Kitchen makeovers on the cheap? (Ok..so a little over $6,000 cheap)

[vi edit]

Our house was built in the late 70's and has the original cabinets that came with it it. The doors have been repainted a few times and the fixtures swapped out, but the insides are still a nasty looking brown color and they just are kinda dingy and unppealing. The formica countertops are also really showing a lot of use and abuse and have a lot of paint and other slop on them from the previous owners doing rush jobs on the painting.

We'll be selling the house in a few years and feel the kitchen could really use a refresh to make it a little more appealing to potential buyers.

We don't want to spend a ton of money, but want to go completely ghetto with the renovations either. I'm fairly handy and neither my wife or I are scared off by putting sweat equity into things. The current stuff is all painted white (on the outside) with white appliances (that are fairly new) so we'd like to replace them with white again.

Looking for any advice or suggestions from others that have done recent remodels.

Realistically I'm probably looking at a budget of $3000 give or take a grand for cabinets and counters. I'm not looking at adding value in my home so much as I am maintaining it. It's a buyers market and I have to compete with new constructions a few miles down the road. Anything I can do to spruce it up makes the sell a little easier.

[EDIT]
2/16/09 Update:

Well, we are moving forward with the remodel. Actually started this weekend. We ended up going with Aristokraft cabinets from a local dealer.

http://www.aristokraft.com/styles/index.cfm

We've got over 17 pieces including a 90" utility cabinet coming in with a glazed maple finish. You can see the cabinet in one of the pictures with the finish all cabinets will be. Cabinet price was $3900 delivered. My neighbor is a contractor and is coming over a couple nights for beer, pizza, and a couple hundred bucks to help set the bases and do the sink & dishwasher work. I'll do all the wall cabinets.

The counters were around $1400 including a new sink and delivered. My Dad and I should be able to get them easily installed.

I'm putting in a new over the range microwave as well to free up counter space from the old one. We'll also be doing a tile backsplash all the way around.

Here's some pics of what I had to work with before demo'ing and pics in progress. I spent about 10 hours this weekend ripping out cabinets, wainscoating, and trim. Plus I'm ripping out the plaster walls in areas where the tile backsplash will be and putting in new backerboard for the tile to stick to better. The finish coat is pretty beat up from the nails and glue holding in the wainscoating.

Pre demo:
sink and "U" work area

oven side

Back wall with fridge and microwave

A shot of the utility cabinet and what the rest of the cabinets will look like

Start of tear down:
See what I mean by grungy insides of cabinets?

Beauty handy work on the wiring of the old oven hood

I don't remember putting this here....

Now you see a wall

Now you don't....

--------------------------------------------

Tomorrow my wife will be sanding down soffits where the cabinets were caulked tight and readying things for a primer coat. We'll be painting everything prior to installing since we have the chance to. When I get home from work tomorrow I'll be trying to patch up the mess around the old hood.

I think I'm going to cap off the old vent and just go with the forward vent option on the microwave. I've had bugs come in through the old vent and just don't want to deal with it. When that is done I'll be patching up the holes from the old electric run and putting it into a wired recepticle and outlet for the microwave to plug into in the cabinet that will eventually be above the microwave.

The rest of the week will be pulling out the rest of the base cabinets along the range wall and sink wall and cutting out the old busted up plaster and putting in new backer board for the tile. I want to get things mostly put together next week and have my counters in by next weekend. Then I can get going on tile and hopefully have things wrapped up by the end of the month.

My budget creeped up a bit from 4 grand to closer to 6, but we had a decent tax return that paid for it. It'll be a very nice kitchen after all work is done. It's not going to be a $15,000 parade home setup, but for $6,000 it should certainly help sell the place in 4 years.

-------------------------------------------------

2/23/09 Update

PROGRESS!!

It's been a rough couple weeks health wise for my family but we've been able to chip away at things.

Ripped out the island area and got the whole kitchen repainted now. Color looks bad in the pictures, but it's a very warm, cozy color in person. And the texture of the wainscoating on the bottom looks nicer than pictures show.

paint 1

Paint 2

Paint 3

Paint 4

PROGRESS!!!

