Kindergartner Suspended over Bubble Gun Threat

Nov 30, 2006
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Is it any wonder that our "progressive" educational system is rapidly declining from world prominence?
 
Apr 27, 2012
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Thank you political correctness for this BS, Meanwhile the real issues are being ignored.

Everyone involved with this must be fired, there is no reason for them to be teaching at a school
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
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Is it any wonder that our "progressive" educational system is rapidly declining from world prominence?

Our education system is absolutely not "declining". That's a hugely false perception. As discussed in a thread earlier this month the study was flawed. Second, we were never that great at education, not as good as people think. A lot of that has to do with us not bifurcating college bound kids from non-college bound around 7th grade. This means that resources on college-bound courses are wasted on those not going to college. Almost all of the countries at the top of these lists bifurcate.
 

Throckmorton

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Aug 23, 2007
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Our education system is absolutely not "declining". That's a hugely false perception. As discussed in a thread earlier this month the study was flawed. Second, we were never that great at education, not as good as people think. A lot of that has to do with us not bifurcating college bound kids from non-college bound around 7th grade. This means that resources on college-bound courses are wasted on those not going to college. Almost all of the countries at the top of these lists bifurcate.

"Bifurcating" kids based on some kind of IQ test at age 12 is stupid and really amounts to a kind of segregation.
 

Lanyap

Elite Member
Dec 23, 2000
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Zero tolerance = zero intelligence.


Seriously? and she is 5 years old.

The kindergartner, who attends Mount Carmel Area Elementary School in Pennsylvania, caught administrators' attention after suggesting she and a classmate should shoot each other with bubbles.

According to Ficker, the girl, whose identity has not been released, didn't even have the bubble gun toy with her at school.

The kindergartner was ordered to undergo a psychological evaluation during her 10-day suspension, which was later reduced to two days. The evaluation deemed the girl normal and not a threat to others, Ficker said.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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She's being properly guided by the state to be a good citizen. Children should not be allowed to bring AK-47's to school.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
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Kid should probably be taken from parents and parents possibly charged with child negligence. Making light of a shooting as she did shows a deeper trouble, one in which to her shooting is synonymous with fun. A more terrible way to bend a child's mind I cannot fathom. Fact: most terrorists played with guns as a kid. Fact: bubbles are the same shape as many grenades. Fact: Hello Kitty was added to Interpol's list of terrorist sympathizers.
 
Nov 30, 2006
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If anyone needs a psychological evaluation...it's not the 5 yr old...it's those who contrived and enforced such a ridiculous zero tolerance standard.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
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"Bifurcating" kids based on some kind of IQ test at age 12 is stupid and really amounts to a kind of segregation.

It doesnt need to be aged 12. But push it out to say 15. At 15 you are going one way or another in most cases. Does it make sense to spend resources on kids who dont want to be there? We have this fascination with forcing people to do things they clearly dont want to in this country. A kid who doesnt want to be in school is a distraction to the kids who do and a waste of resources for the system. I am intrigued by Germany's system. It places kids on a college track or a trades track.
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
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"Bifurcating" kids based on some kind of IQ test at age 12 is stupid and really amounts to a kind of segregation.

If the children do not have the ability nor the drive to succeed then there is no sense in wasting time or money on them. Not everybody is destined to go to college. Treating all children the same only reduces the resources to the best and brightest.

It also ensures parents are active in the education process. If they want their kids to go to college then they need to take some personal responsibility to make it so, not just shove everything off to teachers and the system.
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
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It doesnt need to be aged 12. But push it out to say 15. At 15 you are going one way or another in most cases. Does it make sense to spend resources on kids who dont want to be there? We have this fascination with forcing people to do things they clearly dont want to in this country. A kid who doesnt want to be in school is a distraction to the kids who do and a waste of resources for the system. I am intrigued by Germany's system. It places kids on a college track or a trades track.

I stayed in Germany when one of my host family's kids was going through the Abitur. The parents were driving him pretty hard to do well. Their other son didn't really want to go to college and he wasn't driven.

*All* kids should get some sort of full education through 18. Not *all* kids need to have calculus, or higher bio/chem/phys.
 

brandonb

Diamond Member
Oct 17, 2006
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I see a future mass murderer on our hands.
Lock her up now for life. Actually, just give her the chair now.

(I'm being sarcastic)

But in all seriousness, things like this cause mass murderers. People just want to check out when all this stupidity exists. Like this!
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
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If the children do not have the ability nor the drive to succeed then there is no sense in wasting time or money on them. Not everybody is destined to go to college. Treating all children the same only reduces the resources to the best and brightest.

It also ensures parents are active in the education process. If they want their kids to go to college then they need to take some personal responsibility to make it so, not just shove everything off to teachers and the system.

I agree. Not everyone needs all the College prep courses in High School. You can make good money in a skilled trade and you don't need a College degree. I remember in high school it was almost like you where a waste if you didn't go to school. I felt like telling the counselors and teachers, hey who do you think comes and fixes your toilet when it is broken or delivers the food to the supermarket or installed the electrical in your house? It wasn't a college educated person, it was somebody in a skilled trade. They should have just as much respect as the person that goes to school and gets a 4-year degreee.
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
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I agree. Not everyone needs all the College prep courses in High School. You can make good money in a skilled trade and you don't need a College degree. I remember in high school it was almost like you where a waste if you didn't go to school. I felt like telling the counselors and teachers, hey who do you think comes and fixes your toilet when it is broken or delivers the food to the supermarket or installed the electrical in your house? It wasn't a college educated person, it was somebody in a skilled trade. They should have just as much respect as the person that goes to school and gets a 4-year degreee.

