"killing" a processor?

[DasSmoof]

I was tinkering around in my BIOS this afternoon and was messing with my FSB and voltage controls. I wanted to see how fast I could get my processor before it wouldn't post anymore via just using the FSB. So, I played around with it for a while and got it to POST but not boot windows (windows would error) at 215FSB (This is an Athlon X2 4200+) and 1.45V. Anyway, after I finally reset it to what it's been stable at (stock voltage and 210FSB), I went back into Windows and loaded-up STALKER. To my surprise, STALKER decided to run ridiculous amounts of slow. About 10-15 frames less than it had been running just before I decided to mess with my processor settings. I played around a little bit more and since I was having some other errors and slow loading (Creative drivers, ugh) I decided to reinstall Windows (XP) anyway to see if that would bring it back to normal.

Well, it didn't and I'm stuck with the lower frames in STALKER and WoW is running worse as well. As far as I can tell, nothing else has changed in my BOIS since I returned everything to normal and yet, massive, massive slowdowns in games. So, did I manage to bake my processor or what? Is this simpler than I'm expecting? Clearly, I need to read more before I mess with ******; but I guess that's how I learn.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Is it running faster at stock speeds than at 210 mhz FSB?

 

[DasSmoof]

I'm unsure of that, I haven't checked yet. I'm away from it right now, so once I get back home I'll give it a test.

If that were the case, what would it mean?

 

[DrMrLordX]

I'm not 100% sure, but I have heard some say that running an X2 at too low a voltage might allow for stable operation, but at reduced performance. If, for some reason, you damaged or stressed the chip by pushing it up to 1.45v, it may now require more voltage to stay stable and operate at full speed when you run it at 210 mhz htt. Possibly.

A 10-15 fps hit on STALKER is pretty bad, especially if that performance hit is coming from the CPU alone. I would assume that performance hit would be worse than the hit you'd take running at stock speeds.

Of course, if things are still hideously slow at stock speeds (or even worse), then I can't say for sure what's wrong. But my guess is that the chip wants more voltage to perform normally given the clock speed.

 

[DasSmoof]

So in essence it would be like stretching something out? Say, a balloon? Once it's blown up to a certain point and it goes back to it's "normal" size, it's slightly larger?
Hmm. Well, I'll tinker with that when I get home here, up the voltage a little bit and see what it does. I'm assuming if there is some problem and it's not that, it probably isn't the motherboard, correct? Which, by the way, is a Abit KN8 SLI.

Thanks for the suggestions.

 

[DrMrLordX]

You might want to ask some of the more technically knowledgeable individuals here, but putting more voltage through transistors than factory spec can cause wear and tear on the processor. Results vary, but over time the proc becomes less stable at overclocked speeds and often requires more voltage to maintain the overclock.

Running higher volts through the proc should accelerate this process.

I guess you could think of it like stretching a baloon and thinning out the rubber walls in the process.

 

[VirtualLarry]

If you killed the CPU due to too much voltage, then it would be dead, it wouldn't work. Something running 10-15% slower, is due to some other setting or something. Perhaps you changed something that you forgot about or didn't notice.

 

[Yellowbeard]

If you had a failed OC, you may have corrupted Windows. I'd suggest a clean install. I seriously doubt you did any damage at 1.45v Vcore, even if you have stock cooling.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

You didn't harm your CPU, you probably borked your bios and/or the video card drivers. Reset the CMOS and reinstall your GPU drivers.

 

[myocardia]

GuiterDaddy has the correct answer, as usual.:roll: See, when you changed your settings back to where you had them at first (in the BIOS), you weren't giving your processor enough voltage for it to be stable. So, you "ruined" your BIOS.

Now, you need to reset your BIOS, and everything will be exactly the same as it was before you started changing settings. Make sure you write down every single setting in your BIOS, before you reset it, though; they'll all have to be changed back to the way you have them now.

 

[DasSmoof]

Seems to have worked. I reset my CMOS and reinstalled my video card drivers and seems as though all is back to normal. I've seemed to drop a miniscule amount of FPS, which I'm chalking that up to the fact that it's currently un-OCed.

Thanks for the help, all.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

:thumbsup: good to hear

And it was most likely overclocking the ram that fouled your overclock. Your CPU should go much farther with 1.45v. Next time set a lower ram divider when you start upping the HTT/FSB. Pushing ram past it's limit causes much nastier problems than CPU, usually when you push the CPU too far it just hangs or reboots but doesn't corrupt anything.

