kaveri cpu only?

[norseamd]

all these new hirings look promising. or maybe rehirings. not sure why people think amd is in trouble with all this going on. the next 2 to 5 years should be alright for amd. the 5 to 10 year timespan is what amd will probably have to think about. but intel has the same future even if they have tons of resources and cash. arm is in a good position.

 

[benandjerry]

Short answer: yes.

Long answer: all signs currently point to AMD having ceased any further development on stand-alone CPUs, opting to focus exclusively on APUs. So AMD's enthusiast processors for this generation will be using Kaveri, and as such will run on FM2+. AM3+ and the FX line are dead from a development standpoint; what you see now is all there ever will be.

This was the main reason I wasnt too keen on getting a FX6300 or FX8320 and doing some serious OC. Then I learned decent OC mobos come in full size ATX only, at that point I gave up on it completely.

Kaveri A10-7850 hit 4,4Ghz easily. Even my FX-4100 hits 4,6Ghz without voltage increase. The extra Mhz you can get of a intel processor, you will get too of a AMD processor.

I was under the impression there werent any unlocked i3's at all, and as such an overclocked Athlon would at very least challenge a stock i3 in all areas it would seem to me.

Someone mentioned Kaveri cpu part didnt bring much upside over the Trinity/Richland cpu, would they still be worth waiting for, if they even show up? Not interested in the whole APU at all, since I already have a descrete card to pair it with, but how does the Kaveri OC compared to previous lines?

 

[Borealis7]

didn't AMD deny axing the FX line?
i think they will at least try to release an FX Steamroller.

 

[ShintaiDK]

didn't AMD deny axing the FX line?
i think they will at least try to release an FX Steamroller.

Pure PR spin to keep selling a few chips.

Their roadmap shows no steamroller or excavator FX, neither for desktop or server. And they intend to phase out the AM3 socket. The extremely low volume cant pay for a chip design either.

As long as AMD can sell current FX chips, they will. But there wont be any new chips.

So no, there wont be any FX steamrollers.

 

[ShintaiDK]

what about after excavator? a entirely new architecture?

Its very unlikely that AMD will have any big core lines after excavator. They dont have the R&D budget to do it either. And they seem to focus what they have on ARM and small x86 cores. There are more small core models than big core models with the new releases.

AMDs R&D budget is also in free fall. Its now down to 288M$ in Q3. And it dropped around 15% YoY.

 

[inf64]

what about after excavator? a entirely new architecture?

New core has been in the works for some time now.

 

[el etro]

This was the main reason I wasnt too keen on getting a FX6300 or FX8320 and doing some serious OC. Then I learned decent OC mobos come in full size ATX only, at that point I gave up on it completely.



I was under the impression there werent any unlocked i3's at all, and as such an overclocked Athlon would at very least challenge a stock i3 in all areas it would seem to me.

Someone mentioned Kaveri cpu part didnt bring much upside over the Trinity/Richland cpu, would they still be worth waiting for, if they even show up? Not interested in the whole APU at all, since I already have a descrete card to pair it with, but how does the Kaveri OC compared to previous lines?

No. Only in less demanding tasks i3 will be better. The only i3 advantage is its lower power consumption.

 

[Phynaz]

No. Only in less demanding tasks i3 will be better. The only i3 advantage is its lower power consumption.

He said doesn't care about the IGP. A Haswell i3 will be faster in most apps.

 

[AtenRa]

He said doesn't care about the IGP. A Haswell i3 will be faster in most apps.

Against an OCed Ritchland/Kaveri no chance.

 

[Headfoot]

Kaveri is a non-starter on desktop. There may be some very interesting value laptop designs based on the 45w model. The pricing is just too expensive for use as a CPU only

 

[Exophase]

Kaveri is a non-starter on desktop. There may be some very interesting value laptop designs based on the 45w model. The pricing is just too expensive for use as a CPU only

I'd say CPU-only is a non-starter period for anything low-end. Hence why Intel doesn't bother with it until you get to enthusiast class, and even that may have more to do with being derived from a server part (where an IGP is no good for multi-socket boards)

 

[benandjerry]

Kaveri is a non-starter on desktop. There may be some very interesting value laptop designs based on the 45w model. The pricing is just too expensive for use as a CPU only

I'd say CPU-only is a non-starter period for anything low-end. Hence why Intel doesn't bother with it until you get to enthusiast class, and even that may have more to do with being derived from a server part (where an IGP is no good for multi-socket boards)

Are you guys referring to the APU at its price point? In no way is using the APU as a cpu only something I'm considering. Its based on the assumption that there will be a kaveri counterpart to todays 760k, at about its current price, and push it as far as it will go on air.