And finally....something actually feels like we are getting somewhere. Got the utility cabinet set, one base cabinet in, and two wall cabinets in place. Let me tell you...trying to put a 90" wall cabinet w/ a 4" toe kick into a room with a 96" ceiling is no fun. No sir. Not fun at all. I ended up having to shave 1/2" off the toe kick to get it in there. I've got a bit of a hanger now where the utility cabinet meets the cabinet to the left of it. Not much else I could do about that. You really have to be picky to point it out.

I need to put the spacer to the right of the cabinet and do some trim work and the cabinet part will be done on that wall. Then just comes the tiling.

Tonight my Dad is coming over to help with the tear out of the rest of the cabinets along the sink wall. And we'll try and get a sheet or two of fiberboard cut and hung for the tile. Tomorrow hopefully we'll get wall cabinets set along that wall and then base cabinets on Wednesday. Get my measurements to the granite guys and have that hopefully cut and ready by Saturday. Then install and tile over the weekend.

-------------------------------------------------

3/9/09

UPDATE: All backer board is in place, cabinets are set, microwave is mounted, and about 75% of trim work is done. Hoping to get counters in tomorrow or Wednesday. Have the tile for the backsplash ordered, but it's on a boat from Spain right now and won't be in for a couple more weeks 🙁

It'd look better with counters

Backwall

Going with the mosiac tile pattern on the left

You can see the granite we picked in front of it. All pretty warm, neutral colors.

'Po Man's crown moulding at $.38 a foot. Stain is actually not that dark in person and a really close match to the cabinets.

So far I've done almost all of the work. Only thing I got some help with was a couple hours from my Dad putting in the sink base and temp plumbing in the R/O tap. So far I'm pretty proud of the work I've accomplished given my last month of non-stop issues work & personal wise.

----------------------------------------------------------

Happy 4/20 Day! Update...
ALMOST FRIGGEN DONE! I've got two little pieces of trim to hang up to the right of the coffee grinder and a few areas to patch, sand, and paint in the door to dining room area. But otherwise we're complete. Plus some window treatments that my wife needs to figure out. Yay!

Not terrible given that since the 2nd week of February my daughter has been in the hospital twice, I've been in once myself, my Granfather is currently in there, and I've done mostly all labor myself (with my Dad and my wife helping some too).

Playing with mud

A before shot of this area

After our work

Another before of the sink area

After

Backwall before

Backwall after

Final tab so far:

Cabinets: $3800
Counters + sink: $1400
Faucet: $220 (paid for with cards from Christmas)
Replacement R/O faucet: $50 (paid for with gift cards from CC points)
Tile & grout: $350
Microwave: $170
Trim: $60
Stain: $3.50
Paint: $52
Brushes: $6
Labor to re-plumb sink: $80
Durock backer: $40
----------------
$6181

 

[iamwiz82]

For that budget you cannot really beat Ikea's cabinets.

 

[spidey07]

I went with the cheap ones from home depot. They look good and seem to have decent build quality. They're already assembled and you just mount them.

 

[mugs]

Why not just paint them again (including the insides)?

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
For that budget you cannot really beat Ikea's cabinets.

I need to dig around their site a little more. It's almost impossible to find anything anymore. Did you guys go with Ikea for your remodel? I've read the quality is decent for the money. I'm assuming installation is pretty straightforward too, no?

So long as you are good with a level and have an extra couple set of hands it shouldn't be too bad should it?

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
For that budget you cannot really beat Ikea's cabinets.

I do woodworking and build cabinets and agree.
Ikeas are basic but there are some that look decent and you should be able to install them if you take your time and level them well.

 

[Kelemvor]

We took ours down, sanded them down to get the stain off, painted them white, put on new hardware and such, and they look great. Pics on bbzzdd.com I think but I can't get there from work. search for kitchen_before or something like that maybe or just my ID. Can't beat $50 of paint and some sand paper.

If you really do replace them, stay away from having some place like Sears come in and do it. They will rape you for sure. They tried to do it to us...