 

[DasSmoof]

Out of curiosity, where do I find the ram divider? I've been reading-up on overclocking so I can do it properly, but I have yet to see such a thing in my BIOS. My Mobo is an Abit KN8 SLI. As well, I was wondering about overclocking the HTT/FSB and if that could have any adverse effects on my HDD's? I currently have three, two on SATA and one regular old ATA. One has a lot if important stuff on it that I'd rather not lose

I've been attempting to read-up as much as possible on overclocking and what to mess with in the BIOS and I've figured out quite a bit so far, but as a novice, there are some things, like the above, that I'm just not finding or getting. Such as setting my memsetting to SPD and 100? I understand the SPD, but not the 100 (unless that just means setting it to DDR200). Are there any really good guides that will explain these things in great detail?

Thanks

 

[GuitarDaddy]

The dividers are labeled "Dram clock" on your board. DDR400 is the stock setting, DDR333, DDR266, DDR200 are the dividers. Use wichever one keeps your ram at stock speed or less with the HTT your using

Overclocking the HTT/FSB shouldn't effect your HDD's as your board automatically locks the PCI bus as you overclock

Zebos A64 guide stickied at the top of this forum is pretty good

 

[DasSmoof]

Indeed, that's the main one I've been using and trying to figure out. He says something to the affect of not having something on SATA1/2, which both my HDD's are. This isn't a problem though?

Thanks again for the info! I'll get this overclocking stuff nailed down sometime

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Some of the earlier boards only locked the bus on sata3/4, shouldn't be a problem on newer boards

 

[DrMrLordX]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
If you killed the CPU due to too much voltage, then it would be dead, it wouldn't work. Something running 10-15% slower, is due to some other setting or something. Perhaps you changed something that you forgot about or didn't notice.

That's not entirely true. If you overvolt a CPU, it causes CPU life to degrade more rapidly than if you run it at stock. Eventually it starts to become unstable at clock speeds that previously offered stability. A good example was a Celeron 300a a friend of mine once owned that was OCed to 450 mhz at a sickeningly high voltage of around 2.1-2.2v. After awhile, it just stopped booting at that speed. I had to drop the vcore back to 1.8v and set it back to 300 mhz to get it to work again. This was after several years of operation. The chip still worked, but it lost some OC potential. In theory, instability could manifest as slowdown, either through erratic chip behavior or possible driver corruption. In this case, it might have been driver corruption.

Anyway, good job getting the system working again OP.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Originally posted by: DrMrLordX

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
If you killed the CPU due to too much voltage, then it would be dead, it wouldn't work. Something running 10-15% slower, is due to some other setting or something. Perhaps you changed something that you forgot about or didn't notice.

That's not entirely true. If you overvolt a CPU, it causes CPU life to degrade more rapidly than if you run it at stock. Eventually it starts to become unstable at clock speeds that previously offered stability. A good example was a Celeron 300a a friend of mine once owned that was OCed to 450 mhz at a sickeningly high voltage of around 2.1-2.2v. After awhile, it just stopped booting at that speed. I had to drop the vcore back to 1.8v and set it back to 300 mhz to get it to work again. This was after several years of operation. The chip still worked, but it lost some OC potential. In theory, instability could manifest as slowdown, either through erratic chip behavior or possible driver corruption. In this case, it might have been driver corruption.

Anyway, good job getting the system working again OP.

But the point is, the CPU doesn't magically start running 10% slower on it's own. The user would have to manually back off on the overclock. It's true that long-term, or under adverse conditions, you can degrade a CPU, but that's fairly rare. I've seen some cases in which it was actually the mobo (caps + VRMs) that degraded after being "pushed" from overclocking for some time.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Maybe it was the chip, maybe it was the board. It's a little hard to tell unless you have known-good components lying around for testing purposes.

There have been plenty of folks having to back off their Core 2 overclocks after running them at 1.55v or higher though.

As far as slowdowns go, I have heard of (but not seen) X2s suffering slowdown when getting insufficient voltage. Haven't heard of it happening very often, though.

I ran some benchmarks on my Brisbane at different voltages here and found very little difference in performance at different voltages (voltages below 1.45v were unstable at that speed).