 

[avtek21]

Firestrike 1.1, Cloudgate and Icestorm with cf HD7870:


May be a while before new Athlon but Kaveri with early drivers and crossfired will be interesting when Catalyst 35 with Mantle is released.

http://www.3dmark.com/fs/1579570

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?288328-Gigabyte-f2a88x-up4-amd-a10-7850k-review

 

[el etro]

He said doesn't care about the IGP. A Haswell i3 will be faster in most apps.

If he uses more casual tasks, ok.
Not if he uses CPU-intensive tasks.

Anyway, i3 is a good choice. Pentiuns and celerons not so much.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

You cant OC kaveri enough to even remotely get near a Haswell i3. Not to mention extra cost with a better heatsink.

Not to mention the power consumption. Kaveri is simply horrible on the CPU side. And its extremely bad in performance/$ and performance/watt aswell on the CPU side.

That is crap.

An A10-7850K can smack around a haswell i3 in many tasks... Sure, the Haswells will probably always be faster at games especially under Windows.... But the unlocked A10's can pretty much stomp on an i3 under most anything that is multithreaded (especially when the software isn't stacked against it). Most of these benchmarks you take as gospel are usually compiled for Intel architecture (which artificially penalizes the AMD chips) under Windows -- plus, Windows is an OS that sucks at properly scheduling on AMD architecture (well documented).

Here's a fun way to prove it: Go ahead and download World Community Grid and run it under Windows 7 64 bit and Ubuntu 64 bit on an AMD chip. Now run the benchmarks. Notice how integer performance damn near DOUBLES under Ubuntu (versus Windows) and Floating Point Performance jumps around 30-40%. Running the same app on the same AMD chip at the same clock speed -- but switching to an OS that isn't a cobbled together mess like Windows.

I buy both Intel and AMD. Nobody can usually touch the bang for the buck AMD provides. Nobody can usually touch the performance per watt of the Intel chips. A dual core i3 isn't nearly as snappy at video editing as a quad core A10. Plus, you can't run DDR3 on an i3 anywhere near as fast as an A10. Not to mention that the AMD A10 has the best damn integrated graphics ever designed for those who don't want to buy a dedicated video card.

I've got a Haswell i7 and an AMD FX-8320 which I "race" against each other on the World Community Grid. The Haswell is faster and uses less power, but it also cost triple the price of the FX chip. The FX is way closer to the Haswell than it ever should be when it comes to scientific computing (especially considering how old Vishera is now). The Intel fanboy stuff is just dumb. Both AMD and Intel make excellent and incredibly reliable products.... A purchase decision is really dependant on the intended usage for the respective chip.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

If he uses more casual tasks, ok.
Not if he uses CPU-intensive tasks.

Anyway, i3 is a good choice. Pentiuns and celerons not so much.

Well, right now I'd probably take the unlocked Pentium G3258 over any locked i3 -- especially if the desktop is used for gaming. Some guys are overclocking them close to 5 Ghz on water cooling. That is pretty amazing performance for a $75 chip.

 

[TeknoBug]

AMD seems to be pushing the newer CPUs onto the mobile department moreso than desktop.

If he uses more casual tasks, ok.
Not if he uses CPU-intensive tasks.

Anyway, i3 is a good choice. Pentiuns and celerons not so much.

Some of the newer Pentiums and Celerons are actually quite good.

 

[kawi6rr]

Kaveri offers nothing on the CPU side. You could just aswell use Richland. And Intel is far, far ahead with cheaper CPUs that uses less power.

Dude! We get it you hate AMD, everyone on this forum gets it. Kevari is a good solution for what you might need.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Ugh, thread necro!

To address the OP's original question, there is now a "CPU only" Kaveri out (or out soon): It's called the Athlon II x4 860K, and it features 4 Steamroller cores. Sadly, it only has 512k of L2 cache per core (unlike 1MB of L2 per core the 7850K, 7800, 7700K, and 7600).

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Dude! We get it you hate AMD, everyone on this forum gets it. Kevari is a good solution for what you might need.

No doubt -- his bias is clearly evident.

Anyone who has tinkered with ALL of the hardware realizes how silly it is. I run Nvidia and AMD video cards.... Intel, AMD.... heck I've even got 1 pc powered by a VIA cpu. All of these chips shine at certain tasks and fall short in others. There is no "one size fits all" chip that does everything perfectly.

He is clearly an AMD hater.... But the fact is: AMD powers all the current generation game consoles -- so a ton of games ported to PC will finally be optimized for AMD architecture (for the first time). So AMD CPU's and GPU's will likely grow more and more impressive moving forward in game benchmarks thanks to these game console wins. I'm also confident Intel will continue to provide a wonderful user experience as well.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Ugh, thread necro!