 

[vi edit]

Wow. Good call on the Ikea. The built in wall oven units are like $250. You'd normally pay $900+ for something like that from a traditional cabinet manf.

Am I correct in seeing that the Ikea stuff is free standing - it actually stands on legs up off the floor instead of being fixed to the subfloor? Or is that an option I just didn't dig around enough and find?

 

[Capt Caveman]

In regards to countertops, anything but solid surface(laminate) will be expensive. One option, may be to tile the existing countertop with granite tiles.

 

[ElFenix]

cheap countertops

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: vi edit
Wow. Good call on the Ikea. The built in wall oven units are like $250. You'd normally pay $900+ for something like that from a traditional cabinet manf.

Am I correct in seeing that the Ikea stuff is free standing - it actually stands on legs up off the floor instead of being fixed to the subfloor? Or is that an option I just didn't dig around enough and find?

For locations against the wall I anchored the cabinets to the studs. For a freestanding location I'd forgo the legs (even though they are much nicer to use than shims) and use solid wood that would be attached to the bottom of the cab and then anchored to the floor.

The wall cabs are mounted using a rail, it makes the install super easy.

Also, people are always amazed by the doors and drawers and how they are self closing. You don't have to get that hardware, but it's cheap and adds an 'ooo' factor.

I also got our countertops there. Wood butcherblock for a few bucks a linear foot? Sign me up! After 2 years the counters still look great. No cracks or warping.

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
In regards to countertops, anything but solid surface(laminate) will be expensive. One option, may be to tile the existing countertop with granite tiles.

There's a kitchen design outlet near me that sells granite countertops for $10 a sq/ft. Figure there is a little over 2 sq/ft in a linear foot of counterspace and I'm looking at about $25 a foot. I have about 20 feet of counter tops to cover so that's about $500.

Do the Ikea cabinets accept a standard size counter top or do you need to use their own?

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: vi edit

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
For that budget you cannot really beat Ikea's cabinets.

I need to dig around their site a little more. It's almost impossible to find anything anymore. Did you guys go with Ikea for your remodel? I've read the quality is decent for the money. I'm assuming installation is pretty straightforward too, no?

So long as you are good with a level and have an extra couple set of hands it shouldn't be too bad should it?

Yep, we used Ikea. Consumer Reports ranked them really high for the price.

Installation is easy. Building the cabinets takes the longest. I spent a couple of days putting them together in my garage, then Lola helped me carry them in the house. It's easy to do by yourself once you get them in the room. For levelling I used a 4' level and just adjusted the legs as necessary.

Do the Ikea cabinets accept a standard size counter top or do you need to use their own?

Standard.

 

[theblackbox]

check out to see if you have a ReStore nearby. usually, construction companies will donate unused cabinents and you can get high quality stuff for dirt cheap. you may need to find more then one, to see if you can get good matching stuff.

 

[JulesMaximus]

You could have the cabinets refaced. We did that in our kitchen and it looks fantastic.

Before

After

Of course, that cost us about $11,000 between the cabinets and the granite countertops.

 

[Greenman]

If you're going to use Ikea cabinets, just don't bother doing anything. I've had to install them twice, they are without doubt the worst trash I've ever had the displeasure of working with.

Refacing is probably what you want to do. It's not all that hard with the right tools, and not all that expensive. You can buy doors and surfacing material here; http://www.decore.com/products.asp

For the interiors I would simply paint them and replace the shelves with white melamine.

Formica is the way to go for an inexpensive and good looking counter top, you can special order almost any size shape and color from the Home Depot or Lowe's. Tile can be very reasonable as well if you do it yourself.


And again, for the love of whatever you hold dear, don't use Ikea cabinets. Take the money you would spend on them and use it for toilet paper, you'll get better value.

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
You could have the cabinets refaced. We did that in our kitchen and it looks fantastic.

I just don't think that they are worth putting much more money into. The inside of them is just a nasty brown color with fixed shelves that you can't adjust in most of the base cabinets. The bases are pretty warped (especially under the sink) so stuff doesn't set well in them, and the drawers are essentially a tongue and groove that is showing it's age.

They work. But they aren't pretty. If I can drop $1500 at Ikea that's better than dropping $500 and not really improving anything.

