your statement. So yeah.... those *are* your lyrics