To address the OP's original question, there is now a "CPU only" Kaveri out (or out soon): It's called the Athlon II x4 860K, and it features 4 Steamroller cores. Sadly, it only has 512k of L2 cache per core (unlike 1MB of L2 per core the 7850K, 7800, 7700K, and 7600).

Exactly, I figured the new Kaveri releases were worth a bump. I do find the 512k cache odd -- I guess it was done to increase yields. I'm curious how the 860K stacks up against the existing Athlons.

I wonder how much Kaveri Athlons can overclock.... Even with the die shrink, I've had better results previously overclocking AMD's 32 nm stuff compared to the newer 28. I'd love to see benchmarks of the X4 860K vs the G3258. That 20th Anniversary Pentium can put up some incredible gaming numbers for a dual core.

 

[DrMrLordX]

There is speculation that the 860K comes from a different wafer, and may potentially even be Carizzo-based, or something entirely different. It will not suffer the CPU throttle during iGPU load that mars the reputation of Kaveri, but will it top out at 4.5 ghz with 0 actual gains at higher clockspeeds (at least on air or water)? Unknown. We'll find out soon enough. Someone, somewhere is going to push an 860k past 4.5 ghz just to see what happens.

 

[cbn]

I wonder how much Kaveri Athlons can overclock.... Even with the die shrink, I've had better results previously overclocking AMD's 32 nm stuff compared to the newer 28.

That has been my general impression as well. Kaveri has better IPC, but doesn't clock as well as Richland. (Apparently 28nm bulk is slower than 32nm SOI at this point)

 

[cbn]

I'd love to see benchmarks of the X4 860K vs the G3258. That 20th Anniversary Pentium can put up some incredible gaming numbers for a dual core.

I do too!!

What I will be looking for the most though is a stock cooler comparison.

.....With a Non-Z motherboard for the Pentium G3258 (this will limit the RAM speed for G3258 to 1333 MHz, which I wonder how much effect there could be if only single channel RAM ( ie one 4GB stick) is used)

Then smaller than usual discrete video cards for both of them (R7 260X, etc will fine) tested at lower resolution and detail settings. This, not to make GPU the bottleneck, but rather to examine whether or not frame time variances still exist between dual core and quad core on specific multi-thread intensive games.

Basically a real world (typical end-user set-up) bargain parts shootout.

 

[frozentundra123456]

That is crap.

An A10-7850K can smack around a haswell i3 in many tasks... Sure, the Haswells will probably always be faster at games especially under Windows.... But the unlocked A10's can pretty much stomp on an i3 under most anything that is multithreaded (especially when the software isn't stacked against it). Most of these benchmarks you take as gospel are usually compiled for Intel architecture (which artificially penalizes the AMD chips) under Windows -- plus, Windows is an OS that sucks at properly scheduling on AMD architecture (well documented).

Here's a fun way to prove it: Go ahead and download World Community Grid and run it under Windows 7 64 bit and Ubuntu 64 bit on an AMD chip. Now run the benchmarks. Notice how integer performance damn near DOUBLES under Ubuntu (versus Windows) and Floating Point Performance jumps around 30-40%. Running the same app on the same AMD chip at the same clock speed -- but switching to an OS that isn't a cobbled together mess like Windows.

I buy both Intel and AMD. Nobody can usually touch the bang for the buck AMD provides. Nobody can usually touch the performance per watt of the Intel chips. A dual core i3 isn't nearly as snappy at video editing as a quad core A10. Plus, you can't run DDR3 on an i3 anywhere near as fast as an A10. Not to mention that the AMD A10 has the best damn integrated graphics ever designed for those who don't want to buy a dedicated video card.

I've got a Haswell i7 and an AMD FX-8320 which I "race" against each other on the World Community Grid. The Haswell is faster and uses less power, but it also cost triple the price of the FX chip. The FX is way closer to the Haswell than it ever should be when it comes to scientific computing (especially considering how old Vishera is now). The Intel fanboy stuff is just dumb. Both AMD and Intel make excellent and incredibly reliable products.... A purchase decision is really dependant on the intended usage for the respective chip.

Seriously? Of 35 cpu tests in Anand's bench, a haswell i3 wins 27 and the 7850k wins 8, and I believe a couple of those were gpu accelerated. Of course, I suppose if one doesnt like those results, they can claim the tests are biased and ignore them if it fits his agenda.

I will not argue that in any benchmark that uses the igp, Kaveri will win, but it is beyond ludicrous to say that it "smacks around" an i3 in cpu tasks. Not to mention that at its current price, Kaveri actually competes more closely to a low end i5, which will humiliate it even further in cpu benchmarks.