[EDIT]

And it wouldn't be a total waste on the existing cabinets if I pulled them out. I'd like to set up some of them in the basement around the washer/dryer and make for more working and storage space with them.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: vi edit

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
You could have the cabinets refaced. We did that in our kitchen and it looks fantastic.

I just don't think that they are worth putting much more money into. The inside of them is just a nasty brown color with fixed shelves that you can't adjust in most of the base cabinets. The bases are pretty warped (especially under the sink) so stuff doesn't set well in them, and the drawers are essentially a tongue and groove that is showing it's age.

They work. But they aren't pretty. If I can drop $1500 at Ikea that's better than dropping $500 and not really improving anything.

Sounds like you've had some water damage.

Honestly, you get what you pay for in home remodeling IMO. I wouldn't recommend spending a ton but you do want it to make your house more marketable when it comes time to sell. I don't regret spending any of the money we've put into our home.

 

[drnickriviera]

Originally posted by: vi edit

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
In regards to countertops, anything but solid surface(laminate) will be expensive. One option, may be to tile the existing countertop with granite tiles.

There's a kitchen design outlet near me that sells granite countertops for $10 a sq/ft. Figure there is a little over 2 sq/ft in a linear foot of counterspace and I'm looking at about $25 a foot. I have about 20 feet of counter tops to cover so that's about $500.

Do the Ikea cabinets accept a standard size counter top or do you need to use their own?

Granite for $10/sqft? I'll be fabricating my own granite tops shortly and I can't even buy slabs wholesale for that price. Hell I have an uncle that owns a granite quarry in Vietnam and he said his cost is $2/sqft.

Double check those prices. May be 2cm instead of the normal 3cm. Could also be a teaser price just to get you in, then they rape you on sink cutouts and edging.

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: Greenman
If you're going to use Ikea cabinets, just don't bother doing anything. I've had to install them twice, they are without doubt the worst trash I've ever had the displeasure of working with.

Refacing is probably what you want to do. It's not all that hard with the right tools, and not all that expensive. You can buy doors and surfacing material here; http://www.decore.com/products.asp

For the interiors I would simply paint them and replace the shelves with white melamine.

Formica is the way to go for an inexpensive and good looking counter top, you can special order almost any size shape and color from the Home Depot or Lowe's. Tile can be very reasonable as well if you do it yourself.


And again, for the love of whatever you hold dear, don't use Ikea cabinets. Take the money you would spend on them and use it for toilet paper, you'll get better value.

So the thousands of people with good experiences don't mean anything? What exactly was trash about them?

Consumer Reports findings, btw:

(Based on one 21-inch-wide base cabinet with one drawer and one pullout shelf, and one 21-inch-wide, 30-inch-tall wall cabinet with fixed shelves.)

#1 Omega $1055
#2 Fieldstone (1/2") $1020
#3 Diamond (Platinum) $630
#4 IKEA $290
#5 Thomasville $500
#6 Shenandoah $435
#7 KraftMaid $510
#8 Wellborn (Premier) $880
#9 Mill's Pride $260
#10 American Woodmark (Designer Series) $350
#11 Kitchen Classics (Select) $265
#12 Premier $320
#13 Kitchen Classics $350

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: drnickriviera

Originally posted by: vi edit

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
In regards to countertops, anything but solid surface(laminate) will be expensive. One option, may be to tile the existing countertop with granite tiles.

There's a kitchen design outlet near me that sells granite countertops for $10 a sq/ft. Figure there is a little over 2 sq/ft in a linear foot of counterspace and I'm looking at about $25 a foot. I have about 20 feet of counter tops to cover so that's about $500.

Do the Ikea cabinets accept a standard size counter top or do you need to use their own?

Granite for $10/sqft? I'll be fabricating my own granite tops shortly and I can't even buy slabs wholesale for that price. Hell I have an uncle that owns a granite quarry in Vietnam and he said his cost is $2/sqft.

Double check those prices. May be 2cm instead of the normal 3cm. Could also be a teaser price just to get you in, then they rape you on sink cutouts and edging.