I also don't have a problem with people trying to get a college education later in life. I don't totally agree they should be shut out. Some kids don't want to go initially but later in life, do. There should be an exam for that and they should have to take a year or two of remedial classes, so maybe a 6-year degree.

Alternatively, if you focus the more college-bound kids on college prep in HS you can cut out the 1st year of "crap" courses, make college 3 years and 5 years for non-prepped.
 
Nov 30, 2006
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The elementary school principal describes herself as a "progressive".

Positive, progressive, public high school Social Studies teacher committed to making the best of my students' time in my classroom through all things technology, digital citizenship, and global collaboration.
http://coalcrackerclassroom.wordpress.com/


To excel in a progressive educational leadership position that allows me to empower teachers and students.
http://www.visualcv.com/jawg7o1
 
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MCA issues statement in regard to bubble gun

MOUNT CARMEL - Mount Carmel Area School District officials, who have been heavily criticized over the suspension of a 5-year-old kindergarten student for alleging telling classmates that she was going to shoot them and herself with her pink Hello Kitty Bubble Gun, claim information provided to the media about the incident may not be consistent with the facts.

In a statement issued to the media on behalf of the school district, Mount Carmel Area Superintendent Bernie Stellar says, "Mount Carmel Area School District has been criticized for the handling of an incident that occurred recently. Although by law we cannot officially comment on the specifics of the incident involving students, we are confident that much of the information supplied to the media may not be consistent with the facts in this matter.

"The Mount Carmel Area School District has investigated the issue and will continue to do so. When given the opportunity in the appropriate forum, we look forward to presenting information that will portray our school district in a more positive light."

The statement continues, "The Mount Carmel Area School District takes the well-being and safety of students and staff very seriously. In discipline matters, all circumstances are taken into consideration when arriving at decisions.

"It is the vision of the Mount Carmel Area educational community to create a safe learning environment that nurtures the intellectual, social, emotional and physical well-being of each child."

The child was reportedly questioned about the incident for three hours before her mother was contacted, said Robin Ficker, 69, an attorney from Bethesda, Md., who is representing the family.

Ficker said the girl, who did not have the toy in her possession at school, was initially suspended for 10 days by Mount Carmel Area Elementary School Principal Susan Nestico in what the school classified as a "terroristic threat." The suspension was later reduced to two days and labeled a "threat to harm others."

On Friday, Stellar said he couldn't comment on the incident or suspension because he's not allowed to discuss student discipline issues.

The alleged incident occurred Thursday, Jan. 10, and the student returned to school Monday, Jan. 14, Ficker said.

He said her parents do not want to discuss the incident with the media. He confirmed the girl who was suspended resides in the Mount Carmel area.

Police were not involved in the incident, according to Mount Carmel Township Police Chief Brian Hollenbush.

During a telephone interview with The News-Item Friday, Ficker said the 5-year-old girl was playing with two friends while waiting in line for the bus while still inside her classroom and spoke about her Hello Kitty gun, which shoots bubbles.

Ficker said the kindergartner mentioned she was going to shoot one of her friends and then herself with the bubble gun so that they could all be together. Then, she was going to shoot herself again when she got home.

Ficker said someone at the school became aware of the conversation and reported it to administrators.

The attorney said the girl's mother told him her daughter has been very upset since the incident.

Ficker said he plans to meet with school district solicitor Edward Greco by the end of this week to discuss the suspension.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
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It's good to see that the school district and the political progressive's that run it have a useful form of aversion therapy for small troublesome children and their parents. Hopefully the school district can advance these forms of aversion therapy into more effective drug, electric and water boarding techniques to teach children and their parents proper progressive behavior.
 

Broheim

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2011
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what happened to you america, you used to be cool


also what is the point of a psych eval of a 5 year old, they haven't developed morality yet.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
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Cmon folks, bubble guns are a precursor to mass murder. As TFP would say, everyone knows this.
 

themusgrat

Golden Member
Nov 2, 2005
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.......
Ficker said the kindergartner mentioned she was going to shoot one of her friends and then herself with the bubble gun so that they could all be together. Then, she was going to shoot herself again when she got home.
.......

It's probably just her putting 2 and 2 together. Maybe her parents of some of her friends are religious, and someone told her 5 year old self that people who die go to the best place ever, heaven, to be with their friends forever. She then thinks "well if we all die, we get to all play together forever!" Or something like that

Someone definitely needs to explain things to her, but she's probably not some little terrorist who's going to bring a gun to school. I do trust that her parents aren't giving her access to guns. I do bet they're decent parents though, because they declined to speak to the media about their daughter. Too many times you see these parents on tv sensationalizing these stories of their kids; basically whoring their children out for their 5 minutes of fame. It's probably just a common misunderstanding. I bet many 5 year olds don't understand life and death all that well, and I bet plenty say things all the time that you'd arrest a 40 year old for.

tldr; kids will be kids. Let them be.
 

Lanyap

Elite Member
Dec 23, 2000
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This little girl is going to be screwed up for the rest of her life.
 

rommelrommel

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2002
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In a statement issued to the media on behalf of the school district, Mount Carmel Area Superintendent Bernie Stellar says, "Mount Carmel Area School District has been criticized for the handling of an incident that occurred recently. Although by law we cannot officially comment on the specifics of the incident involving students, we are confident that much of the information supplied to the media may not be consistent with the facts in this matter.

"The Mount Carmel Area School District has investigated the issue and will continue to do so. When given the opportunity in the appropriate forum, we look forward to presenting information that will portray our school district in a more positive light."

Translated:

We done fucked up. We can't comment on this, but we're going to comment on it anyways in a backhanded way to try and make ourselves look less stupid.