No kidding. Our kitchen countertops cost almost $4500 installed (probably about 60-65sq ft) this included a new stainless steel sink too. Of course they did all the measuring, cutting, and installation. I couldn't be more pleased with the company who did our granite and I'd use them again in a second.

They had a warehouse with quite a good selection of granite slabs so we actually picked it out and about a week before our install. It is 1.25" thick throughout. They cut it on a Monday and installed it on Wednesday.

 

[DrPizza]

Go ahead... check out the cabinets at Ikea. If they're made out of press board/particle board, avoid them. (I'm going to guess that they are.)

As far as the countertop, a little work & you can make a beautiful tile counter top. You could also go with the 1 foot granite squares to make a tile countertop. I've seen some that were absolutely beautiful.
http://www.rd.com/17870/article17870.html
http://www.tilesinstaller.com/...6%20Granite%20Tile.jpg
http://www.outdoordesign.net/I.../GALLERYIMG_14_125.jpg
http://www.tilesinstaller.com/...tchen/12x12Granite.JPG
http://www.kileconstruction.co...%20Cabinets%202003.jpg
http://www.rd.com/17762/article17762-2.html

I did a tile countertop in our last kitchen, it turned out beautiful. The only unfortunate part: my wife and mother-in-law were under the assumption that you let grout dry before you wipe it off. (AUUGGGGGHHHH!!!) Took several days to clean the tiles before regrouting. And, not having learned her lesson, last summer we finished putting down a tile floor in our sunroom. My wife did half of the grouting. She would have done it all, but decided to take a break, even though she had mixed up ALL of the grout at once. Covering grout with saran wrap will keep it from drying out, right? 😛

If you go tile/granite, the cheap wet saws (around $60 at HD) work just fine. Mine has lasted through 5 or 6 projects, including cutting bricks in half for my patio last year.

As far as cupboards, I'm not sure if you have a Mr Seconds around near you, or another such type of place. We were looking at kitchen cupboards there, and they seemed to be fairly well built for the price. I didn't notice any press-board at all. All plywood & hardwood construction. There was also a place in Buffalo that we went to that had well built cabinets for cheap. Granted, with the low prices, there weren't a lot of style choices at either of those places.

 

[nanette1985]

If you're selling the house in a few years, think twice about Ikea. It may not wear well. My neighbor did their cabinets with Ikea and it looked great at first but just didn't hold up. The wood-product is very soft and the finishes didn't withstand the constant cleaning that a much-used kitchen requires. A ding or two here, splinters there, endlessly replacing hinges, it adds up.

I have quite a bit of Ikea furniture and it's good for a short time but I'm not happy about the longer term.

My place had new cabinets from Home Depot when I moved in six years ago, and it has held up well.

 

[DrPizza]

Originally posted by: drnickriviera

Originally posted by: vi edit

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
In regards to countertops, anything but solid surface(laminate) will be expensive. One option, may be to tile the existing countertop with granite tiles.

There's a kitchen design outlet near me that sells granite countertops for $10 a sq/ft. Figure there is a little over 2 sq/ft in a linear foot of counterspace and I'm looking at about $25 a foot. I have about 20 feet of counter tops to cover so that's about $500.

Do the Ikea cabinets accept a standard size counter top or do you need to use their own?

Granite for $10/sqft? I'll be fabricating my own granite tops shortly and I can't even buy slabs wholesale for that price. Hell I have an uncle that owns a granite quarry in Vietnam and he said his cost is $2/sqft.

Double check those prices. May be 2cm instead of the normal 3cm. Could also be a teaser price just to get you in, then they rape you on sink cutouts and edging.

I've seen slabs for around $10/sq ft. (6x8 slabs? They were around $500 IIRC, maybe even a little cheaper.) Regardless, if he went with the square pieces of granite, I've seen them on close-out at various home center places for $4-$6 each. (or were they 8x10?)

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
cheap countertops

Cool. Good idea.


The only time I put in a counter top it cost $8.00. I found a 8' section of scratch and dent counter top at Home Depot and put it on milk crate shelves. Worked great for the three years I lived in that house.